Stats - fairways, GIR, up & down - what's good?

[Orikoru]

Been using Hole19 for years but haven't always paid attention to the stats. Now I'm actually looking at them, for my home course since I obviously have the most data for that. I don't really know what a good number is though or what I should aspire to, as a 16-17 handicapper.

Fairways hit %
I've only put this in for the last five rounds as I always used to forget to input it for certain holes. In those five the high was 66.7, the low was 20, and the other three were all between 45-55. I'm thinking over 50% is decent? Maybe I should be aiming to get over 60?

Greens in regulation %
This is something it calculates itself so I have just jotted down the numbers since the start of this year. Jan-Mar I was playing poorly and got 16.7% three times. Post-lockdown there's been more variety, as low as 11.1, a high of 40 and a few in between. This is one where I really don't know what a good number is for someone at my level.

Up & down %
Again, have numbers back to the start of the year for this. The low was 7.1 back in January. My last round I played well and got 36 points but my up & down says only 10%! Better numbers I've achieved lately were 57.1 and 60. So a huge variance on this. Most commonly I've been in the 40s on this, so 40-45 is about the 'mode' if you like. I think I'd like to get this over 50% really.

I could put number of putts in but I haven't bothered because these are all Stableford rounds so whenever you have a blob that lessens the number of putts making it not really a worthwhile stat since it's a whole number rather than a percentage.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Been using Hole19 for years but haven't always paid attention to the stats. Now I'm actually looking at them, for my home course since I obviously have the most data for that. I don't really know what a good number is though or what I should aspire to, as a 16-17 handicapper.

Fairways hit %
I've only put this in for the last five rounds as I always used to forget to input it for certain holes. In those five the high was 66.7, the low was 20, and the other three were all between 45-55. I'm thinking over 50% is decent? Maybe I should be aiming to get over 60?

Greens in regulation %
This is something it calculates itself so I have just jotted down the numbers since the start of this year. Jan-Mar I was playing poorly and got 16.7% three times. Post-lockdown there's been more variety, as low as 11.1, a high of 40 and a few in between. This is one where I really don't know what a good number is for someone at my level.

Up & down %
Again, have numbers back to the start of the year for this. The low was 7.1 back in January. My last round I played well and got 36 points but my up & down says only 10%! Better numbers I've achieved lately were 57.1 and 60. So a huge variance on this. Most commonly I've been in the 40s on this, so 40-45 is about the 'mode' if you like. I think I'd like to get this over 50% really.

I could put number of putts in but I haven't bothered because these are all Stableford rounds so whenever you have a blob that lessens the number of putts making it not really a worthwhile stat since it's a whole number rather than a percentage.

Arccos give the following on their site:

PGA Averages:
FiR - 60%
GiR - 66%
Up & Down - 60%

No sure how up to date their data is.

 

[Orikoru]

Arccos give the following on their site:

PGA Averages:
FiR - 60%
GiR - 66%
Up & Down - 60%

No sure how up to date their data is.

Ok, food for thought. On the one hand you could say it's silly for me to have expectations that line up with those, but on the other hand they are hitting their drives a lot faster and further than I am, so for something like fairways it might still not be unreasonable for me to aim for 60? See again, I don't really know.

Obviously for GIR if they're only hitting 66 then that makes me feel better about some of my numbers. Maybe 35% is an ok figure to aim for for me? So like, over a third.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Ok, food for thought. On the one hand you could say it's silly for me to have expectations that line up with those, but on the other hand they are hitting their drives a lot faster and further than I am, so for something like fairways it might still not be unreasonable for me to aim for 60? See again, I don't really know.

Obviously for GIR if they're only hitting 66 then that makes me feel better about some of my numbers. Maybe 35% is an ok figure to aim for for me? So like, over a third.

As you say that’s a guide, I don’t get too hung up on any particular stat, I prefer to use them to identify areas of weekness, when I first used Game Golf I had a low GiR, but on looking at those stats it showed I was more often than not short of the green rather than left or right, that was improved by taking an extra club, GiR improved which then led to better putting etc.

 

[Imurg]

I've had a love/hate relationship with stats for a while now.
Many people don't dig deep enough into them for them to be relevant. Why do you miss greens? Is it because your iron play isnt accurate enough or is it that your driving doesnt put you in a position to hit the green..?
Fairways hit - a ball 2 inches off the fairway on one side could be better than being in the middle of the fairway depending on the hole and pin position.
You could, literally, be 2 inches on the fairway of a 400 yard hole and still have 300 to go...
GiR is ok..speaks for itself. Make more GiR and your putting stats will go up.
Miss more greens and your up and down stat goes up.
Distances - all the stat gathering apps and units rely on GPS from one position to another.
All you're measuring is total distance - carry and roll. Roll can be next to nothing or it can be 60+ yards depending on conditions. On my course you can get 80 to 100 yards on some holes.
In my opinion, unless you're going to dive deep into the numbers, stats distract from the game.

 

[Orikoru]

As you say that’s a guide, I don’t get too hung up on any particular stat, I prefer to use them to identify areas of weekness, when I first used Game Golf I had a low GiR, but on looking at those stats it showed I was more often than not short of the green rather than left or right, that was improved by taking an extra club, GiR improved which then led to better putting etc.

I know what you mean. I suppose the only way for me to improve GIR is to improve at hitting the ball isn't it? Up & down is one I did really want to improve upon this year though.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

At our level I believe it’s better to concentrate on one particular area at a time, ie, 60% on one area with the other 40% shared on the rest so none are neglected.
Trying to improve all at once can, imo, get very confusing.

 

[Orikoru]

I've had a love/hate relationship with stats for a while now.
Many people don't dig deep enough into them for them to be relevant. Why do you miss greens? Is it because your iron play isnt accurate enough or is it that your driving doesnt put you in a position to hit the green..?
Fairways hit - a ball 2 inches off the fairway on one side could be better than being in the middle of the fairway depending on the hole and pin position.
You could, literally, be 2 inches on the fairway of a 400 yard hole and still have 300 to go...
GiR is ok..speaks for itself. Make more GiR and your putting stats will go up.
Miss more greens and your up and down stat goes up.
Distances - all the stat gathering apps and units rely on GPS from one position to another.
All you're measuring is total distance - carry and roll. Roll can be next to nothing or it can be 60+ yards depending on conditions. On my course you can get 80 to 100 yards on some holes.
In my opinion, unless you're going to dive deep into the numbers, stats distract from the game.

That is a great point. Now that you've said that, I look again at my numbers, and when the fairway number is lower, the greens in regulation number is also lower. So there's correlation there. Very clear correlation actually, albeit over only five rounds.

Fairway 50.0 20.0 66.7 45.5 54.5
GIR ___ 38.9 11.1 40.0 22.2 33.3

 

[Deleted member 3432]

Prac

That is a great point. Now that you've said that, I look again at my numbers, and when the fairway number is lower, the greens in regulation number is also lower. So there's correlation there. Very clear correlation actually, albeit over only five rounds.

Fairway 50.0 20.0 66.7 45.5 54.5
GIR ___ 38.9 11.1 40.0 22.2 33.3

Practice your chipping and putting looking at them stats

 

[Grant85]

Also been tracking stats as had the chance to play a lot more complete rounds post lockdown.

Fairways hit 49% (not bad, but pretty wide course)
GIR 31.94%
Pars 29%
Scoring average 86.5 (not bad for 18 handicap, couple of 82s and an 84 in there)

Reasonably happy with them.

Now for the bad ones;
up and down 14.29%
Sand saves 0%

Putting
37.39 putts per round
2.24 putts per GIR
2.00 putts per Missed GIR
18.75% of greens are being 3 putted

I think at the start I was counting being on the fringe and using my putter as a GIR, but have stopped that now. So I guess GIRs will reduce as will putting average. But scoring average won't unless I actually chip and putt better!

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

How close to the green do you have to be for the 'up and down' stat?

 

[Grant85]

How close to the green do you have to be for the 'up and down' stat?

a single putt for par or worse will count as an up and down.

That is in my tracking (which is via Golf shake).

But others trackers will have different ways of working out.

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

a single putt for par or worse will count as an up and down.

That is in my tracking (which is via Golf shake).

But others trackers will have different ways of working out.

OK thanks. So you could drive into a fairway bunker, splash out and nail an iron from 200 yards to a foot then hole the putt. Slightly different to missing a green and chipping close from the edge. One of the reasons I'm not a big fan of recording stats.
I know from experience if I'm missing fairways, greens etc and know what I need to work on.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Not really that interested the stats for my golf. Maybe I should pay more attention and I might spot where I mostly fall down. But I don't need detailed stats to know that I do not convert my high % of Fairways hit off the tee into GIR. And I know that I then don't convert enough NGIRs into pars. Make decent inroads into sorting out these failings and I'd knock (I am guessing) 2-3 shots off my scoring.

 

[Grant85]

OK thanks. So you could drive into a fairway bunker, splash out and nail an iron from 200 yards to a foot then hole the putt. Slightly different to missing a green and chipping close from the edge. One of the reasons I'm not a big fan of recording stats.
I know from experience if I'm missing fairways, greens etc and know what I need to work on.

Absolutely, it's a limitation of the stats. Unless you're going to track every shot with buttons in the end of your club, or a fairly detailed app - then these are the limitations you'll get.

And the example of getting up and down from 200 yards for par is going to count on tour as a) a missed green and b) an up & down.

But important thing is to try and notice a trend in your own play and how to improve from that.

Having started recording only in the past few weeks, I think it definitely focuses the mind on what to work on. It's all very well saying you know if you're missing fairways and greens, or your putting is costing you shots etc. but having the stats in front of you from 8 or 10 rounds is far more powerful.

As an example, my sand saves at 0%.
Now I don't think of myself as a bad bunker player, in that I can splash out fairly effectively from most greenside bunkers and almost never leave it in (unless it's really awkward) - but the stats show I'm never getting up and down. So I can do a bit of extra analysis in terms of, am I just playing the same shot every time, and carrying it far enough to clear the lip? Or am I playing away from the flag to the wide part of the green etc. Things I'd never have thought of without the stats and would have carried on believing I'm a decent bunker player.

 

[Grant85]

Not really that interested the stats for my golf. Maybe I should pay more attention and I might spot where I mostly fall down. But I don't need detailed stats to know that I do not convert my high % of Fairways hit off the tee into GIR. And I know that I then don't convert enough NGIRs into pars. Make decent inroads into sorting out these failings and I'd knock (I am guessing) 2-3 shots off my scoring.

of course - but you don't know what you don't know.

Very likely some decent analysis from half a dozen rounds will give you something else that could be an easy win for a shot every round or two.

 

[Deleted member 21258]

When I work out my figures after a game(sorry don't keep a running figures). Fairways hit happy at 50%(but not really interested in this, provided I am on fairway or semi rough).

I focus mainly on :-

Near to GIR (rather than GIR), so within say 10-15 yards or on a green. And would look for that to be 14-16 out of the 18 on good games. The higher this figure, the better my scoring normally.

Up/down percentage from nGIR and near 50% is pretty good for me.

Count, 3 putts and probably have 1-3 a round on average(most from 15-20 foot plus). Very good games none.

 

[patricks148]

personally i don't bother with stats, but surely you must know if you are missing fairways or greens on a reg basis without stats?

 

[fundy]

Abraham Ancer hit 82% of fairways and 90% of greens in regulation over 4 days this week, theres a target for you

 

[Orikoru]

How close to the green do you have to be for the 'up and down' stat?

In Hole19 they calculate it automatically, and I think it basically counts any 1 putt hole as an up and down if it was a par or worse.