VCSS ????

[williamalex1]

What's your thoughts, on having a different css for visitors / away players. The vcss yesterday was 73, home css 70

No difference to me as i NRD.

But is it right that an away cat 2 player who scores net 70 will get a h/c reduction of .9 , while a home player has a 70 and no reduction.

 

[bigslice]

ive played i think at millport and vistors automatically +1

 

[guest100718]

wouldnt that be .6?

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Is that just for your club. I wasn't aware we had a VCSS and every open event we've had has been calculated on the existing CSS based on scores as a monthly medal would be

 

[rosecott]

Is that just for your club. I wasn't aware we had a VCSS and every open event we've had has been calculated on the existing CSS based on scores as a monthly medal would be

If the number of Home and Visiting players are both 20 or more then a separate CSS for both must be used.

 

[williamalex1]

wouldnt that be .6?

Sorry Paddy, my mistake i was getting a class above/below? myself there , as a 15 h/c i am a cat 3 so a 70 is 3 under the vcss= 3 x.3= .9 reduction . cat 2 would be 3 x .2= .6 reduction. In the magic 2s comp i'm a division 2 funny that.

 

[rosecott]

What's your thoughts, on having a different css for visitors / away players. The vcss yesterday was 73, home css 70

No difference to me as i NRD.

But is it right that an away cat 2 player who scores net 70 will get a h/c reduction of .9 , while a home player has a 70 and no reduction.

Yes, that's the whole point of VCSS - to recognise that Home players should, as a group, score better than Visiting players.

 

[williamalex1]

Yes, that's the whole point of VCSS - to recognise that Home players SHOULD, as a group, score better than Visiting players.

I find in the majority of away open comps i play the away players seem to do better, i know i tend to.
But handicaps are national no matter what course you play.

 

[rosecott]

I find in the majority of away open comps i play the away players seem to do better, i know i tend to.
But handicaps are national no matter what course you play.

Then, if they are better, the VCSS will come down, not go up.

 

[freddielong]

Why is a golf course automatically harder just because its not your home course there are courses that I regularly play comps at that are not my home course and I usually play well on and beat my handicap

 

[pbrown7582]

Another of congu stats collected data i think it anticpates CSS to be Round 1.5+ for visitors.

 

[williamalex1]

Another of congu stats collected data i think it anticpates CSS to be Round 1.5+ for visitors.

ok add 1.5 onto the away h/cs at the start

 

[duncan mackie]

Why is a golf course automatically harder just because its not your home course there are courses that I regularly play comps at that are not my home course and I usually play well on and beat my handicap

it's not (although some of the above posts may seem to suggest that something is different in advance!

because statistically it has been seen that home players have an advantage on their own course (as indicated it's about 1.5) CONGU states that where statistically significant fields of both home and away players are involved in a single competition it is better to calculate separate CSS figures for the home and away players.

if this logic is flawed then the result will be reflected in the two CSS figures ie it doesn't matter what the reason is the application of different CSS figures will only happen if the logic is proved correct!

this is also why in club matches it is relatively common for clubs to have a better record at home than away.

 

[rosecott]

Williamalex1 and I have exchanged PMs on this. According to the raw figures on HDID (no data on Stableford Adjustments), 11 out of 27 Home players (Cat3 and below) made buffer or better while only 6 out of 62 Away players made buffer or better. I would be surprised if that's an unusual example of Open results.

 

[williamalex1]

Williamalex1 and I have exchanged PMs on this. According to the raw figures on HDID (no data on Stableford Adjustments), 11 out of 27 Home players (Cat3 and below) made buffer or better while only 6 out of 62 Away players made buffer or better. I would be surprised if that's an unusual example of Open results.

Thanks Rosie, but i still think if 2 players, have the same [net] score. Their handicap adjustment should be worked out without discriminating home or away IMHO.

 

[rosecott]

Thanks Rosie, but i still think if 2 players, have the same [net] score. Their handicap adjustment should be worked out without discriminating home or away IMHO.

I don't see it as discrimination. CONGU (and I agree) have stats which show that it is significantly easier for a Home player to make a score on his own course than a Visitor. Anecdotal stories of Visitors scoring better than Home players are just that - anecdotes.

 

[williamalex1]

I don't see it as discrimination. CONGU (and I agree) have stats which show that it is significantly easier for a Home player to make a score on his own course than a Visitor. Anecdotal stories of Visitors scoring better than Home players are just that - anecdotes.

How is it not discrimination , players from away clubs have their h/cs adjustments calculated using a different set of figures from home players. What next ??

 

[rosecott]

How is it not discrimination , players from away clubs have their h/cs adjustments calculated using a different set of figures from home players. What next ??

Their handicap adjustments at Home are calculated using the scores of other Home players as a benchmark. Their handicap adjustments Away are calculated using the scores of other Away players as a benchmark. I can argue this all night if you want. :thup:

 

[williamalex1]

Their handicap adjustments at Home are calculated using the scores of other Home players as a benchmark. Their handicap adjustments Away are calculated using the scores of other Away players as a benchmark. I can argue this all night if you want. :thup:

I know you could, back to your Red, Rosie :cheers: But there shouldn't be a THEIR h/cs , all h/cs are national .

 

[rosecott]

I know you could, back to your Red, Rosie :cheers: But there shouldn't be a THEIR h/cs , all h/cs are national .

All handicaps relate in the main to performance on your own course gauged against other members of your club playing in competition at your own course. Anyway, you NR'd, so how can you argue? Time we were both in bed.