Golf Random Irritations

[3offTheTee]

Yet I get more shots off yellow to hit a lower CR than less shots off whites to hit a higher cr?

Yellow is 69.6 white 71.8

So makes even less sense no? Unless they were same CR.

I haven't lost shots off yellows that's remained the same. It's the white that has dropped below them now

What is the slope rating for the yellow and white tees please?

 

[PJ87]

What is the slope rating for the yellow and white tees please?

112 and 111 formerly 111 and 117

 

[Voyager EMH]

Carnoustie in a gale off the championship tees doesn’t suddenly become easy because it has a high slope rating. It’s still hard as nails.

Weather can make any course more difficult, whatever its course rating and slope rating is.
Your statement is absurd this time.

Played in a comp at my home club yesterday and there was a PCC of +2.
A mate who shot 8 over par achieved a score differential of 4.5.

The purpose of Course Ratings and Slope Ratings is to make all courses equal degree of difficulty for all players.
This is not an absurd statement.

Next week I shall be playing a course that is par 70, course rating 72.7, slope rating 138.
If there is wind and rain, then I am sure I will find it more "difficult" than when weather is benign. But then so will everyone else playing on that day.
Everyone will experience the same increased "difficulty". Same for all players.

 

[Dando]

Sky reporters apologising for golfers using bad language - they'd have kittens if they televised H4H and @Bratty was playing

 

[Slab]

Pretty difficult to see the hole on tv for the medium to long putts at Scottish Open, could do with a lick of white paint round them

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Pretty difficult to see the hole on tv for the medium to long putts at Scottish Open, could do with a lick of white paint round them

This is a beef for me on many courses on tv. They will spend a load on trackman, it does look sexy to be fair, but then we can't see what happens on the putting green because the hole blends in with the green. Could they not have a little graphic showing where it is?

 

[Slab]

This is a beef for me on many courses on tv. They will spend a load on trackman, it does look sexy to be fair, but then we can't see what happens on the putting green because the hole blends in with the green. Could they not have a little graphic showing where it is?

Yeah a little flag stick graphic when they're putting would be useful
I think its made harder still when the green hue of the 'greens' starts to edge towards beige and it just blends too much with the soil round the lip of the hole
Its certainly easier to spot the hole on courses with vivid vibrant green grass

 

[Orikoru]

This is a beef for me on many courses on tv. They will spend a load on trackman, it does look sexy to be fair, but then we can't see what happens on the putting green because the hole blends in with the green. Could they not have a little graphic showing where it is?

If only the pros got with the times and left the flag in to putt. Everyone knows you hole more that way anyway.

 

[Bratty]

Sky reporters apologising for golfers using bad language - they'd have kittens if they televised H4H and @Bratty was playing

Hahaha. They'd need to just have one long 'beeeeeeeb' as soon as I've hit the ball. And there's no knowing how long before they could turn it off either!

 

[IanM]

Today's and tomorrow's weather. Yuk!

 

[Deleted member 25172]

Weather can make any course more difficult, whatever its course rating and slope rating is.
Your statement is absurd this time.

Played in a comp at my home club yesterday and there was a PCC of +2.
A mate who shot 8 over par achieved a score differential of 4.5.

The purpose of Course Ratings and Slope Ratings is to make all courses equal degree of difficulty for all players.
This is not an absurd statement.

Next week I shall be playing a course that is par 70, course rating 72.7, slope rating 138.
If there is wind and rain, then I am sure I will find it more "difficult" than when weather is benign. But then so will everyone else playing on that day.
Everyone will experience the same increased "difficulty". Same for all players.

I'd almost be willing to bet my whole life savings (which isn't a lot tbf) on that someone who's home club is say Royal Cinque Ports, Carnoustie or Woodhall Spa and who has the same handicap index as myself (me - member parkland course) will produce a better score than me over time if we were to play at a neutral venue that none of us have played before.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I'd probably go along with that but suggest its not easier but more playable. I def find it more playable moving forward a tee box but my PBs from the two tee boxes are only one shot apart while my playing handicap is a 3 shot difference

Off scratch the yellows should be easier, but with a handicap dictating the the round score (nett or pts) then the white and yellows should present the same level of ease/difficulty in relation to handicap players

I usually find putting in 36pts off our CR 70 Yellows quite a bit harder to do than putting in 36 off our CR 72 Whites (SR is same for both sets of tees).

Off 9 I struggle a bit with the balancing adjustment of -2 that is applied for the Yellows. Off a much higher handicap that -2 would be gobbled up and not really make a substantive difference (the BA is>20% of my singles PH, for a 25 PH player it’s 8% of their PH)

Consequently I prefer to play WHS qualifying rounds off the whites…off yellows my gross scores are more likely to increase my HI more than when I play off whites.

 

[Bdill93]

I'd almost be willing to bet my whole life savings (which isn't a lot tbf) on that someone who's home club is say Royal Cinque Ports, Carnoustie or Woodhall Spa and who has the same handicap index as myself (me - member parkland course) will produce a better score than me over time if we were to play at a neutral venue that none of us have played before.

I could say the same about my club.

A 5 index at my club would be a 7/8 index at most others. Handicaps just aren't as portable as people think.

Our club get smashed to bits in literally all of the inter club comps in Worcestershire. I have no doubt that my 14.1 index is probably actually closer 16ish in real terms.

 

[Deleted member 25172]

I could say the same about my club.

A 5 index at my club would be a 7/8 index at most others. Handicaps just aren't as portable as people think.

Our club get smashed to bits in literally all of the inter club comps in Worcestershire. I have no doubt that my 14.1 index is probably actually closer 16ish in real terms.

Exactly. Look at the difference between index vs number of shots allocated from 2 courses in Sweden (Bro Hof and Osteraker by Stenson) and compare that with index vs allocated shots for Carnoustie.

There is a big difference between courses. In Sweden it seem to be reflected more so than here. Not saying it's right or wrong, but there is a big difference.

Example:

Bro Hof White tee Index 7.5 - 8.2 = 15 shots
Osteraker HS tee Index 7.6 - 8.4 = 14 shots
Carnoustie White tee Index 7.8 - 8.5 = 10

I don't get it.

 

[sjw]

Exactly. Look at the difference between index vs number of shots allocated from 2 courses in Sweden (Bro Hof and Osteraker by Stenson) and compare that with index vs allocated shots for Carnoustie.

There is a big difference between courses. In Sweden it seem to be reflected more so than here. Not saying it's right or wrong, but there is a big difference.

Example:

Bro Hof White tee Index 7.5 - 8.2 = 15 shots
Osteraker HS tee Index 7.6 - 8.4 = 14 shots
Carnoustie White tee Index 7.8 - 8.5 = 10

I don't get it.

View attachment 48513 View attachment 48514 View attachment 48515

Seems to me that Sweden are using CR-Par. If you apply the same calculation to Carnoustie, you get 15 shots.

 

[Deleted member 25172]

Seems to me that Sweden are using CR-Par. If you apply the same calculation to Carnoustie, you get 15 shots.

Ok, didn't realise that as I'm not that clued up on it. But guess the thing then is, we don't. I mean we could do it between mates, but the WHS app doesn't care about that.

 

[sjw]

Ok, didn't realise that as I'm not that clued up on it. But guess the thing then is, we don't. I mean we could do it between mates, but the WHS app doesn't care about that.

This is what I was saying in all my ramblings before - over here, once you've looked up that you get x shots, add that onto the course rating if you need to know how a particular score will affect your differential.

Being very similar in terms of course ratings and slopes, a member at Bro Hof consistently shooting 85 will get the same handicap as a Carnoustie member consistently shooting 85

 

[Deleted member 25172]

This is what I was saying in all my ramblings before - over here, once you've looked up that you get x shots, add that onto the course rating if you need to know how a particular score will affect your differential.

Being very similar in terms of course ratings and slopes, a member at Bro Hof consistently shooting 85 will get the same handicap as a Carnoustie member consistently shooting 85

Every day is a school day! Thanks

 

[cliveb]

A 5 index at my club would be a 7/8 index at most others. Handicaps just aren't as portable as people think.

True, but that's not the fault of the slope system. It's caused by the less than perfect manner in which CR is calculated.

I personally think that too much emphasis is placed on length and not enough on other factors.
I appreciate that these other factors are included in the formula, but they are not given enough weighting.
Tricky short courses tend to have unrealistically low CRs, resulting in handicaps that are too high.

 

[Orikoru]

True, but that's not the fault of the slope system. It's caused by the less than perfect manner in which CR is calculated.

I personally think that too much emphasis is placed on length and not enough on other factors.
I appreciate that these other factors are included in the formula, but they are not given enough weighting.
Tricky short courses tend to have unrealistically low CRs, resulting in handicaps that are too high.

Couldn't agree more!