What's the lowest handicapper that you've played with?

[HeftyHacker]

The highest PGA Tour scramble percentage from 30 yards is barely over 50%. If he's managing 90% from 50 yards he needs to get a driver in the bag and get onto the Seniors or Legends Tour

Haha the reality might be somewhat less but it certainly feels that way when you play with him.

Tbf I don't think he travels too well. He just knows his home course and greens so well that he knows exactly where the breaks etc are. And with it being SAOL the greens aren't particularly slopey but always in unbelievable condition so pretty predictable.

 

[MarkT]

OK - I didn't play "with" him, but I was in the field.

2001 County Championship at Willesley Park.

Winner - Gary Wolstenholme.

Course is par 70, but CR 71.4 and SR 127. Course has not changed in last 20 years.

His winning score - wait for it - 131 - nine under par for 36.

I think his morning score of 64 was a course record. Good time to do it, I suppose.

I caddied for Gary in the Seniors Scottish Open at Fairmont St Andrews, metronomic accuracy with every club and an incredible putter though, fair to say, maybe not the easiest person to caddy for

 

[evemccc]

I caddied for Gary in the Seniors Scottish Open at Fairmont St Andrews, metronomic accuracy with every club and an incredible putter though, fair to say, maybe not the easiest person to caddy for

Having no knowledge of being a caddy nor of having a caddy, I take it that when people use the the last sentence as a phrase, it means one or all of the following: demanding in terms of caddy’s knowledge or course info wanted/ a bit
grumpy/ uncommunicative / liable to blame the caddy?

 

[2blue]

One of our juniors is +3, shot a gross 65 on The Hotchkin on Monday in the junior open there. I guess most of you won’t have played Willow Valley in Brighouse, but if you have, you’ll appreciate that’s a pretty impressive handicap to play off around there.

Aaaah.... so that helps explain JohnF's performances.

 

[Deleted member 1147]

Opposite for me. Any scratch or better player I’ve played with is usually at least 20 yards past me off the tee, they have all carried it at least 260 yards. Yes, their short games and putting are good but they are all so good off the tee, not only long but consistent as well.

They’re probably actually better at both aspects of the game…longer and more accurate, with better short games.

 

[MarkT]

Having no knowledge of being a caddy nor of having a caddy, I take it that when people use the the last sentence as a phrase, it means one or all of the following: demanding in terms of caddy’s knowledge or course info wanted/ a bit
grumpy/ uncommunicative / liable to blame the caddy?

Most of the above, not to be repeated but we've made up since

 

[Springveldt]

They’re probably actually better at both aspects of the game…longer and more accurate, with better short games.

My short game from 50 yards and in is actually decent, so for me the thing I notice is the off the tee and ball striking on long irons, every scratch or better player I’ve played with is noticeable better at them than I am.

Over my last 10 rounds ShotScope had me as 0.25 for short game and -0.18 putting compared to a scratch. I’m -1.23 driving and -2.14 approach which is all 150+ yards. I’m actually 0.82 from 50-100 yards but -1.25 from 150-200 and -1.42 from 200+ yards.

It’s really noticeable as we have 5 par 3’s all longer that 150 yards (3 of them are usually 185+ yards) and the difference in their tee shots to mine is quite striking.

 

[Backache]

I caddied for Gary in the Seniors Scottish Open at Fairmont St Andrews, metronomic accuracy with every club and an incredible putter though, fair to say, maybe not the easiest person to caddy for

Having read his autobiography I can believe that. Interesting chap but clearly someone with very strong opinions who I suspect does not readily agree with other when they differ.

 

[Curls]

Played with a +5 in a bb match. I did get a birdie to come in once ? He was awesome, other level ball striking.

Played a scratch solo match against a +2 former pro, he murdered the ball, and me. Well, 5&4, reasonably respectable given the gulf in class. I was even up for a few holes. But it was a foregone conclusion. These guys ain’t playing the same game as us at all.

 

[2blue]

A few years ago whilst on an "Escape a Royal Wedding" Trip to Dumfries I played in an Open there & found myself in a 3 ball with Jack Brooks from The Mere (+5 & currently ranked 111th World Amateur) & his Dad off 4. They were heading up Perth way to return a Trophy they'd won the year before..... needless to say they retained it.
Wow... what an experience..... real gents & I've followed him on Twitter ever since.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

My short game from 50 yards and in is actually decent, so for me the thing I notice is the off the tee and ball striking on long irons, every scratch or better player I’ve played with is noticeable better at them than I am.

Over my last 10 rounds ShotScope had me as 0.25 for short game and -0.18 putting compared to a scratch. I’m -1.23 driving and -2.14 approach which is all 150+ yards. I’m actually 0.82 from 50-100 yards but -1.25 from 150-200 and -1.42 from 200+ yards.

It’s really noticeable as we have 5 par 3’s all longer that 150 yards (3 of them are usually 185+ yards) and the difference in their tee shots to mine is quite striking.

I'm sure these numbers mean something to those in the know - but as I am not one of those, this sentence is completely meaningless / baffling I will simply take it that the numbers highlight significant differences.

 

[JonnyGutteridge]

Bottled the chance to play a foursomes medal with a +2/ex-pro at our club. I couldn’t face putting him in the heather all day long, he probably doesn’t even know how to play out of the heather ?

 

[Springveldt]

I'm sure these numbers mean something to those in the know - but as I am not one of those, this sentence is completely meaningless / baffling I will simply take it that the numbers highlight significant differences.

It's Strokes Gained numbers comparing my last 10 rounds compared to scratch golfers in the ShotScope database. Since the user has to input their handicap into ShotScope and then you usually have to edit some shots after the round they won't be exact but they do give a good insight.

The areas I need to improve according to ShotScope (driving and approaches over 150 yards) match up very well to what I witness most weeks when playing with my +2 mate. ShotScope is saying that my game currently (last 10 rounds) my short game (50 yards and in) and putting are very similar to a scratch but I lose 1.23 shot per round driving and 2.14 shots per round on approaches (50 yards and over). You can break down your approaches and on shots from 50-100 yards I actually gain 0.82 shots on ShotScope scratch golfers but I lose 1.25 shots from 150-200 yards and I lose 1.42 shots on shots over 200 yards per round.

Mark Broadie creates the Strokes Gained stats and he has a great book called "Every Shot Counts" if you want to read more into how it works.

 

[SimonC]

It's Strokes Gained numbers comparing my last 10 rounds compared to scratch golfers in the ShotScope database. Since the user has to input their handicap into ShotScope and then you usually have to edit some shots after the round they won't be exact but they do give a good insight.

The areas I need to improve according to ShotScope (driving and approaches over 150 yards) match up very well to what I witness most weeks when playing with my +2 mate. ShotScope is saying that my game currently (last 10 rounds) my short game (50 yards and in) and putting are very similar to a scratch but I lose 1.23 shot per round driving and 2.14 shots per round on approaches (50 yards and over). You can break down your approaches and on shots from 50-100 yards I actually gain 0.82 shots on ShotScope scratch golfers but I lose 1.25 shots from 150-200 yards and I lose 1.42 shots on shots over 200 yards per round.

Mark Broadie creates the Strokes Gained stats and he has a great book called "Every Shot Counts" if you want to read more into how it works.

I play a little with a lad who's played on the Challenge Tour & has been as low as +3. He's obviously a very good golfer but the one thing I have taken from playing with him is that he fully commits to every shot he hits especially with his irons, I get guilty of taking an extra club & not fully committing to the shot. I had a chat with him about this & he said I'd be better off taking less club & hitting it full rather than a 3/4 shot with less club so I've been trying this route the last few rounds & it does seem to help. Also his chipping is way better than mine, that's my main weakness. My strokes gained against a 0 handicap from 0-25 yards is -0.89 so I'm losing nearly a shot a round from poor chipping. My pitching though is pretty decent as I gain 0.20 shots per round in that area.

Here are my stats:

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I play a little with a lad who's played on the Challenge Tour & has been as low as +3. He's obviously a very good golfer but the one thing I have taken from playing with him is that he fully commits to every shot he hits especially with his irons, I get guilty of taking an extra club & not fully committing to the shot. I had a chat with him about this & he said I'd be better off taking less club & hitting it full rather than a 3/4 shot with less club so I've been trying this route the last few rounds & it does seem to help. Also his chipping is way better than mine, that's my main weakness. My strokes gained against a 0 handicap from 0-25 yards is -0.89 so I'm losing nearly a shot a round from poor chipping. My pitching though is pretty decent as I gain 0.20 shots per round in that area.

Here are my stats:

View attachment 43985

I absolutely need to be doing the 'commit fully with less club' approach as otherwise my head gets in the way trying to control my swing for the distance I want to hit, and when my head gets in the way it does what it knows best - my old grooved swing I am trying to break from...and down that way for me lies utter shambles.

 

[SimonC]

I absolutely need to be doing the 'commit fully with less club' approach as otherwise my head gets in the way trying to control my swing for the distance I want to hit, and when my head gets in the way it does what it knows best - my old grooved swing I am trying to break from...and down that way for me lies utter shambles.

I think this is definitely the case if you're a competent ball striker.
I played last night and shot a 1 under gross, I made sure I was committing to every shot apart from the 17th hole where I stood on the tee & said I'm hitting an 8 iron. My playing partner said he was hitting a 6 iron & didn't think I'd get there with an 8 iron so what do I do, take the 7 iron don't commit to the shot & miss hit it coming up short. In the end it didn't matter as I chipped in but I've been hitting 8 iron on that hole all year with no wind from the back tees & this usually gets me between the middle to back of the green. Hopefully this re-affirms my need to hit the lesser club unless of course there is a forced carry where short is dead.

 

[evemccc]

I think this is definitely the case if you're a competent ball striker.
I played last night and shot a 1 under gross, I made sure I was committing to every shot apart from the 17th hole where I stood on the tee & said I'm hitting an 8 iron. My playing partner said he was hitting a 6 iron & didn't think I'd get there with an 8 iron so what do I do, take the 7 iron don't commit to the shot & miss hit it coming up short. In the end it didn't matter as I chipped in but I've been hitting 8 iron on that hole all year with no wind from the back tees & this usually gets me between the middle to back of the green. Hopefully this re-affirms my need to hit the lesser club unless of course there is a forced carry where short is dead.

I cognitively can see how it is true…going for a full shot with a club should be more predictably consistent than a more vague 75% shot with a lower-lofted club. The caveat being the golfer is already a good ball-striker

In contrast I find I have to allow an extra club than what I ‘should’ be able to hit…as I don’t always hit it from the middle of the club ?

 

[SimonC]

I cognitively can see how it is true…going for a full shot with a club should be more predictably consistent than a more vague 75% shot with a lower-lofted club. The caveat being the golfer is already a good ball-striker

In contrast I find I have to allow an extra club than what I ‘should’ be able to hit…as I don’t always hit it from the middle of the club ?

I always tell my dad to hit one extra club but that's because he very rarely goes long of the flag.

I remember seeing a video not too long ago (not sure who did the video though) where they discussed what the pros do & they would rather hit the full shot than a 3/4 shot with their irons.

 

[Orikoru]

I cognitively can see how it is true…going for a full shot with a club should be more predictably consistent than a more vague 75% shot with a lower-lofted club. The caveat being the golfer is already a good ball-striker

In contrast I find I have to allow an extra club than what I ‘should’ be able to hit…as I don’t always hit it from the middle of the club ?

True. I seem to get the worst of both worlds. When I commit to the shorter club I don't quite hit it properly and it lands short. When I think "I'll take one extra club and hit it smooth" I realise I don't have the ability to do that either and it lands short. I don't really like being between clubs.

 

[evemccc]

I always tell my dad to hit one extra club but that's because he very rarely goes long of the flag.

I remember seeing a video not too long ago (not sure who did the video though) where they discussed what the pros do & they would rather hit the full shot than a 3/4 shot with their irons.

Just checking that this committed standard full-swing stock shot is still ‘swinging within yourself’ and not busting a gut to hit it as far as can?

I was always told to ‘swing within yourself’ and I know DJ swings at about 90%

When you mean commit to a shot you mean more of a mental thing, and just a full shot —-which in my head is not a 100% busting a gut swing as fast as I can hit it?