Are these distances killing the game?

[Tommo21]

Yeah the big hitters will still hit it big but 30 or so yards less. No different from years ago, I'm talking about average. We cant keep lengthening courses but we can alter technology. They made the road hole bunker bigger a couple of years ago, they also put the tee further back to a point where a large building is more part of the course. The 18th tee at Augusta is going further and further back and they're still hitting into the bunker. Compensating for the ball going further is this below and it wont stop.

 

[ScienceBoy]

Nice little video here... https://youtu.be/x6B6U0DflaY

So to take my thoughts about changing ball vs changing course. (I think courses are too hard already) then we have to take ball tech back over 20 years for the pros. Which means the pro players would be on mid 80s-90s ball tech/performance to make any kind of meaning reduction in distances.

Would that be something that would happen? Probably not.

Pretty much leaves a whole overhaul of equipment rules for pros (not amateurs) which again is not a realistic option OR going with imurgs suggestion of tightening up landing areas.

This just shows how difficult a problem we are facing.

 

[USER1999]

Tightening up fairways and landing areas leads to boring, one dimensional golf. They need to bring back shot making. The best golfer is exactly that, not the longest, or straightest hitter.

Ogilvy likened it to watching Feds and Nadal play tennis, but they are only allowed to hit down the centre line. Boring.

Reigning the ball in is not about the ball. It is the easiest thing to change. Tiger and Jack are in favour of it. They know more about golf than me.

Me? I would bin off extra stiff shafts (bend test on first tee), driver lofts of less than 9 degrees, wedges of more than 56 degrees, and cut the limit to 10 clubs. Bring back some skill in hitting the number, rather than a club for every yardage.

Never going to happen.

 

[garyinderry]

Why ban less than 9 degree drivers?

 

[USER1999]

Why ban less than 9 degree drivers?

Heck, my rules, my choice.

Or, if you need a 7 degree driver to hit it long, then you need to make a 9, a 7 at impact. Back to shot making. Shaping it, delofting, making golf fun.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Didn't tennis change the compression of the ball a few years ago? Around the end of the Henman era, done to reduce the dominance of the serve. If they could do it...............

 

[garyinderry]

Heck, my rules, my choice.

Or, if you need a 7 degree driver to hit it long, then you need to make a 9, a 7 at impact. Back to shot making. Shaping it, delofting, making golf fun.

I wouldn't restrict loft but the driver head and face is beyond a joke. Clearly not the same game or skill level that past generations of golfers needed.

#banbigheads

 

[bluewolf]

I wouldn't restrict loft but the driver head and face is beyond a joke. Clearly not the same game or skill level that past generations of golfers needed.

#banbigheads

Why not just make it compulsory that Pro Golfers smoke and can only eat at KFC? That'll soon take us back 😉

 

[DCB]

New technology in club design and in the design of the ball have certainly changed the game both for the Pro game and the amatuer/club golfer. The course I play is no a long course, yet, thirty years ago we all carried driver, 3 &5 woods and used them on various holes round the course. Nowadays, you can hit 3w as far as an old driver went and even on the longer holes very few people reach for a fairway wood even into the westerly breeze.

The same technology that has reduced the length of the course has also made a huge difference in playing shots into the greens. If we aren't careful we will make many courses outdated for modern play. I'd certainly like to see the Pro game reigned in a little bt limiting the ball distance. As has been said already, that still would make the game worth watching. It would certainly open the door to a larger percentage of the field to seriously contend, even on the longer tougher courses.

 

[Crow]

On the "my rules" theme;

• Woods have to be made of wood.
• Irons have to be made from a single piece of one metal only, no hollow heads or stick on pieces allowed.
• And while I'm at it, putters have to be a single piece of metal with no stick-ons too, I'll grudgingly allow Anser styles although they're not a part of my bag any more.

 

[harpo_72]

Making courses narrower is okay but they will drop down to irons - TW at several Opens for example. However it doesn’t stop them hitting high lofted clubs for their second shots.
The ball compression is the key, we need to keep the amatuers engaged, we also need to get pro golfers out of this high speed body damage game. I would suggest that they manipulate the ball to over compress when hit with certain club head speeds.
Hope that makes sense, it just means you get nothing really extra by swinging hard.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

It's hard when many courses hosting tour events are home to members for most of the year until the circus rolls into town. I'm not sure what these place can really do, especially with the costs involved to make massive changes to accommodate the tour players. Yes, they can grow the rough and tighten the holes especially in the 280-320 landing area and around the greens but that also impacts members and if the course becomes too hard for them as the course is being prepared where's the fun for them especially as the game is hard enough already. I would have to see the game split in two with gear etc for the pros and different stuff for us (much) lesser players. That's part of the whole essence of the game.

For me, the spectacle remains the same, seeing the very best fighting it out to win. Yes it can be a little boring watching a birdie fest at some courses, especially some of the ET ones and the US resort courses but once the majors come around and par is premium on each hole its compulsive viewing

 

[Sweep]

Interesting, As i get older I'm still hitting the ball as far, mainly because of the ball and the equipment. I cant get a 3 or 4 iron as high as years gone by but hybrids do that for me now.

However, I'm lucky enough to play with some really good players and the club champion from Royal Musselburgh, when we had a game at Dunbar a couple of weeks back hit the ball over 300 into a slight breeze. Over the years I've played with big hitters, pros, club champions and such like and that distance just continues to grow.

The stats are more confusing when you consider Driver was used more often in times gone by, where 3 wood, long iron and such like is now taken for that same hole. Short par fours are hit time after time and Looking at distances going back the years we roughly have 10 yards per decade.

Making courses tougher by gowning the rough, bringing in the rough wont stop the length they hit it and it would make some of the courses look silly and it could also make viewing silly by watching the best golfers hacking about in the rough. Championship courses all over the world are being lengthened year on year, even at the masters they cut the fairways all the one way to stop the ball from running as much as possible.

I think the pro ball needs sorted. If the ball was knocked back say 30 yards on driving average then I'm sure we would see more exciting golf.

Good post

 

[Sweep]

Should Usain Bolt have been forced to run in Doc Martins as his WR times killed the sport for club sprinters?

No.
But then you don’t have to change the running track because pro runners are faster than amateurs.

 

[Sweep]

But would you?
The Bombers (Tony Finau) will be hitting it 300 whereas the non-bombers (Kuchar) will be hitting it less than 250.
So the Bombers still have the distance advantage.
I'm all for rewarding long, straight driving. It's an integral part of the game.

No-one is suggesting penalising the big hitters. If the pro’s all played with a ball of the same spec, the big hitters would still be big hitters. Just that if the pro ball didn’t go as far, courses would not need to be continually lengthened and we could all play the same courses.

The problem is the gap between pro and amateur is getting bigger and shows no sign of stopping. I read somewhere that if a ball is produced that gives a pro an extra 10 yards it gives an amateur less than 3. I heard a Callaway rep say their 2018 Chromesoft is giving pro’s more than 2mph ball speed over last year’s ball. It has to stop somewhere. If the top pro’s start hitting it 400+ how long before Augusta runs out of room? They keep buying land from Augusta Country Club next door but that can’t go on forever.

 

[Imurg]

Make the fairways a little narrower and grow through a little and you negate this 400 hard drive - which has to be really straight to not go in the rough.
I'm not talking 6 inch, cover your ankle rough but 3-4 inches somthe ball it's down and makes it hard to play from.
Put the emphasis back on hitting the fairway - if someone can hit it 400 yards and keep it within 10 yards either side of the centre then all power to their elbow
Lengthening just makes it easier for the bombers and limiting the ball effectively lengthens the course

 

[harpo_72]

Make the fairways a little narrower and grow through a little and you negate this 400 hard drive - which has to be really straight to not go in the rough.
I'm not talking 6 inch, cover your ankle rough but 3-4 inches somthe ball it's down and makes it hard to play from.
Put the emphasis back on hitting the fairway - if someone can hit it 400 yards and keep it within 10 yards either side of the centre then all power to their elbow
Lengthening just makes it easier for the bombers and limiting the ball effectively lengthens the course

Your not really factoring in the 2nd shot. If someone is swinging that hard they will carry a distance gain through the bag. They would still be playing lofted irons in the rough.

 

[pendodave]

My issue with the grow the rough/narrow the fairways suggestions is that it's inappropriate for a lot of courses.

Many of the classic courses like the Scottish links, Melbourne sand belt and those designed by the 'golden age' architects were designed to be wide, with the layout of the topography, hazards and green areas encouraging a fine balance of angles, risk/reward etc.

New distances take all this out of balance, and scattering rough around is a bit like drawing a moustache on the Mona Lisa.

One interesting idea I heard mentioned was to reduce the allowed height of a tee. But what would all the tee manufacturers do then....

 

[USER1999]

One interesting idea I heard mentioned was to reduce the allowed height of a tee. But what would all the tee manufacturers do then....

Make shorter ones?

 

[Slime]

http://www.golf.com/tour-news/2017/...old-course-defeated-todays-ball-and-equipment

As Gary Player said, it took 200 years for the Old Course record to be beaten several times in one week.
Its pretty clear modern equipment is a real issue for the game, especially the ball. There is only so far designers can go in lengthening courses. They have to get creative and stop making distance the be all and end all and make the most of forward tees, dog legs and bunkering etc.
The problem is that it’s not really an issue for the professional game. It’s easy for them to rock up to the iconic courses that have been lengthened time and again and play as usual. The problem is ours, the amateur. Those iconic courses (and other courses who believe to be considered top class they have to be long) are becoming unplayable for someone who can only hit normal distances. People forget, it’s the amateurs that are most important for the game as a whole.
The authorities are walking a tightrope. They know that if they reign the ball in for everyone and make a hard game even harder for the amateur, people will give up in their droves and the game cannot afford that. If they leave the ball as it is, courses will become unplayable for the average player.
As I have said before, I like the Ping CEO’s answer. Have the pro’s play with a reigned in ball and let the amateur continue playing today’s ball. If the pro is “only” getting 300 yards out of his drive, it will only be like it was less than 5 years ago. Pro golf was pretty good then.

I'd go along with that, I'd also make sure that bunkers are a hazard and, as Murph said, limit them to just ten clubs.
Oh, and the rough should be rough.