World Handicap System (WHS)

[wjemather]

Could a scratch player play off the ladies tees for handicap purposes?

Sounds slightly insane but I'm planning a mates golf day and it'll be mainly having a laugh and drinking with a night out. However theres a mix of players from plus handicaps to some who would struggle to break 100. I just want to make it fun and fancy going off the ladies tees to see how low I can go and make it more fun for the hackers.

There's no such thing "ladies tees". Tees are rated for either men or women, or both; anyone can submit a round for handicapping from any tee rated for their gender.

 

[Steve Wilkes]

No, for handicap purposes, courses are rated differently for men and women. So, in your case the tees will have to have been rated for men (assuming your scratch friends are male).

It would not be possible at my club, because the county only ever rated them for women (they never asked the owner if there was an option for men, and none of the golfing Committee were even aware they were rating the course that day, so had no communication with the raters). Not sure how many other courses will have had red tees rated for men, I know there are a few.

Is there a reason courses are rated different for ladies and men. I use to think a 6 handicapper women was the same as a 6 handicapper for men, but obviously the women/lady is really about a 10 handicapper

 

[Swango1980]

Is there a reason courses are rated different for ladies and men. I use to think a 6 handicapper women was the same as a 6 handicapper for men, but obviously the women/lady is really about a 10 handicapper

I've tried to find this out before, but never got a definitive answer.

But, you are NOW correct, a 6 handicapper lady is NOT the same as a 6 handicapper man. The ratings take into account typical distance a player can hit tge ball, which is obviously longer for men.

 

[wjemather]

Is there a reason courses are rated different for ladies and men. I use to think a 6 handicapper women was the same as a 6 handicapper for men, but obviously the women/lady is really about a 10 handicapper

In GB&I at least, for a long time the men's (via CONGU) and ladies (LGU) unions each had their own handicapping system and did their own ratings.

 

[Steve Wilkes]

I've tried to find this out before, but never got a definitive answer.

But, you are NOW correct, a 6 handicapper lady is NOT the same as a 6 handicapper man. The ratings take into account typical distance a player can hit tge ball, which is obviously longer for men.

It's not a big deal, but it means that women can only play off usually one set of tees. The distance thing should be irrelevant, A women who hits 150 yards is the same as a man who hits 150 yards, it's a bit like the Red Tees used to be the Ladies & Junior Tees, not sure if that's still true

 

[Crazyface]

I asked at my last place why the ladies couldn't play off the yellows and got the reply from the ladies I was asking that some of the ladies wouldn't reach the ladies tee from the yellows which would make some of the holes impossible for them to play.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

I asked at my last place why the ladies couldn't play off the yellows and got the reply from the ladies I was asking that some of the ladies wouldn't reach the ladies tee from the yellows which would make some of the holes impossible for them to play.

That is a reply often churned out. What it does not take into account is the very good female players who hit it a long way and must get bored playing off the reds all of the time. It is a selfish approach by the old guard, bit of a genralisation there but that has been my experience with this generic answer. Why not let all of the ladies decide which tee they can play off, don't restrict those that want to stretch themselves?

 

[Steve Wilkes]

That is a reply often churned out. What it does not take into account is the very good female players who hit it a long way and must get bored playing off the reds all of the time. It is a selfish approach by the old guard, bit of a genralisation there but that has been my experience with this generic answer. Why not let all of the ladies decide which tee they can play off, don't restrict those that want to stretch themselves?

This is what I was saying earlier. Because handicaps are different for men and women, unless each sets of tees are rated for both genders, it's impossible to submit cards for handicap purposes.

 

[davidy233]

No, for handicap purposes, courses are rated differently for men and women. So, in your case the tees will have to have been rated for men (assuming your scratch friends are male).

It would not be possible at my club, because the county only ever rated them for women (they never asked the owner if there was an option for men, and none of the golfing Committee were even aware they were rating the course that day, so had no communication with the raters). Not sure how many other courses will have had red tees rated for men, I know there are a few.

At our place the Medal course has red tees rated for both men and women - and in fact there's a men's stableford each Tuesday played off the red tees.

The much shorter Ashludie course only has whites rated for men and reds rated for women.

To my mind courses should have all tees rated for both sexes.

 

[rulefan]

To my mind courses should have all tees rated for both sexes.

When the pre WHS ratings were started EG gave all clubs that opportunity. I suspect that many (ie most) clubs didn't bother to tell/ask their members.

 

[Tashyboy]

Just outta interest. A PP played 9 holes in an 18 hole comp then had to shoot off to pick up his daughter. He put in Ns for the next 9 holes. How would that affect his hcap going forward as he never completed a full round.

 

[apj0524]

Just outta interest. A PP played 9 holes in an 18 hole comp then had to shoot off to pick up his daughter. He put in Ns for the next 9 holes. How would that affect his hcap going forward as he never completed a full round.

According to WHS he did not finish his round for a valid reason so the committee should apply Penalty scores and start sanctions, if they have a process for this. I thin the use is NS is incorrect if should be NR. Because he di not complete 10 holes his score doesn't count towards his handicap hence the Committee intervention, at least pointing out his error. We have a rule, three incompletion rounds competition entry ban

 

[Tashyboy]

According to WHS he did not finish his round for a valid reason so the committee should apply Penalty scores and start sanctions, if they have a process for this. I thin the use is NS is incorrect if should be NR. Because he di not complete 10 holes his score doesn't count towards his handicap hence the Committee intervention, at least pointing out his error. We have a rule, three incompletion rounds competition entry ban

his reasons were genuine, he had to pick up his daughter from school as one of the other kids in class had a positive Covid result. I will talk to him on Tuesday ?
cheers mah man.

 

[SammmeBee]

There's no such thing "ladies tees". Tees are rated for either men or women, or both; anyone can submit a round for handicapping from any tee rated for their gender.

Surely the ladies tees are the ones ladies play off, same as the men’s tees are the men’s tees......?

Obviously they may well be the same tee in mixed competition.....

 

[Old Skier]

When the pre WHS ratings were started EG gave all clubs that opportunity. I suspect that many (ie most) clubs didn't bother to tell/ask their members.

No they didn’t or at least the raters didn’t, stating they were to busy and had to get the “normal” tees completed first. i continue to ask for our reds and yellows to be mixed gender rated to no avail.

 

[rulefan]

No they didn’t or at least the raters didn’t, stating they were to busy and had to get the “normal” tees completed first. i continue to ask for our reds and yellows to be mixed gender rated to no avail.

That's a poor show from your county. I know some counties simply couldn't get enough volunteers trained up in time. I had to get another 30 team members.
A problem for those courses or tees as yet unrated is that rating can only be during the 'season'. In effect late April/May thru September and mixed tees will have to give way to unrated clubs/courses. I don't know what the backlog is in Devon. We had over 180 clubs to do but are virtually there. I think the Isle of Man only had 8 courses to do.

 

[williamalex1]

Not sure anybody would want.

I presume that is set by the club and would be a good way to warn players that do not understand that to submit scores for handicap they have to meet qualifying conditions.

We had this today for our 4bbb comp, non qualifying

 

[PJ87]

When the pre WHS ratings were started EG gave all clubs that opportunity. I suspect that many (ie most) clubs didn't bother to tell/ask their members.

I'm sure you can explain but why not under whs move to a one size fits all approach? Rate the Tees the same for men and ladies .. then let the ladies handicaps adjust in line

So somebody said a 6 handicap is really a 10 would it be a bad thing?

Handicaps can go up to 54 now so a 36 handicap lady would have scope

Tees would be rated for everyone and would get rid of men's Vs ladies .. just players

 

[rulefan]

I'm sure you can explain but why not under whs move to a one size fits all approach? Rate the Tees the same for men and ladies .. then let the ladies handicaps adjust in line

So somebody said a 6 handicap is really a 10 would it be a bad thing?

Handicaps can go up to 54 now so a 36 handicap lady would have scope

Tees would be rated for everyone and would get rid of men's Vs ladies .. just players

I suspect that the ladies would not welcome the idea that there would be virtually no ladies in the country with a 0.0 Handicap Index.

 

[D-S]

I was/am part of our County’s course rating team. We were advised that we should only rate tees for genders if there was a specific intention of that club to use those tees for competitions for that gender. Originally some courses wanted all their tees rated for both sexes ‘just for interest’. Whilst we were trying to complete all the ratings by 1/1/20 the original date aimed for, it seemed a waste of resource to rate tees that no one had any intention of playing off ever. We did manage to rate all courses in the county by 1/1/20 and to date no course has asked us to additionally rate a set of tees that we haven’t done as so far as no one has expressed an interest of playing off them. We will, of course if required, but not ‘just for the hell of it’.