Monty_Brown
Tour Rookie
I meant to ask, do you lose distance with S&T compared to a conventional weight shift swing? Not an issue, i'm just curious as the weight shift has always been sold to me as a way of adding power.
Stack and tilt: let's have a heated debate
- Thread starter Monty_Brown
- Start date
JustOne
Ryder Cup Winner
I've never witnessed anyone hit it less far with S&T, the opposite would be more true. The weight shift is still there with S&T... it just doesn't require a 'run up' 
ADB
Journeyman Pro
Judging by your drive on the 18th @ Blackmoor J - there is no loss of length!
Doh
Journeyman Pro
I have the book and the DVD's and like Murph i have incorperated some of the patterns and would love to have a lesson from a S&T teacher. There is lots of information on the Sand Trap Forum if the mods dont mind me telling you about another forum.
lobthewedge
Challenge Tour Pro
In David Leadbetters book on 'The Fundamentals of Hogan' he describes his reverse pivot and how he hung on his left side. Is this S&T by another name?
JustOne
Ryder Cup Winner
You can't reverse pivot if your weight is going FORWARD.
FWIW If Hogan reverse pivotted then good for him... he did alright apparently.
Mattyboy
Tour Rookie
It's pretty common to do that, in fact it's also pretty radical to do that. All 'conventional' teaching would have you load up your right side. Consider yourself a rebel!
For me its just too easy to sway back - then I hit the ball everywhere (surprise surprise!). It also helps getting back to the ball without a slide (as you do not have to shift your weight to get back to the ball).
Seems to fix my problems, but its very much work in progress..........
Doh
Journeyman Pro
Have a look at this www.youtube.com/user/dazhwood
wull
Tour Rookie
i have never tried it and unless my game takes a turn for the worst i won't be either.my friend has introduced it into his game and is practising it over the upcoming winter months...good luck to him and if it works then great.
if it works then it's the same as everything else.....well done but if not then there's other fundamentals you can incorporate into your game and work on them instead.each to their own as they say!!!
if it works then it's the same as everything else.....well done but if not then there's other fundamentals you can incorporate into your game and work on them instead.each to their own as they say!!!
big_russ
Challenge Tour Pro
This is my club pro and coach and he is only one of a handful of registered S&T instructors in this country. He is a top bloke and a great coach and knows his stuff.
Its all well and good buying the book and trying to self teach but you need a good coach behind you ensuring you are putting yourself in the correct positions as it can be very easy to over do things and then loose faith in what you are doing.
I've just watched the first 2 blogs and the stance/set up and backswing are the way I swing but have been told they are faults, maybe theres something in this for me as the takeaway in S&T is certainly far more natural to do than the way I've been taught for years, time to do some more research
SGC001
Challenge Tour Pro
According to Jorgensen the weight shift contributes just under 9% of clubhead speed at impact.
I see from the link to the pro that he's a stack and tilt guy (and it had to come down and then got put back up again with what reads like approval) and it's not easy to find too much info about it. For those who use stack and tilt does that some up the main points pretty accurately?
JustOne
Ryder Cup Winner
Yes... however there's a lot to take in if you want to understand what is being said rather than just listen. I think the videos make the swing seem more complicated/radical than it really is as it is having to try to explain the principles and concepts (the whats and whys).
does this guys swing really look that radical? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05zoiVCmRaw is he standing on one leg and folding his body in half whilst twisting himself out of his shoes?
The BASIC NO1 concept of golf is to hit the ball properly, doing moves that make it harder to hit the ball properly clearly makes the game more difficult.
In this video (at approx 6mins) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Jr1hUhILyM&feature=channel_video_title he talks about swinging 'up and down the line' and you can clearly see how players need to drop the club backwards to approach the ball from the inside.... this move alone is going to lead to hitting the ground too far behind the ball (fat and thin shots). Flat shoulders and high hands put the player in an awkward position that 99% of all golfers have trouble recovering from (hence only a few people ever master the technique) combine that with then getting the weight from the back foot onto the front and 'releasing' the club on the way down and you've got a recipe for inconsistent striking. Once you accept that it's better to put yourself in a GOOD position to hit the ball then you have to accept that stack and tilt is not only a viable swing pattern but also common sense.
Following the video is certainly (in my opinion) something that every golfer should look into, the pros have, and several are now cropping up who teach the swing. Of course those GM forumites that have already mastered the game in it's more difficult form and know better than anyone else need not apply.... and best of luck on the Tour
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Mattyboy
Tour Rookie
A question for you JustOne: Why is it that the S&T follow through appears curtailed?
Thanks
Matt
Thanks
Matt
SGC001
Challenge Tour Pro
Thanks for the reply, it's the what's and why's I'm interested in; I was curious how the stack and tilit system worked. I'm not interested in a heated debate on it, just trying to understand it.
I can't watch the videos untl later, I've seen the 5 blogs posted and am fairly certain that the 2nd link would to be one of those blogs or certainly could have been considering the content.
I can't watch the videos untl later, I've seen the 5 blogs posted and am fairly certain that the 2nd link would to be one of those blogs or certainly could have been considering the content.
Robobum
Money List Winner
I think Justone is having the debate with himself and presenting both sides of any argument....
JustOne
Ryder Cup Winner
D
Deleted member 1418
Guest
My 3 year old son has perfected stack and tilt with his building blocks.
JustOne
Ryder Cup Winner
JustOne
Ryder Cup Winner
That's a good question.
In 'basic terms' the arms swing down the line for longer (fully extending and releasing) thereby pulling the arms away from the chest (away and up) thus allowing you to slow down and control the throughswing better, without twisting your spine or needing to strangle yourself with the shaft.
The 'more involved' answer would involve directional forces and parametric acceleration
