Is the extent of slow play real or a myth then ?

[bladeplayer]

I was behind a couple of lads the other Sunday, both were high handicappers, nothing wrong with that mind as I am too.
One player was slightly better than the other but he had the worlds longest pre-shot routine. Visualise the shot, 3 practice swings, stand behind the ball for an age to visualize the shot again, address the ball, more practice swings, then duff the ball 15 feet
I ended up picking up my ball and going a couple of holes past them as I would have been there all day!

I get the fact he was trying to do the same routine for every shot but he was seriously taking the pi$$ imo.

Could be a teaching pro fault there tho .. "maybe" he has been told to do this every time to improve so he is just doing what he is advised ???

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

I play a lot of 36 hole open events, it's normal practice to allow 5 hours between morning and afternoon tee times. A few years ago that was ample time to get round, have lunch and get back on the tee. These days, it is common practice to be late on the tee for the 2nd round as it takes 4:45 to get round then you have to sign and return cards, eat and get back on the tee again.

 

[Beezerk]

Could be a teaching pro fault there tho .. "maybe" he has been told to do this every time to improve so he is just doing what he is advised ???

Yes it's what I thought, he had a decentish looking swing and definitely had lessons by the looks of it.
Either way it was like watching paint dry lol.

 

[patricks148]

I know you should err on the side of caution when hitting shots, but the couple in front of me yesterday waited for the 15th green to clear before playing. its 387 yards doglet right, most tour pro's would't be able to reach it with driver. neither got more than 100 yards. the 16th the same only 320 yards doglet left this time, not worth hitting driver anyway, again they waited for the green to clear. and both knobbed it 100 yards. another single who joined me walked in from the 17th tee and he had put up with this all the way round. he said he had been hitting 4 or 5 balls on every hole and still had to wait on all the tee's

 

[rikkitikk]

Certainly think it is alive as went out on my own to see if the swing was returning to normal and ended up behind a 4 ball that started 20 minutes before me and did not want/allow me to play through and I am never sure about asking to play through.

What made it amusing was having a 4 ball catch me up so we chatted whilst waiting.

The 4 ball that caught me up started about 30 minutes after the 4 ball I was stuck behind.

I gave up after 7 and walked in as it took me an hour and forty five minutes to get there. The 4 ball in front of them were halfway up the next hole.

 

[TheJezster]

I guess peoples opinions on what is and what isnt slow or acceptable will change depending on when they are playing. Obviously someone playing during the week when the course is less busy will have a quicker round (in general) than someone playing on a weekend when the comps are on and the public are walking their dogs all over the course and the runners are running through it, causing you to wait for them often.

I play most of my golf at the weekends, so for a me a round of golf is about 4 hours. This is what i expect. If its quicker I might think, oh that was quick today, or if it's slower I might think bit slow today.. but that could be to the number of people on the course, players and public alike. It's not THAT often that a group infront slows us down, although it does happen occassionally. It's more likely the public right of way from playing on the common.

Saturdays round was more like 4 and a half hours, maybe slightly over, but it didnt feel ridiculously slow and the 4 of us had a nice round, with good company, so not one of us complained. The 4 ball behind us was always about a hole behind too, so we certainly werent holding them up, and were pretty much keeping up with the 3 ball infront of us. But like I said, the speed wasnt an issue, we were out to play golf and we all did, and had fun.

Thats what golf should be about in my opinion, not the length of time it took to go round.

 

[CMAC]

I went from a course where 4hrs 45 was the norm (mind numbing at times) to a club where my first medal was 3hrs 25mins and one of our group was 70 yrs old and dunted it along.

All medals have been that way.............apart from the club championship qualifying that was 2hrs 15 mins for 9 holes and it was a lovely sunny day!!!

All these primadonnas plumb bobbing and lining putts up from 6 angles before they putt, throwing grass up and pacing out yardages even though you have a gps ffs!

Common sense must prevail or be enforced i.e if you're being pushed and theres space let them through, lost a ball and want 5 mins with a group behind waiting let them through.

If its backed up and no spaces the club/starter/marshals need to look at the early groups times and action accordingly for future tee times.

If we all acted responsibly with empathy it could be dramatically improved overnight IMO

 

[GB72]

I must be one of the lucky ones as I rarely experience some of the horror stories on here. A weekend round pretty much takes 3 1/2 to 4 hours every single week irrespective of the group that I am keeping up with ahead.

What I have noticed are a couple of things that can cause the misconception of slow play:

First is that we do not have booked tee times outside of competitions. This generally means that most groups tee off just as soon as the group in front is out of range rather than leaving it a couple of minutes, waiting for them to reach the green or such like. As such, all groups are going to be pretty tightly packed for a few holes until things spread out a bit. It does not take much for this sort of congestion to appear like slow play from those ahead.

Different group sizes is also an issue. At the busy times at weekends most people play in 3 or 4 balls and the course is quite packed. You still, however, get 2 balls and lone golfers expecting to speed round and complaining about pace of play. If they were at all realistic in their expectations, they should realise that playing at a busy time in a smaller group when most are in larger groups is going to mean that the round will take longer. I have often said that the club could do something about this by pairing up groups or by setting aside one loop of 9 holes for smaller groups.

One group just starting out on their round can cut in ahead of you on the 10th or 19th tees. Also these tees can be used as starting points. This means that the second loop of 9 that you play can be busier than the first. This can, again, give the appearance of groups slowing down when it is simply that the holes that you are on are busier.

To be fair, the best pace of play is pretty much always in competitions. Set tee times, everyone in the same size group and nobody able to start at the 10th hole means that the course settles in to a decent pace of play and flows far better.

 

[FairwayDodger]

I played a comp recently. The tee was closed for an hour prior to the start. I was in the first group out and we caught up with people by the 6th hole. How does that even happen?

 

[GreiginFife]

I'm of the opinion that it's not slow play that's the problem. Everyone is entitled to enjoy their game of golf however they feel like it, lets face it we all tend to pay a fair whack of money for the privilege. No, for me, it's the lack of common courtesy and basic etiquette that is the problem.
I don't mind if the group in front is slow, I mind when they lose a hole on their group in front and don't let me/us through.
I don't mind someone having a 2 minute pre-shot routine and knobbing it 100yrds, I mind when they are not cognisent of the effect they are having around them and acting accordingly.

The ramblings of a disturbed mind.

 

[cookelad]

I played a comp recently. The tee was closed for an hour prior to the start. I was in the first group out and we caught up with people by the 6th hole. How does that even happen?

What are these people doing?? In rough terms (assuming you were playing at 10mins per hole) thats 2 hours to play 5-6 holes!

I might have posted on here previously (I can't remember all my posts!) but, I was watching the Tour a couple of weeks back the cameras stayed with 3ball while they were on the green, the first guy to putt looks at his putt from numerous angles decides on his line and hits his putt, the second guy then preceded to look at his putt from numerous angles before picking his line and hitting his putt and then low'n'behold the third guy looks at his putt from numerous angles before lining up and hitting his putt.

So between 3 players they took 5-6 minutes over 3 shots on the green alone just because they were doing sweet FA while their FC's were preparing to take their shot. Why couldn't they be stalking their putts all at the same time? I know I do I'll be checking my line while keeping an eye on my FC's who are playing their shot, obviously not walking or moving or being in their field of vision as they're are playing. Why? So I'm as near to ready to play as soon as it's my turn!

 

[CMAC]

What are these people doing?? In rough terms (assuming you were playing at 10mins per hole) thats 2 hours to play 5-6 holes!

I might have posted on here previously (I can't remember all my posts!) but, I was watching the Tour a couple of weeks back the cameras stayed with 3ball while they were on the green, the first guy to putt looks at his putt from numerous angles decides on his line and hits his putt, the second guy then preceded to look at his putt from numerous angles before picking his line and hitting his putt and then low'n'behold the third guy looks at his putt from numerous angles before lining up and hitting his putt.

So between 3 players they took 5-6 minutes over 3 shots on the green alone just because they were doing sweet FA while their FC's were preparing to take their shot. Why couldn't they be stalking their putts all at the same time? I know I do I'll be checking my line while keeping an eye on my FC's who are playing their shot, obviously not walking or moving or being in their field of vision as they're are playing. Why? So I'm as near to ready to play as soon as it's my turn!

middle Para of post #27

right there with ya brother

 

[pokerjoke]

Playing yesterday on my home course and it was all flowing nicely,so around
in 3 1/2 hours.
The longest wait we had was purely down to course design.
On our 7th you have to drive over the 10th green so you wait until the green is cleared.
There are many courses that I have played where you have to wait until greens are cleared,
or sometimes you have to walk past until they putt out.
There will always be some idiots that think they are out for a stroll with the dogs,but
I find if you ask nicely enough they will let you through,albeit with a huff and a puff.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

This i exactly what i was getting at , i know slow play exists but is is as bad as we think ,

Can someone that knows how please throw up a poll . something on the lines of


"IN THE LAST 10 ROUNDS IVE BEEN HELD UP DUE TO SLOW PLAY with the options of say 0 time 1-3 times 4-6times .7- 9times , every round ..


Im not saying it doesn't exist youd be mad to say that .. just wondering out of total curiosity the real extent of it ..

Thanks in advance

When a 2 ball takes 5 hours 20 mins then slow play isn't exaggerated

When a foursomes group take 5 and a half hours then slow play isn't exaggerated

When in medals three balls take overs 5 and a half hours etc

Slow play is the biggest problem in golf - sometimes it's down to poor etiquette , older players or poor golf

But it needs sorting - clubs need to get tough on the known persistent offenders

 

[Snelly]

Several mentions of older members being part of the problem on slow play, not letting people through and so on and I think that is unfair. There are slow players in every category of membership.

I think that the two groups who cause more problems than the seniors are juniors who have got all the gear and no idea, 6 practice swings etc, all copied from the TV. And secondly, a whole generation of golfers who are relatively new to the game (last 10 years ish) who are playing in an era where 4-5 hours for a round is acceptable. This to them is perfectly normal. Again, pros on TV are to blame.

If you are a new golfer and reading some of the posts on this thread, it could well be that you cannot fathom why people are vexed! A 2.5 to 3.5 hour round is an alien concept to some.

 

[FairwayDodger]

What are these people doing?? In rough terms (assuming you were playing at 10mins per hole) thats 2 hours to play 5-6 holes!

We were playing a bit faster than that but it's still unbelievable. Not sure what was going on further ahead. I noticed when we were on the second that there were two groups on the 5th tee and another lot just holing out on the 4th.... Which is pretty unusual.

 

[GreiginFife]

Several mentions of older members being part of the problem on slow play, not letting people through and so on and I think that is unfair. There are slow players in every category of membership.

I think that the two groups who cause more problems than the seniors are juniors who have got all the gear and no idea, 6 practice swings etc, all copied from the TV. And secondly, a whole generation of golfers who are relatively new to the game (last 10 years ish) who are playing in an era where 4-5 hours for a round is acceptable. This to them is perfectly normal. Again, pros on TV are to blame.

If you are a new golfer and reading some of the posts on this thread, it could well be that you cannot fathom why people are vexed! A 2.5 to 3.5 hour round is an alien concept to some.

Snelly, while I agree with 99% of what you say about not blaming seniors all the time and juniors copying tour pros, I disagree that to say not letting people through as a reasoning is unfair.

Pace of play and "playing through" forms part of the basic etiquette of the game (as described quite clearly in the rules of golf under the Etiquette - Speed of Play section)
It's also one of the first things I was taught and had impressed on my by my dad when I started playing.

 

[duncan mackie]

I am not sure I agree here. It was certainly different 30 years ago as slow play was a real rarity. Anyone slowing the course down was taken aside for a discreet word.

we were clearly playing in different places 20-30 years ago

I played 'public courses' at weekends, whether competitions, matches or just a friendly fourball and 5 hours was the norm unless you were first out at silly o'clock. There weren't any marshalls, or starters....there weren't any cat 1 golfers (not just because the cat didn't exist but people moved on if they became that competent.

Midweek I played Wentworth, Woburn, Gleneagles and Dalmahoy in 4's - with the odd exception of the East at Wentworth 5 hours was the norm in the summer, despite the best endeavours of the marshalls.

That said, if I went to East Sussex or Royal Ashdown midweek pm I would expect to have the course to myself in those days!

The underlying issues haven't really changed; they have moved around a bit but they haven't changed.

 

[richart]

When I started playing in the 70's 4 balls would take no more than 3 1/2 hours. Now the norm is 4 1/2 hours. No not a myth. I would also say that Pros would be round in at least an hour quicker if not more. You allow slow play at the top end of the game and it will filter through to the club player.

I don't understand this idea that if you are slow that is fine, just let the group behind through. You should keep up with the group in front, assuming you are both 3 balls, 4 balls etc. Letting people through slows down the field behind you. Once you have let one group through the next group will be up your proverbial. I don't want to be let through, I just want the group in front to keep up. It is not that difficult, you don't need to run, just be ready to play, walk at a decent speed, don't spend forever on a pre shot routine, and eye up every putt as if it is for the Open. Slow play is the one thing that might make me give up the game again.

 

[Snelly]

Snelly, while I agree with 99% of what you say about not blaming seniors all the time and juniors copying tour pros, I disagree that to say not letting people through as a reasoning is unfair.

Pace of play and "playing through" forms part of the basic etiquette of the game (as described quite clearly in the rules of golf under the Etiquette - Speed of Play section)
It's also one of the first things I was taught and had impressed on my by my dad when I started playing.

Apologies - what I was trying to infer in my previous post was that posters on this thread were suggesting that older members were particularly bad for not letting others through.

I totally agree with everything you wrote about basic etiquette and playing through. Well said.