Matchplay and most likely score for handicap

[Alan Clifford]

Matchplay and most likely score for handicap. How would this go down in England: https://mailchi.mp/642a547d8ab8/may-handicap-news-12613700?e=f2e7be14ee

 

[D-S]

How would this go down in England

Badly.

 

[Imurg]

Badly.

Possibly not as well as that....

 

[sjw]

Is this satire?

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

An idea from a bunch of folk who don’t know too much about the nature of golf? You’ll gather I’d not be impressed.

 

[wjemather]

As we've seen (repeatedly) in these threads, it wouldn't be well received (especially by certain people).

There are a great many players in GB&I who remain attached to the notion that handicaps should only be based on individual stroke play competition scores. These same people are usually the first to complain about frequently seeing apparently unattainable exceptional scoring in match play and team formats, but they still steadfastly refuse to entertain the idea that these formats could contribute to the handicap calculation.

 

[BiMGuy]

As we've seen (repeatedly) in these threads, it wouldn't be well received (especially by certain people).

There are a great many players in GB&I who remain attached to the notion that handicaps should only be based on individual stroke play competition scores. These same people are usually the first to complain about frequently seeing apparently unattainable exceptional scoring in match play and team formats, but they still steadfastly refuse to entertain the idea that these formats could contribute to the handicap calculation.

I have suggested on here in the past that match play should be used in handicap calculations and been shot down for it.

 

[D-S]

As we've seen (repeatedly) in these threads, it wouldn't be well received (especially by certain people).

There are a great many players in GB&I who remain attached to the notion that handicaps should only be based on individual stroke play competition scores. These same people are usually the first to complain about frequently seeing apparently unattainable exceptional scoring in match play and team formats, but they still steadfastly refuse to entertain the idea that these formats could contribute to the handicap calculation.

Or maybe some of them have seen the effect ‘matchplay and team golf derived‘ handicaps have on the integrity of handicaps.

 

[HeftyHacker]

Or maybe some of them have seen the effect ‘matchplay and team golf derived‘ handicaps have on the integrity of handicaps.

Can you explain this one? Most people I see moaning about matchplay is because they've had to play someone off 18 who's been 3 over after 12 holes etc.

Surely including these scores would offer more integrity to the handicaps those who don't play a lot of strokeplay comps?

Not a dig BTW I'm genuinely interested in what affect it may have.

 

[D-S]

Can you explain this one? Most people I see moaning about matchplay is because they've had to play someone off 18 who's been 3 over after 12 holes etc.

Surely including these scores would offer more integrity to the handicaps those who don't play a lot of strokeplay comps?

Not a dig BTW I'm genuinely interested in what affect it may have.

It is the estimating nature of the strokes made that opens everyones’s handicap to manipulation.
This is the rule when you don’t hole out in matchplay or team play and as you can see it requires players to estimate the difficulty of the shot, the skill of the player and the distance from the hole. These factors mean that in reality you can post a score higher or lower than your your ability and can move your HI up or down with even greater ease.
In reality this ends up with many people with handicaps that are not genuine which questions the integrity of the system.
If you have played a lot in the states you will be aware of the scepticism of the handicaps of any golfer you don’t know, throwing many handicap tournaments into disrepute.

If the ball lies on the putting green, and is no more than 5 feet (1.5 metres) from the hole:	Add one additional stroke.
If the ball lies between 5 feet (1.5 metres) and 20 yards (20 metres) from the hole:	Add 2 or 3 additional strokes, depending on the position of the ball, the difficulty of the green and the ability of the player.
If the ball lies more than 20 yards (20 metres) from the hole:	Add 3 or 4 additional strokes, depending on the position of the ball, the difficulty of the green and the ability of the player.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

If I read it correctly the assumption is that it is more than likely that a player will hole out from 5ft or less. Really? I guess the argument is that it would be the same for everyone, but that seems to ignore the skill and temperament (mental strength) that is required to hole short putts - things that many golfers never develop and not very many almost master - as much as they can be mastered.

 

[Alan Clifford]

It is the estimating nature of the strokes made that opens everyones’s handicap to manipulation.
This is the rule when you don’t hole out in matchplay or team play and as you can see it requires players to estimate the difficulty of the shot, the skill of the player and the distance from the hole. These factors mean that in reality you can post a score higher or lower than your your ability and can move your HI up or down with even greater ease.
In reality this ends up with many people with handicaps that are not genuine which questions the integrity of the system.
If you have played a lot in the states you will be aware of the scepticism of the handicaps of any golfer you don’t know, throwing many handicap tournaments into disrepute.

If the ball lies on the putting green, and is no more than 5 feet (1.5 metres) from the hole:	Add one additional stroke.
If the ball lies between 5 feet (1.5 metres) and 20 yards (20 metres) from the hole:	Add 2 or 3 additional strokes, depending on the position of the ball, the difficulty of the green and the ability of the player.
If the ball lies more than 20 yards (20 metres) from the hole:	Add 3 or 4 additional strokes, depending on the position of the ball, the difficulty of the green and the ability of the player.

The only objection I have to your objection is that I play a lot of 9 hole rounds and the computer system estimates the number of strokes I would have made had I played another nine. Actually, I object to my objection and would prefer the American method of adding two nine hole rounds together. At least I would have played the holes.

 

[rulefan]

It is the estimating nature of the strokes made that opens everyones’s handicap to manipulation.

1 for 5', 2 or 3, 3 or 4.
Plenty of opportunity for vanity or banditry.

 

[D-S]

The only objection I have to your objection is that I play a lot of 9 hole rounds and the computer system estimates the number of strokes I would have made had I played another nine. Actually, I object to my objection and would prefer the American method of adding two nine hole rounds together. At least I would have played the holes.

Couldn't agree more - seems imminently sensible to me.

 

[Springveldt]

Matchplay and most likely score for handicap. How would this go down in England: https://mailchi.mp/642a547d8ab8/may-handicap-news-12613700?e=f2e7be14ee

Sounds horrific. Everyone getting a guaranteed one putt from 5 feet? 2 putt from 60 feet if you "think" you would 2 putt it.

Seems like it's pretty open to the magic pencil brigade.

 

[Springveldt]

If I read it correctly the assumption is that it is more than likely that a player will hole out from 5ft or less. Really? I guess the argument is that it would be the same for everyone, but that seems to ignore the skill and temperament (mental strength) that is required to hole short putts - things that many golfers never develop and not very many almost master - as much as they can be mastered.

They obviously haven't seen me putt, I missed 5 putts from within 5 foot at the weekend.

 

[Alan Clifford]

1 for 5', 2 or 3, 3 or 4.
Plenty of opportunity for vanity or banditry.

On the other hand, if you've lost the hole or your score doesn't count, you could putt out with a large number of strokes for handicap manipulation purposes. But golf is supposed to be based on honesty and integrity

 

[IanM]

Can't wait to see someone pace out 60 feet.

Anyone got anything new to add.... if not go read the other thread(s)

 

[wjemather]

1 for 5', 2 or 3, 3 or 4.
Plenty of opportunity for vanity or banditry.

Not without the collusion of the marker certifying the scores.

 

[wjemather]

They obviously haven't seen me putt, I missed 5 putts from within 5 foot at the weekend.

And yet it's still more likely that you hole from within 5 feet.