Do you believe you can get to scratch?

[wjemather]

Question is, what is a "scratch golfer" nowadays though?

When we had a decent handicap system it was simple, you were officially Scratch (zero) handicap from 0.4 down to +0.5, very simple and everyone understood it.

Now you can be 2 point something but have a Course Handicap of 0, that's not a scratch golfer in most people's eyes I would imagine.

You can have an index of +2 and be playing off 1 on the right course on the right tees...he's better than a scratch isn't he?

Who knows?

A scratch golfer is defined as a player with a Handicap Index of 0.0. Simple.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

Basically, you can't practice on your own course but you can go to another course and practice?

if the club allows people to use their practise facilities

But most courses I know don’t allow practise on the course for anyone

 

[Eesat 90210]

A scratch golfer is defined as a player with a Handicap Index of 0.0. Simple.

When you say "defined", where has this new definition come from?
Previously, your handicap was 0 when you were down to 0.4.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

Question is, what is a "scratch golfer" nowadays though?

When we had a decent handicap system it was simple, you were officially Scratch (zero) handicap from 0.4 down to +0.5, very simple and everyone understood it.

Now you can be 2 point something but have a Course Handicap of 0, that's not a scratch golfer in most people's eyes I would imagine.

You can have an index of +2 and be playing off 1 on the right course on the right tees...he's better than a scratch isn't he?

Who knows?

It’s your Handicap Index

So right now to get to scratch it would be 0.0

 

[Eesat 90210]

But there's "not allowing" it officially and people using common sense.

I'm regularly out discretely dropping a couple or three balls around a green for 5 minutes here or there in the summer months. I might hit an extra iron shot or driver sometimes, and I'll definitely take a few putts, all of this when it's quiet. No harm or damage, no holding anyone up and perfectly normal.

But like in one of the posts above, I was at a course a couple of years ago where some plank was literally hitting 20 or so full shots from fairways in the evenings, he was taking a divot with each shot and not replacing them, no doubt not replacing pitchmarks either. His practice on the course should definitely not be allowed, mine and others described above is normal members club stuff as long as it's discrete and there's absolutely no physical damage done.

 

[sjw]

For me, it has to be based on index, and from my point of view, for me, I know that I wouldn't claim myself to be a scratch golfer until I was at 0.0. If I was at 0.1 I know other people would call me a scratch golfer and that's cool and all, but that last 0.1 would bug the hell out of me.

It's interesting to see different viewpoints in here and to be honest I'm surprised at the pessimism from the majority. There have even been points like, "I never thought I'd get as low as I am now... but I know I won't get any better." That's a crazy mindset to me, you've already proven yourself wrong once!

The other thing I think is interesting is comparisons that people are doing to others at their club. I play semi-regularly with people a few shots better than me on paper, and yes, they don't make as many mistakes... but realistically I don't think they're actually that much better than me and I see playing with them as an eye-opening, learning experience. They're only human. Admittedly I don't know most posters' ages so perhaps that is the difference between me at the start of my golf journey and others toward the back end of theirs, but I don't think I've ever watched a scratch golfer at my course and been in awe. I've certainly seen some throw a complete stinker though!

 

[Oddsocks]

The way I see it - once the core group has answered the initial question, the topic either evolves or it dies.

Have you not seen the adjacent thread on 'golf rules people are allowed to break' where it's become a discussion of how tee time spacings impact slow play??

But tee time spaces in experience do effect slow play.

 

[wjemather]

When you say "defined", where has this new definition come from?
Previously, your handicap was 0 when you were down to 0.4.

It's in the Rules of Handicapping.

 

[Eesat 90210]

It's in the Rules of Handicapping.

Indeed it is, thank you

Scratch golfer

Shame England Golf don't know this when they wrote the article about the guy in his 70's getting to 0.4 a couple of months ago

 

[Orikoru]

For me, it has to be based on index, and from my point of view, for me, I know that I wouldn't claim myself to be a scratch golfer until I was at 0.0. If I was at 0.1 I know other people would call me a scratch golfer and that's cool and all, but that last 0.1 would bug the hell out of me.

It's interesting to see different viewpoints in here and to be honest I'm surprised at the pessimism from the majority. There have even been points like, "I never thought I'd get as low as I am now... but I know I won't get any better." That's a crazy mindset to me, you've already proven yourself wrong once!

The other thing I think is interesting is comparisons that people are doing to others at their club. I play semi-regularly with people a few shots better than me on paper, and yes, they don't make as many mistakes... but realistically I don't think they're actually that much better than me and I see playing with them as an eye-opening, learning experience. They're only human. Admittedly I don't know most posters' ages so perhaps that is the difference between me at the start of my golf journey and others toward the back end of theirs, but I don't think I've ever watched a scratch golfer at my course and been in awe. I've certainly seen some throw a complete stinker though!

I think the difference between 12-17 handicap and single figures is just consistency. We can play the shots they do, they just do it more often. However when you're talking about getting down to scratch I think more of the distance factor comes into it. There can't be many scratch players nowadays hitting 220 yard drives. Generally they're going to be hitting longer because their technique is that good anyway.

If you hit a long ball already then I think you've got a lot more chance of getting down to that sort of level than someone like me who hits it pretty short-to-average distance.

 

[sjw]

I think the difference between 12-17 handicap and single figures is just consistency. We can play the shots they do, they just do it more often. However when you're talking about getting down to scratch I think more of the distance factor comes into it. There can't be many scratch players nowadays hitting 220 yard drives. Generally they're going to be hitting longer because their technique is that good anyway.

If you hit a long ball already then I think you've got a lot more chance of getting down to that sort of level than someone like me who hits it pretty short-to-average distance.

That's fair. I think you're right, especially distance off the tee. I think iron distance is less important, provided you're not mega short. Too much variation in iron sets (do not derail this thread into loft conversations) to say, "you should hit x iron this distance".

I carry driver about 240 and naturally want to work on that this year. Who doesn't want more distance?! I think I'm going to find a decent coach this year, as I think I lose some speed due to swing flaws and not finding the middle quite as consistently as I'd like.

 

[Springveldt]

I think the difference between 12-17 handicap and single figures is just consistency. We can play the shots they do, they just do it more often. However when you're talking about getting down to scratch I think more of the distance factor comes into it. There can't be many scratch players nowadays hitting 220 yard drives. Generally they're going to be hitting longer because their technique is that good anyway.

If you hit a long ball already then I think you've got a lot more chance of getting down to that sort of level than someone like me who hits it pretty short-to-average distance.

Shot Scope and Arccos both back that up, the average driving distance of a scratch golfer in their databases is around 250 yards with Shot Scope having their average at 248 and performance at 279 yards.

This was mine for all my tracked rounds in 2024 compared to a scratch which tracks pretty much what I see as I play a lot with those types of golfers and I'm typically 20 yards behind.



And by club, top one is the Epic Flash and bottom one is Epic Speed. I think it's clear to see why I ditched the Speed and went back to the old Flash. These stats are for 297 drives with the Flash and 171 with the Speed. Just something felt off with the Speed, it sounded great but even on good hits it just wasn't going as far. It wasn't the shaft either as the shaft that was in the Speed is currently in the Flash.



Something I'm actually shocked at is that I only had 12 penalty strokes off the tee all year in 468 shots.

 

[Orikoru]

Shot Scope and Arccos both back that up, the average driving distance of a scratch golfer in their databases is around 250 yards with Shot Scope having their average at 248 and performance at 279 yards.

This was mine for all my tracked rounds in 2024 compared to a scratch which tracks pretty much what I see as I play a lot with those types of golfers and I'm typically 20 yards behind.

View attachment 56534

And by club, top one is the Epic Flash and bottom one is Epic Speed. I think it's clear to see why I ditched the Speed and went back to the old Flash. These stats are for 297 drives with the Flash and 171 with the Speed. Just something felt off with the Speed, it sounded great but even on good hits it just wasn't going as far. It wasn't the shaft either as the shaft that was in the Speed is currently in the Flash.

View attachment 56535

Something I'm actually shocked at is that I only had 12 penalty strokes off the tee all year in 468 shots.

My longest drive last year (measured in Hole19) was 258 I think, and that felt like a fluke when I'd just bought my new driver and caught one nice. I don't believe I will ever hit a 300 yard drive in my life. I did get 290 once on a downhill hole in the rock-hard baked fairways of summer 2022.

 

[Beezerk]

My longest drive last year (measured in Hole19) was 258 I think, and that felt like a fluke when I'd just bought my new driver and caught one nice. I don't believe I will ever hit a 300 yard drive in my life. I did get 290 once on a downhill hole in the rock-hard baked fairways of summer 2022.

I hit two drives of 310 yards on Saturday, granted the fairways were frozen and like concrete but I’m still counting them

 

[Orikoru]

I hit two drives of 310 yards on Saturday, granted the fairways were frozen and like concrete but I’m still counting them

I think some of mine went 300 yards right last year, but only 200 yards forward.

 

[bobmac]

Practicing chipping on the course will cause damage. You need to find somewhere else where it is allowed. If I had a motorcycle and wanted to practice motocross I can't take it onto the Stray and tear it up because there is no other area to "practice"....you either don't ride or find a place that does allow it.

No it doesn't, did you watch the video above?

 

[bobmac]

One of life's little pleasures in golf is finding a quiet green late on in the evening in the summer and hitting all kinds of short game shots.


Chipping around a green in the summer doesn't damage the course.

It's fairly simple

Don't stand and bash chips from the same spot.
Be aware if anyone if coming along. Move aside immediately and don't hold anyone up.

I can see why some courses put out blanket bans on practicing on the course because there are plenty of ignorant people out there.

Thank you

 

[Arthur Wedge]

Ok, how do you practice and improve the shot we were talking about in the video at a club that has has no chipping green baring in mind it does no damage to the course

Well would expect most will just do it whilst playing in bounce games

Others will go to a local driving a range that has a facility

Lucky for me the club has a chipping and short game area and all three driving ranges nearby have short game areas

 

[Voyager EMH]

I've been playing around with my spreadsheet.
I'm in the splendid position of having the next 8 scores dropping off that are not in my best 8.
When I start handing in qualifying scores in April or May, I merely need best 5 rounds out of 8 to average level par and I will be HI 0.1
Wish me luck - lots of it!

Probably got more chance of winning £1,000,000 on the premium bonds this year than getting to scratch.

 

[jamielaing]

There should be an automatic 2 shot penalty for:

Saying "good shot" before the ball comes to rest. Nothing worse than necking one up the fairway or mis-hitting an iron and you know it's coming up short and some clown is cooing over it...

Exclaiming "IN" when a putt is 3 foot away from the hole, just before it veers left or right as it always does!

Yours,
M Grumpy.

Never a truer word spoken.