HomerJSimpson
Hall of Famer
Trouble with golf is once its under your skin and in your soul you're never going to shake it off. Strange that we all share the same common dreams. Must be something in there somewhere
Golf Random Irritations
- Thread starter Slab
- Start date
D
Deleted member 23270
Guest
People dreaming about golf ?
SteveW86
Head Pro
Does dreaming of playing around with Paige Spirinac count?
D
Deleted member 23270
Guest
Playing around no. Playing a round yes ??
SteveW86
Head Pro
It was worded carefully
SwingsitlikeHogan
Major Champion
Some quite bitter and angry Social media whinges during the live broadcast of two 17/18 yr old girl amateurs winning the Sunningdale Foursomes beating two men professionals with match finishing on 13th. The whinging verged on the sexist saying it was unfair on the pros that the girls got 10 shots - being amateur ladies they each played off four; and the pros both played off +1…so aggregate 10. Well that’s the format and it’s worked for 88 yrs…with only six female pairings previous winners.
Why do female amateurs play off handicap of four? Well they have to play off same very back competition tees as the gents and round Sunningdale that’s quite a way back. And that is going to be tough. Thing is these two amateur girls are two of the very best in the UK, and hit the ball a long way…often as far as the pros, plus their short games are razor sharp.
What a pity that some blokes chose to whinge rather than celebrate a great win (the winner had to win 8 ko matches this year) in terrible and difficult conditions by two young and brilliant female players.
Why do female amateurs play off handicap of four? Well they have to play off same very back competition tees as the gents and round Sunningdale that’s quite a way back. And that is going to be tough. Thing is these two amateur girls are two of the very best in the UK, and hit the ball a long way…often as far as the pros, plus their short games are razor sharp.
What a pity that some blokes chose to whinge rather than celebrate a great win (the winner had to win 8 ko matches this year) in terrible and difficult conditions by two young and brilliant female players.
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D
Deleted member 23270
Guest
Make your mind up. They get 10 shots because they have to play off the back tees but you say they hit it as far as the pros? Maybe that is a generous allowance after all especially if they are +4 or +5 cappers, that's 8 or 9 extra shots for playing off back tees. I've just watched a woman on the LPGA tour this morning hit a 275 yard par 4 with a 3 wood! And regardless of who wins, the winner has to win 8 matches.
Crow
Crow Person
I'd say they've over simplified the handicapping.
The ability range means that 4 shots could be too few, or as in this case, perhaps too many. Why not use the actual handicaps of the amateurs to generate something more meaningful in terms of their skill level?
The ability range means that 4 shots could be too few, or as in this case, perhaps too many. Why not use the actual handicaps of the amateurs to generate something more meaningful in terms of their skill level?
HomerJSimpson
Hall of Famer
If you choose to look for the positives there are loads of positive social medial posts out there.
SwingsitlikeHogan
Major Champion
There may well be and of course there is much in the way of congratulations, but that doesn’t take from the negativity some have expressed. Disappointing. There was no excuse for ANY negativity.
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SwingsitlikeHogan
Major Champion
The point that Sunningdale make is that lady amateurs have to play off the same back tees as the professional gents. Plus the shots allowances are set to accommodate pairs that can be mixed of any combination.
The Sunningdale approach has worked well over 88 yrs, and indeed is appropriate for lady amateurs as there have only previously been six winning ladies pairs of any combination. Just that these two girls are exceptional golfers who hit the ball a long way. But they still had to win 7 matches to get to the final, and then play foursomes in grim weather against two very good gent pros.
HomerJSimpson
Hall of Famer
It's called life. Will always be negativity especially on social media. Handicaps are clearly published https://www.sunningdalegolfclub.co.uk/sunningdale_foursomes so it shouldn't be any surprise to anyone entering
Neilds
Assistant Pro
Best you don't read the article from England Golf which has just been sent in the weekly email update. Mostly concentrates on the runners up with hardly a mention and no quotes form the winners
SwingsitlikeHogan
Major Champion
Really? Surprising that as England Golf are usually pretty good in their coverage of ladies and junior girls golf. As it happens I think the match would have been pretty much all square after 13 (when they finished) if it had been played off scratch - assuming guys holed putts that were pick ups as they’d lost the hole - at most there was probably only maybe one hole between the pairs.
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Foxholer
Blackballed
Was Lottie Woad the Farnham member you mentioned in one of your earlier posts?
Both seem destined to be stars.
FWIW, there might need to be a slight adjustment (another categoy) to handicaps awarded for such stars, to reflect this relatively new phenomenon.
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Leftitshort
Well-known member
Which implies the handicapping was wrong. I don’t begrudge the girls their win, but clearly they are much too good to need the 10 shots. It’s not their fault but maybe the arbitrary 5 shots each vs the male pros needs to be looked at?
SwingsitlikeHogan
Major Champion
Yes it was Lottie and Rachel Gourley (member Arcot Hall up Newcastle). Maybe there could be another category, but what would it be.
SwingsitlikeHogan
Major Champion
The format and handicapping has to support any combination of lady / gent / amateur / pro with amateurs of whatever (low) handicap. There have been plenty of female stars playing in past years but maybe not two quite so prodigious and dedicated amateur girls/ladies. And why would you then penalise such a pairing for being a good as they are, gelling superbly well as a foursomes pairing under the pressure of playing against a pair of gent professionals. But maybe you would as that’s what handicapping is all about.
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Leftitshort
Well-known member
What would a women professional play off? I’d argue that top amateurs (of both sexes) are no longer amateur. I’ve no wish to penalise anyone but maybe after 80 years the definition of amateur has changed?
SwingsitlikeHogan
Major Champion
I think women pros get a handicap of 0. In which case the girls would have got two shots on the blokes. But remember there were 8 holes played off level and though the girls can hit a long way off the tee, I suspect the two pro lads would hit their irons further and so have a significant advantage in that respect. It then comes down to accuracy of second shot and even though hitting longer irons the girls are still very consistent and accurate, the pros should have a distinct advantage.
Anyway…that’s for Sunningdale to ponder on.
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