EU Referendum

[Hobbit]

Not keeping us in the EU... keeping us in the single market, with the associated free movement of people and EU fees.

So not in the EU, but still with two of the three main issues that leave campaigners have cited.

Norway's contribution to the EU, for access in four specific market areas, is €884million. An awful lot less than the UK's, which is the spin a Leaver would put on it. I'd be interested to know the value of Norway's exports to the EU compared to ours.

Norway have also, as you highlighted, had to agree to free movement of people. Quite what that means in terms of non-EU citizens travelling from an EU country I don't know but, again, it would be nice to know.

However, what's to say an exited UK wouldn't argue for different terms... crystal ball time?

 

[jp5]

Of course a UK negotiation would be unique, but it seems logical that terms would be less favourable than now.

Perhaps MPs would seek access to the single market in order to mitigate the damage to businesses and the economy.

Who knows - and that's part of the problem. There is no manifesto, or consensus, for leave. And for such a defining decision, it seems there really ought to be.

 

[Hobbit]

Of course a UK negotiation would be unique, but it seems logical that terms would be less favourable than now.

Perhaps MPs would seek access to the single market in order to mitigate the damage to businesses and the economy.

Who knows - and that's part of the problem. There is no manifesto, or consensus, for leave. And for such a defining decision, it seems there really ought to be.

I agree. But, equally, I think the terms brought back by David Cameron, bearing in mind they still have to be ratified by the other member states, are not what he set out to get. And in a public statement he did say if he didn't get them he would be supporting out.

Merkel jumped all over the last sticking point at the 11th hour.

 

[jp5]

Haven't heard the renegotiations mentioned much in the debate, probably goes to show they're fairly immaterial in the bigger picture.

And I think in his usual slippery ways, DC never actually said he would back out if he didn't get his negotiations!

 

[Hobbit]

Haven't heard the renegotiations mentioned much in the debate, probably goes to show they're fairly immaterial in the bigger picture.

And I think in his usual slippery ways, DC never actually said he would back out if he didn't get his negotiations!

He made the statement on November 7th 2015, in which he said if he doesn't get what he wants at the negotiations for better terms he will recommend out.

He didn't get what he went for. But he was hardly likely to really.

 

[ColchesterFC]

A comment on the football thread got me thinking.............The figures for immigrants contributing more in taxes than they take out must include footballers (and other professional sportsmen and women). A single footballer on £150k per week will be paying over £60k per week in taxes just on his wages and that's without tax on image rights or sponsorship deals. That would cover the costs for a lot of immigrants taking money out of the system.

 

[Hobbit]

A comment on the football thread got me thinking.............The figures for immigrants contributing more in taxes than they take out must include footballers (and other professional sportsmen and women). A single footballer on £150k per week will be paying over £60k per week in taxes just on his wages and that's without tax on image rights or sponsorship deals. That would cover the costs for a lot of immigrants taking money out of the system.

A lot of footballers, Rooney included, register the image rights through a tax haven and pay zero tax.

 

[ColchesterFC]

A lot of footballers, Rooney included, register the image rights through a tax haven and pay zero tax.

A lot of footballers transfer their image rights to a limited company and pay corporation tax on it at 21%. In your example they still end up paying tax if they are a UK resident when they withdraw the money. It is a good set up for overseas players as they can avoid being taxed by leaving the money until they leave the UK.

 

[jp5]

He made the statement on November 7th 2015, in which he said if he doesn't get what he wants at the negotiations for better terms he will recommend out.

Got a link out of interest?

 

[Old Skier]

Got a link out of interest?

It was all over the news but I doubt if he will be willing to admit it.

 

[Hobbit]

Got a link out of interest?

It (re) Googled it and found it in a article in the Guardian. I originally remembered it being on the BBC News

 

[Foxholer]

Norway's contribution to the EU, for access in four specific market areas, is €884million. An awful lot less than the UK's, which is the spin a Leaver would put on it. I'd be interested to know the value of Norway's exports to the EU compared to ours.

Norway have also, as you highlighted, had to agree to free movement of people. Quite what that means in terms of non-EU citizens travelling from an EU country I don't know but, again, it would be nice to know.

However, what's to say an exited UK wouldn't argue for different terms... crystal ball time?

Here's the views of a Norwegian who probably knows a lot more about the in-depth details!

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices...an-ex-eu-adviser-i-can-tell-you-a7060976.html

 

[chrisd]

Just watching Andrew Neil making mincemeat of Hilary Benn from the in campaign. He is moving his mouth like a fish out of water

It's hilarylarious!

 

[SocketRocket]

A comment on the football thread got me thinking.............The figures for immigrants contributing more in taxes than they take out must include footballers (and other professional sportsmen and women). A single footballer on £150k per week will be paying over £60k per week in taxes just on his wages and that's without tax on image rights or sponsorship deals. That would cover the costs for a lot of immigrants taking money out of the system.

I dont believe the claim that immigrants pay in more than they take out, thats a very naive and misleading claim and peddled by the rich and the silly idealistic left wing. If you look at immigrants over a very short time frame they pay a very small amount in due to many being young and single, as they stay they start to have families, get ill, their kids go to school, they claim tax credits and family allowance, get old and claim pensions etc. Over a longer frame they cost a great deal of money. The other point that seems to be missed is how high populations put countries under great stress as they create competition for scarce resources, how do we create enough electricity for example with a population growing at a million people every three years, we are looking at the lights going out in the near future anyway due to the stupid closures of power stations, just imagine how this will be when we reach 80 million. I wont rant on about the NHS, schools, housing and infrastructure as the strain on these is undeniable.

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

Yes how wonderful that the working immigrants are paying taxes from doing jobs that lazy feckless Brits should be doing. If the immigrants weren't here then the Brit would be doing that job and paying the taxes instead.

Oh.....and we would then be saving on the benefits they were claiming as well.

 

[Foxholer]

Yes how wonderful that the working immigrants are paying taxes from doing jobs that lazy feckless Brits should be doing. If the immigrants weren't here then the Brit would be doing that job and paying the taxes instead.

Oh.....and we would then be saving on the benefits they were claiming as well.

Another complete scare story poo-poo-ed by almost every analysis undertaken!

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-about-immigration-to-an-expert-10427400.html

 

[ColchesterFC]

Yes how wonderful that the working immigrants are paying taxes from doing jobs that lazy feckless Brits should be doing. If the immigrants weren't here then the Brit would be doing that job and paying the taxes instead.

Oh.....and we would then be saving on the benefits they were claiming as well.

Absolutely agree. If only these lazy feckless Brits could be banging in 20 goals a season for Chelsea (insert any other club to avoid accusations of being biased) then we wouldn't have any problems in our country. :thup:

 

[gmc40]

I dont believe the claim that immigrants pay in more than they take out, thats a very naive and misleading claim and peddled by the rich and the silly idealistic left wing. If you look at immigrants over a very short time frame they pay a very small amount in due to many being young and single, as they stay they start to have families, get ill, their kids go to school, they claim tax credits and family allowance, get old and claim pensions etc. Over a longer frame they cost a great deal of money.

So exactly the same as young Brits then? Not sure how you can say they only pay a very small amount? Some get more back than they put in (Brits and EU Migrants), the majority don't. That's the way the system works.

 

[SocketRocket]

So exactly the same as young Brits then? Not sure how you can say they only pay a very small amount? Some get more back than they put in (Brits and EU Migrants), the majority don't. That's the way the system works.

Absolutely, the same counts for Brits, thats how our country has managed to build up a £1.5 Trillion national debt. The point is that immigrants create exactly the same debt, they are not all pilling in excess money that we have to spend on improving the country. You are wrong, most do cost more than they put in just as the people here already do, all immigration does is delay the day when we will be forced to take out no more than we put in.

 

[gmc40]

H

Absolutely, the same counts for Brits, thats how our country has managed to build up a £1.5 Trillion national debt. The point is that immigrants create exactly the same debt, they are not all pilling in excess money that we have to spend on improving the country. You are wrong, most do cost more than they put in just as the people here already do, all immigration does is delay the day when we will be forced to take out no more than we put in.

I'm not wrong. You have no evidence that they take out more than they put in other than your assumptions and generalisations.