Post Office - Horizon scandal

[Mudball]

Fair play by Bates on not going after CEO's CBE but rather put the spotlight on the CBE process. How was the CBE awarded when this was going on and well know.

https://x.com/viewmagazine/status/1744500884610945209?s=20

 

[Mudball]

This is the story of Seema Misra....

Seema Misra who is married to Davinder, took over the Post Office in West Byfleet, Surrey, in 2005. She noticed the Horizon computer system showed a shortfall of £80 on her first day of training

The trainer told her the accounts were never exact. She didn’t understand why they wouldn’t tally, especially when it happened again the next day, but the trainer shrugged it off and her books repeatedly failed to tally with her takings. She started suspecting everybody and even sold her jewellery to pay back the shortfall.

In 2010, she was eight weeks pregnant with her second child when she was sentenced to 15 months behind bars, after being wrongly accused of stealing £74,000 from the Post Office.
She said, " Being pregnant in prison was horrendous" "It was unclean, I felt I had limited antenatal care, and I was constantly terrified someone would attack me. I'd convince myself someone was going to stab me and kill my baby. I'd gone from being a pillar of the community to a thief stealing money from old people

Her husband Davinder was attacked after her picture appeared in the paper. He also had to endure the heartbreak of being shunned by their friends, all while looking after their 10 year old son Aditya. Seema's conviction was only quashed in 2021.

In May 2023, an email from senior Post Office lawyer, Jarnail Singh was exposed during the public inquiry. This email showed him celebrating Seema's conviction to a series of executives. The inquiry heard that in 2013 Jarnail Singh sent another internal email referring to the ‘passing bandwagon’ of Horizon challenges and predicting that ‘when we get a few wins under our belt the Horizon challenges will melt away like the midnight snow’.

In an email, jarnail Singh wrote:

Dear All,

After a lengthy trial at Guildford Crown Court the above named was found Guilty of theft. This case turned from a relatively straightforward general deficiency case to an unprecedented attack on the Horizon system. We were best with unparallel degree of disclosure requests by the Defence. Through the hard work of everyone, counsel Warwick Tatford, investigation officer Jon Longman and through the considerable expertise of Gareth Jenkins of Fujitsu, we were able to destroy to the criminal standard of proof every single suggestion made by the defence.

It is hope the case will set a marker to dissuade other Defendants from jumping on the Horizon bashing bandwagon.

Shocking... There are more examples here > https://x.com/flaminhaystacks/status/1742117708777332742?s=20

 

[Bunkermagnet]

For me now, all trust in the PO has gone. And that’s all aspects of the PO.

 

[road2ruin]

Shocking... There are more examples here > https://x.com/flaminhaystacks/status/1742117708777332742?s=20

It's horrendous. There are people covering up not just a system that resulted in financial irregularities it actually resulted, directly, in the deaths of some people. And then you have examples such as this where postmasters actually asked for help and flagged the money that they were apparently stealing.....

Lee Castleton bought a post office in Bridlington, east Yorkshire, in 2003. Within a year, his computer system showed a £25,000 shortfall He called the Post Office’s helpline 91 times as he suspected the Horizon IT system was at fault.

Helen Rose audited him and made notes at the time to say how happy he was to see the auditors and that he'd been calling them 91 times. Instead of helping him, he was taken to court by the Post Office, where he had to represent himself as he could not afford a lawyer.

Helen Rose then wrote a witness statement which omitted how happy he was to see them and how many times he'd called And Instead she wrote how he went to lunch and came back smelling of alcohol Something never mentioned originally.

Lee Castleton was ordered to repay the money and pay costs of £321,000, which bankrupted him. He was forced to close his shop and sell his house while his wife suffered stress-induced seizures and his children had to move schools because of bullying.

Calling 91 times to make people aware of the issues yet ends up taking the fall for it?! I can't imagine a single circumstance where someone fraudulently stealing money from an organisation would call a helpline on so many occasions asking to get caught. And yet he's not alone, numerous people contacted the helpline to say that they were having problems yet they're all guilty of fraud!!

 

[Robster59]

The headlines are now saying they are looking for faster justice for the victims (20 years too late), but how fast will they be in identifying the true criminals in this case. Those who hid the truth, perjured themselves, sought unlawful prosecutions and effectively lied to protect themselves and the reputation of the Post Office and Fujitsu?

 

[Robster59]

The BBC Panorama article on the scandal.
Panorama - The Post Office Scandal
Funny the government didn't make a mad rush to solve it then.
Not sure why it had to take a four part drama to do it. I guess the latter was watched more and with dramatisation and closer examination of the individuals heightened public awareness.

 

[Mudball]

For me now, all trust in the PO has gone. And that’s all aspects of the PO.

i wonder how much of this translates to poor behaviour with posties doing their job. Very few realise that PO and Royal Mail are different cos. My postie is lovely

 

[Neilds]

Vennells is handing back her CBE, BBC just announced

 

[road2ruin]

Vennells is handing back her CBE, BBC just announced

Now just need answers as to who was behind the decision to award it to her in the first place.

 

[Tashyboy]

Vennells is handing back her CBE, BBC just announced

Hope she don’t send it back via a post office. She may get assaulted.

 

[Voyager EMH]

In a statement, Ms Vennells said: "I continue to support and focus on co-operating with the Inquiry and expect to be giving evidence in the coming months.

I have so far maintained my silence as I considered it inappropriate to comment publicly while the Inquiry remains ongoing and before I have provided my oral evidence.

I am, however, aware of the calls from subpostmasters and others to return my CBE.

I have listened and I confirm that I return my CBE with immediate effect.

I am truly sorry for the devastation caused to the sub-postmasters and their families, whose lives were torn apart by being wrongly accused and wrongly prosecuted as a result of the Horizon system.

"I now intend to continue to focus on assisting the Inquiry and will not make any further public comment until it has concluded."

 

[D-S]

In a statement, Ms Vennells said: "I continue to support and focus on co-operating with the Inquiry and expect to be giving evidence in the coming months.

I have so far maintained my silence as I considered it inappropriate to comment publicly while the Inquiry remains ongoing and before I have provided my oral evidence.

I am, however, aware of the calls from subpostmasters and others to return my CBE.

I have listened and I confirm that I return my CBE with immediate effect.

I am truly sorry for the devastation caused to the sub-postmasters and their families, whose lives were torn apart by being wrongly accused and wrongly prosecuted as a result of the Horizon system.

"I now intend to continue to focus on assisting the Inquiry and will not make any further public comment until it has concluded."

Staggering that she has been so deaf to the protestations and ‘devastation’ for all these years, but one tv programme in a quiet news cycle has suddenly made her question her acceptance of an honour.

 

[bobmac]

She's handed back her CBE...so what.
How does that help anyone?

 

[Golfmmad]

She's handed back her CBE...so what.
How does that help anyone?

Exactly! It would have been better had the award been taken from her rather than giving it back herself.
Still she does not give "Karma" to all the sub postmasters whose lives have been ruined. Not to mention the poor suicide victims.

 

[patricks148]

Vennells is handing back her CBE, BBC just announced

though thats nice, she was the Boss and should take full responsibility and face criminal charges. Top Bosses always appear to get the benefits from the top jobs, massive salary's and pay off but how often does one take any responsibility?

 

[Robster59]

She's handed back her CBE...so what.
How does that help anyone?

I guessed she would do and I would guess more from a selfish viewpoint. She has probably been advised that it looks better giving up the CBE rather than having it taken off her. The likelihood is that she was going to lose it anyway.
It makes no difference to the enquiry, nor should it make any difference to the way she is being investigated for her part in the overall scandal.

 

[clubchamp98]

She's handed back her CBE...so what.
How does that help anyone?

It shows how bent the honours system is!
It should put pressure on the idiot who gave it to her.

Its also in my opinion an iota of acceptance of some of the blame.

 

[bobmac]

It shows how bent the honours system is!
It should put pressure on the idiot who gave it to her.

Its also in my opinion an iota of acceptance of some of the blame.

So the petition was successful.
It's a shame the petition wasn't about helping compensate the people who did nothing wrong.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

So the petition was successful.
It's a shame the petition wasn't about helping compensate the people who did nothing wrong.

That’s not up to a petition - that will be up to an enquiry to sort out

 

[Mudball]

It shows how bent the honours system is!
It should put pressure on the idiot who gave it to her.

Its also in my opinion an iota of acceptance of some of the blame.

They should take her CBE and give it to Mr Bates.... that would be a good one for Sunak to talk about during his election campaign..

.. however the system feels so bent that she may have done a deal to become a Lord... i wont hold my breath