And, we're off.....2016/17

[freddielong]

What ?

You do realise one is a manager and one is a player ?

One sets up the teams and is responsible for the way the team plays and how successful they are - the other plays the way the manager wants

What is this all is forgiven business - why do I need to forgive Gerrard ? He gave his all for the club and won us some great trophies and we had some great times with him as a player - when we didn't succeed as we should in his time the manager was sacked

Not once have a said Wenger is rubbish - right now I believe he is very lucky that despite not winning a major trophy for a big club in over a decade he is still in the job and believe he is the manager that is stopping Arsenal winning big trophies

How on any planet can you compare a manager to a player ? Do you even think before ranting away

So you cannot compare two human beings in similar professions playing for the same honours to see if they are successful or not?

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Lucky?

You really don't have a clue mate......or you are trolling.

The club are enormously lucky to have had Wenger. He has helped to pay off the stadium with his success and consistency as a manager for over a decade.

The lucky manager they are desperate to keep.

Ok couple of questions to determine something

1. How many league titles has Wenger won in the past decade?

2. How many CL has Wenger won ?

3 How many managers have been sacked over the past ten years despite winning leagues and CL ?

What determines the success of a club - trophies they win or how much money they have or what stadium they have ?

What does a fan celebrate - winning a big trophy or a stadium being built

What do players celebrate - winning a medal or a new stand being built ?

How the hell am I troll because I believe Wenger is holding back Arsenal ? Maybe that's just down to your low expectations of your club

 

[freddielong]

Ok couple of questions to determine something

1. How many league titles has Wenger won in the past decade?

2. How many CL has Wenger won ?

3 How many managers have been sacked over the past ten years despite winning leagues and CL ?

What determines the success of a club - trophies they win or how much money they have or what stadium they have ?

What does a fan celebrate - winning a big trophy or a stadium being built

What do players celebrate - winning a medal or a new stand being built ?

You can only be judged against the parameters you are set.

 

[Liverbirdie]

Forget all the rest this line tells me all so need to know.


Michael. One left when we needed him, .......and he went to Utd

No difference to RVP , had he had stayed Owen would be on the same pedestal as Fowler no doubt about it.

Not really, if you know your football. He went to Real Madrid, then Newcastle before United.

The list was based on when him and Fowler where both there, and not a retrospective look.

Maybe next time, read it properly.:thup:

 

[Liverbirdie]

Cheers Pedro. :thup:

Interesting comparison as Owen was very much "groomed for stardom" as the modern footaller so probably does become more distant whereas Fowler was a bit more old school.

Zackly!!!!!! and owen, was a wool. :whoo:

 

[Liverbirdie]

I'll throw into this as a neutral, Everton fan, with lots of Liverpool relations. Owen was never held in affection in the way that Fowler was. Owen just isn't a warm character. He was robotic in his interviews, too clinical in his answers, no feeling. Fowler (Gerrard, Carragher etc) all answered with passion and all related to Liverpool being central to everything. Owen left when it suited his career, clinical. He didn't wait to stick things out, he saw a chance to move and he took it. Fans don't like or want that. Fowler was sold on, he didn't want to leave the club. Huge difference.

I doubt you will find Owen is held in affection by any club fans, ask a Newcastle fan about Owen but stand well clear. Just not that type of person.

Zackly (2)!!!!

As I say, the explanation wasn't based on how they both left, more from how we felt about both when still there.

Honest to God, lar.

 

[pokerjoke]

I'll throw into this as a neutral, Everton fan, with lots of Liverpool relations. Owen was never held in affection in the way that Fowler was. Owen just isn't a warm character. He was robotic in his interviews, too clinical in his answers, no feeling. Fowler (Gerrard, Carragher etc) all answered with passion and all related to Liverpool being central to everything. Owen left when it suited his career, clinical. He didn't wait to stick things out, he saw a chance to move and he took it. Fans don't like or want that. Fowler was sold on, he didn't want to leave the club. Huge difference.

I doubt you will find Owen is held in affection by any club fans, ask a Newcastle fan about Owen but stand well clear. Just not that type of person.

Come on mate when a striker is banging in goals for Liverpool he was idolised by thousands,i believe he is disliked because he went to Utd simples.

I believe English clubs are missing a trick with their top players like Giggs,Gerrard,Carragher,Neville,scholes,Lampard I could go on,and by the way I'm not saying all would or wanted too but they could have become good managers whilst in their final years.
They needed to be groomed like players are abroad.

If Liverpool felt about Gerrard the way he felt about Liverpool he should still be there now,no doubt he will be in the future in some role but imo he should be there now,the same as Giggs at UTD.

 

[Kellfire]

the same as Giggs at UTD.

And look how that's not working. Time for him to go and learn the world of football elsewhere in my opinion.

 

[pokerjoke]

And look how that's not working. Time for him to go and learn the world of football elsewhere in my opinion.

This is exactly my point we missed a trick,imo Fergie could have mentored him for 3 years and helped him become a great manager.

Look at ex players managing abroad and big clubs at that with no previous managerial experience.

 

[sawtooth]

Not really, if you know your football. He went to Real Madrid, then Newcastle before United.

The list was based on when him and Fowler where both there, and not a retrospective look.

Maybe next time, read it properly.:thup:

So you say, I think Owen going to Utd albeit indirectly has influenced your opinion.

You love Coutinho now right? If he left to go to Man Utd next year for more money you are trying to tell me that you'll look back fondly at his liverpool years? Or you would still love him post Liverpool?

Yeah right.

 

[richy]

So you say, I think Owen going to Utd albeit indirectly has influenced your opinion.

You love Coutinho now right? If he left to go to Man Utd next year for more money you are trying to tell me that you'll look back fondly at his liverpool years? Or you would still love him post Liverpool?

Yeah right.

Why can't you grasp the fact that owen didn't go directly to man Utd?

If coutinho went to man Utd next year that would be completely different.

 

[Liverbirdie]

So you say, I think Owen going to Utd albeit indirectly has influenced your opinion.

You love Coutinho now right? If he left to go to Man Utd next year for more money you are trying to tell me that you'll look back fondly at his liverpool years? Or you would still love him post Liverpool?

Yeah right.

Believe me or not, yes, I agree that Owen has been cast off in the main by Liverpool fans since, I dont disagree.

As Jocko asked why wasnt he loved as much, I truly answered (and used Robbie Fowler) as a very good example.

It was an honest assessment from the eyes of lots of scousers of the red persuasion of the time, and also noticed by lots of neutrals as to why Fowler was loved more than Owen. If you take Fowler's stock as 10, Owen at his peak would still have been only a 7 or an 8, and I agree since then it is down to about 2-3.

If you dont believe me check out the reception he received in a Newcastle shirt (pre-Man U) with songs like "where were you in Istanbul", as he chose to leave the year before, and 8 months leater we won it. I actually clapped him and didnt sing that song, as from a generation that applauded ex-players. He was probably on a 4 -5 then.

Signing for Man U will obviously take that down to a 2, at best.

If coutinho went there directly it would be even worse, correct.

Is it really worth bothering to answer?

 

[sawtooth]

Believe me or not, yes, I agree that Owen has been cast off in the main by Liverpool fans since, I dont disagree.

As Jocko asked why wasnt he loved as much, I truly answered (and used Robbie Fowler) as a very good example.

It was an honest assessment from the eyes of lots of scousers of the red persuasion of the time, and also noticed by lots of neutrals as to why Fowler was loved more than Owen. If you take Fowler's stock as 10, Owen at his peak would still have been only a 7 or an 8, and I agree since then it is down to about 2-3.

If you dont believe me check out the reception he received in a Newcastle shirt (pre-Man U) with songs like "where were you in Istanbul", as he chose to leave the year before, and 8 months leater we won it. I actually clapped him and didnt sing that song, as from a generation that applauded ex-players. He was probably on a 4 -5 then.

Signing for Man U will obviously take that down to a 2, at best.

If coutinho went there directly it would be even worse, correct.

Is it really worth bothering to answer?

On your closing question, no it isn't you're right.

Wenger staying on for another two years? Now that is something worth discussing.

 

[pokerjoke]

On your closing question, no it isn't you're right.

Wenger staying on for another two years? Now that is something worth discussing.

That's good as its one less club for the title,however the books look ok:thup:

 

[sawtooth]

That's good as its one less club for the title,however the books look ok:thup:

Arsenal could win the league this season could they not?

 

[Fish]

I haven't looked in here for a while, glanced at the last few posts and......seriously, are we still going on like an old 78 about the same old guff :mmm:

 

[pokerjoke]

Arsenal could win the league this season could they not?

Of course in theory they could but history tells us they wont.

Good to see Jack Wiltshire complete the full 90 minutes today for the first time in two years and was actually still working hard at the end.

Could it be down to Arsenal and their training:ears:

 

[sawtooth]

Of course in theory they could but history tells us they wont.

Good to see Jack Wiltshire complete the full 90 minutes today for the first time in two years and was actually still working hard at the end.

Could it be down to Arsenal and their training:ears:

It could be but Bournemouth should take some credit too. ;-)

Arsenal top of the league!!

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Lucky point last week to robbed this week! Totally dominated the game and 2 stupid goals conceded, Steklenburg at fault for the first and bad defending for the last minute winner, could and should of had 3 or 4.

 

[Hobbit]

Lucky point last week to robbed this week! Totally dominated the game and 2 stupid goals conceded, Steklenburg at fault for the first and bad defending for the last minute winner, could and should of had 3 or 4.

The coulda shoulda woulda seen Boro 2-0 up at half time, and drawing 3-3