Socialism ?

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

If me and my buddy do the same job and get paid the same top line, but I am PAYE and he is self-employed/contracted (in some form) - I am not sure that his responsibilities towards contributing to the wider UK good are any less than mine; we both should be contributing according to our means - and our means are equal. But as he has an accountant that can reduce his income tax so his actual contribution is less. How it is.

Yes - no paid sickness, holiday etc. downsides, but in most spheres of work I suggest that not that many are forced to be self-employed. Self-employment/contracting is a choice where the individual balances flexibility of work and choice to not be working (and usually a higher daily income rate) against what fixed employment provides. But it is an individual choice, and it is perhaps not unreasonable to consider that your responsibilities toward the wider society should not be impacted by that choice.

Nice idea (perhaps) - however minimising your contribution to the wider pot as a means of protecting what is 'yours' is so entrenched in very many that changes are most likely very unlikely.

 

[GreiginFife]

Deleted reply to prevent infraction.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Deleted reply to prevent infraction.

If the deleted reply was to my post then I only made the point as this is perceived by many paying income task (or not as earning too little) as an inequality and source of anger and irritation (see previous posts by others on here) - and for some of the poorer of society as a justification for them to try and play the system. That 'playing the system' is legal for some, does not I suspect, go down that well for the many who consider the system to play against them. And so they look to bend and break the rules of the system. Simply an aspect of the perceived fairness and unfairness in the system we live in.

 

[IanM]

Of course, when it goes horribly wrong, it ceases to be called socialism.

Fairness is a myth... especially when multi-millionaires tell me they are socialists

 

[harpo_72]

If me and my buddy do the same job and get paid the same top line, but I am PAYE and he is self-employed/contracted (in some form) - I am not sure that his responsibilities towards contributing to the wider UK good are any less than mine; we both should be contributing according to our means - and our means are equal. But as he has an accountant that can reduce his income tax so his actual contribution is less. How it is.

Yes - no paid sickness, holiday etc. downsides, but in most spheres of work I suggest that not that many are forced to be self-employed. Self-employment/contracting is a choice where the individual balances flexibility of work and choice to not be working (and usually a higher daily income rate) against what fixed employment provides. But it is an individual choice, and it is perhaps not unreasonable to consider that your responsibilities toward the wider society should not be impacted by that choice.

Nice idea (perhaps) - however minimising your contribution to the wider pot as a means of protecting what is 'yours' is so entrenched in very many that changes are most likely very unlikely.

I don’t actually think it is less, or if it is it isn’t significant. Perhaps the opportunity to spend and claim back as something that’s tax deductible.. but they really are few and far between, and draw a lot of attention that should have been focused on Amazon

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I don’t actually think it is less, or if it is it isn’t significant. Perhaps the opportunity to spend and claim back as something that’s tax deductible.. but they really are few and far between, and draw a lot of attention that should have been focused on Amazon

And there's the rub - as there is perception that many of the self-employed 'play the system' to pay less income tax - whether true or not. And even if true the amounts will indeed be insignificant when compared to what is lost to the public purse by the way such as the tech giants play the system. But perception is important in many such matters.

 

[Hobbit]

And there's the rub - as there is perception that many of the self-employed 'play the system' to pay less income tax - whether true or not. And even if true the amounts will indeed be insignificant when compared to what is lost to the public purse by the way such as the tech giants play the system. But perception is important in many such matters.

I'm in the go after the Amazons AND the one man band. If you think about it in terms of one Amazon not paying £10,000,000 and 50,000 self employed not paying £200 = £10,000,000. Yes, a simplistic calculation but you get the drift.

 

[harpo_72]

I'm in the go after the Amazons AND the one man band. If you think about it in terms of one Amazon not paying £10,000,000 and 50,000 self employed not paying £200 = £10,000,000. Yes, a simplistic calculation but you get the drift.

I think realistically we are all after the mickey takers and some are unwittingly doing it and others are making the choice to do it.
It’s those that choose to avoid tax and those that give advice on how to avoid tax that is illegal that should be pursued.
But in essence, if we all adhered strictly to the rules of engagement then the contribution and benefits level is very similar.

 

[SocketRocket]

I think realistically we are all after the mickey takers and some are unwittingly doing it and others are making the choice to do it.
It’s those that choose to avoid tax and those that give advice on how to avoid tax that is illegal that should be pursued.
But in essence, if we all adhered strictly to the rules of engagement then the contribution and benefits level is very similar.

Evasion not avoidance.