Titleist ball fitting in this months magazine.

[patricks148]

I think its just human nature to want the best even if it’s not what you need.

At the Castle Stuart meet a few years ago, Titleist did a ball fitting with a questionnaire. Pretty much everybody ended up with Pro V1’s not because it was the right ball for them, but because everyone wanted Prov’s 1 and answered the questions accordingly

 

[BoadieBroadus]

i knew this thread would open as soon as i read the article. and as soon as i saw the comment from the 28 hcapper saying he had more control around the greens with the pro v. i'm not sure ive played with a 28 handicapper who even had control of his own limbs.

looked like a pro v marketing puff piece.

 

[One Planer]

I think its just human nature to want the best even if it’s not what you need.

At the Castle Stuart meet a few years ago, Titleist did a ball fitting with a questionnaire. Pretty much everybody ended up with Pro V1’s not because it was the right ball for them, but because everyone wanted Prov’s 1 and answered the questions accordingly

I would agree with Patrick.

I've been using the Mizuno Balls recently, courtesy of GM and Mizuno, and quite like them.

I still have the 6 dozen new Pro V's sat at home waiting to be used and will proably buy a few more as I get closer to using them.

The Mizuno is a very, very good ball. I'd be tempted to swap to them full time, however at £40/dozen they rae more expensive than the Titleist, so I'll stay where I am.

If the price drops in time I may move to the Mizuno.

The same as anything in life, cash/finances will play the main determining factor.

If you can afford Pro V's and don't lose many balls, no issue buying them. I you find the Pro V' expensive, the NXT or Velocity is a good ball at about half the price. If you lose a bucket load of balls, get the DT or PTS range.

 

[chris661]

i knew this thread would open as soon as i read the article. and as soon as i saw the comment from the 28 hcapper saying he had more control around the greens with the pro v. i'm not sure ive played with a 28 handicapper who even had control of his own limbs.

looked like a pro v marketing puff piece.

:rofl: :rofl: you played with bob as well then.

Of course it is a piece of marketing and of course they will push the most expensive option as the best for everybody. I really dont think that titleist are doing for the good of golf more likely it is to make a few squids.

That said the prov1 is the best

 

[Val]

That's fine,but if the best ball suits every player,surely you have to make that ball affordable to all.

Every ball has a price as does every piece of golf equipment, if you can't afford it go for a cheaper alternative, thats just the way it is.

 

[Val]

If you were all given the opportunity to test every ball before you went out on the course,
how come no cheaper ball was not chosen,surely a cheaper ball would have suited someone.
If Titleist never recommended none of you the right ball to use[what was the point of the fitting]surely
that was the objective,
Im certainly not questioning you personally,far from it,however Titleist I most definitely am.
It seems to me,as others have said its purely been done to promote there top end balls.
I would have to disagree a little with your final statement there though Nick.
Most pros would recommend getting the ball rolling quicker on shorter chips around the green,imo
its certainly harder to lob the ball all the way to the flag[only my opinion].
I use a prov1x and am not going to change,however Titleist have certainly opened my eyes
to how they work.

Let me flip this the other way, how many Titleist players use a non premium ball? How many would a non premium ball suit better?

Is it maybe a case that the premium ball genuinely is the best ball for most peoples game?

 

[BoadieBroadus]

in theory maybe a pro v might be the best ball for everyone, in practice, certainly for higher handicaps and beginners, the ball striking (even with a putter) is so hugely inconsistent and generally so poor that the difference in quality of balls is so miniscule as to be totally negligible.

I think anyone who has played golf for any length of time knows this to be true. i can't think of any 20+ handicapper i've played with where I've thought "well playing a pro v1 would certainly save you shots!"

I think the test would have rung more true with most of us if someone had just admitted "To be fair, I'm terrible at golf, I just couldn't tell the difference between knifing a prov 1 100 yards through the green and doing it with a velocity."

Instead we get, "I've been playing 3 weeks and I think the Pro V1X is just the awsomest ball ever for my flop shots over bunkers from a tight shortsided lie."

Experience is personal I suppose, but i've played at some stage with every type of ball and rarely do i really notice very much difference at all other than a general premium soft v budget stone type distinction. And I dont think I'm alone in that.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

I can't quite understand if this thread is a follow on from the peg tee custom fitting or not.

 

[Hacker Khan]

The piece was mostly just a very clever piece of marketing by Titleist. They are seen to be nice guys by fitting some golfers for free, GM are seen as nice as they offered this to their readers and the guys who attended got some free balls and their picture in the magazine. Everyone involved is a winner, and in a way they are so fair play to them. And of course the subtle message given out is that Pro V1s are the best ball no matter what your handicap is.

They could have taken out an advert at so many 1000s of pounds, but they know that a lot of people do not tend to pay that much attention to golf manufacturers claims nowadays of this many extra yards, softer feel, higher MOI blah blah blah. As any reader of golf mags must get kind of immune to the claims. Well I suspect the demographic of most GM readers will anyway, unless they are extremely gullible.

So Titleist just get the message across another way. It's a well known technique to use 'real' people to sell your product instead of just making claims yourself. As humans may think, oh, it actually works for that real 28 handicapper, I must go out and buy some...

I think as long as people can see what it is, which it seems people do, and treat it as partly an advert as much as a serious test to give each person the best value ball for their game (which of course opens the debate on how do you measure the value of a golf ball), then fair enough.

 

[One Planer]

Can I ask a question?






OK thanks



For those, including the OP, who don't understand why a Pro V1 (Or any premium ball for that matter) isn't suitable for a high handicapper, could you elaborate as to why?

Price aside, what makes an AD333/xFiXX/DT Solo more "suitable" than a Pro V/Z-Star/B330 to a higher handicap golfer?

 

[GB72]

I raised this point when Titleist did an online fitting with the forum as everyone had a Pro V of some sort as their best ball then another as the second best. If I recall the response was that Titleist are strongly of the opinion that a version of the Pro V is the best ball for every golfer and the other options are only there for those that do not want or cannot afford to pay the high price of a premium ball. To me that sort of diminishes the benefit of these ball fitting events when the person giving the advice has already pre-determined that one of two options is the best for you before seeing anything.

 

[pokerjoke]

Can I ask a question?


As far as im aware,there is a reason a prov1 is a premium ball.
Purely for the fact that it suits a premium player.
A player that has a pure strike.
As im aware a prov1 produces more spin around the green,and off the driver.
A high handicapper will have flaws in his swing that will exasperate the spin,hence sliced drives.
Also around the green he will not consistently produce a pure strike to generate the spin a prov needs.
The way I just read the Titleist philosophy just tells me that a prov1 cant suit a 28 handicapper the same
as a single figure golfer.

 

[BoadieBroadus]

Can I ask a question?






OK thanks



For those, including the OP, who don't understand why a Pro V1 (Or any premium ball for that matter) isn't suitable for a high handicapper, could you elaborate as to why?

Price aside, what makes an AD333/xFiXX/DT Solo more "suitable" than a Pro V/Z-Star/B330 to a higher handicap golfer?

My response to this is not that a pro v isn't suitable, just that the quality and consistency of strike made by the high handicapper just doesn't make any use of the technology in the more advanced ball.

Take "control around the green" as mentioned by the 28 handicapper. to an advanced player the pro v offers consistent spin and check which means that the player can make contact with the ball with the sweetspot of the wedge and rely on his own distance control and reliable spin on the ball to check the ball up near the hole for a makeable putt.

the higher handicapper's short game shots will be very inconsistent and will rarely hit the type of crisp descending blow needed to impart a consistent level of spin, if he can obtain any spin or check at all. so the soft consistent spin properties of the top level ball is largely lost on him because he can't hit a consistent shot to rely on the properties of the ball.

in theory, yes the high handicapper wants to get the ball close, in reality he wants to chip it somewhere on the green where he can 2 putt from at worst. he can do that as easily with a pts as he can with a pro v. maybe the test was supposed to disprove this, but my experience in playing golf with all types of handicappers tells me that the higher handicapper sees no difference.

so using a premium ball doesn't harm his golf, but neither does it give him any benefit. it's no more or less suitable than any other ball because they can't really see any difference in results. most of the time.

 

[Hacker Khan]

Not that it is directly related but Titleist do not submit their clubs for comparison tests in Todays Golfer. And I am sure I read saw in the past they don't submit Pro V1s for ball comparison tests either. Although I may be wrong on the ball front, apologies to Titleist if I am.

But someone asked today on twitter why there was no Titleist clubs in the club test in this months TG and the mag tweeted back to say that they didn't submit any. Which to me is poor form and smacks a bit to me of being scardy cats.

 

[Hacker Khan]

My response to this is not that a pro v isn't suitable, just that the quality and consistency of strike made by the high handicapper just doesn't make any use of the technology in the more advanced ball.

Take "control around the green" as mentioned by the 28 handicapper. to an advanced player the pro v offers consistent spin and check which means that the player can make contact with the ball with the sweetspot of the wedge and rely on his own distance control and reliable spin on the ball to check the ball up near the hole for a makeable putt.

the higher handicapper's short game shots will be very inconsistent and will rarely hit the type of crisp descending blow needed to impart a consistent level of spin, if he can obtain any spin or check at all. so the soft consistent spin properties of the top level ball is largely lost on him because he can't hit a consistent shot to rely on the properties of the ball.

in theory, yes the high handicapper wants to get the ball close, in reality he wants to chip it somewhere on the green where he can 2 putt from at worst. he can do that as easily with a pts as he can with a pro v. maybe the test was supposed to disprove this, but my experience in playing golf with all types of handicappers tells me that the higher handicapper sees no difference.

so using a premium ball doesn't harm his golf, but neither does it give him any benefit. it's no more or less suitable than any other ball because they can't really see any difference in results. most of the time.

Good point very well made.

 

[DCB]

Okay, when we did an online fitting a while back I was recommended the NXT Tour S ball after putting in my info. I did get a sample of these and they did work well for me. I used them for the rest of last season and at the start of this season. Good ball and it does seem to work for me with my current game.

So, I wasn't recommended the ProV1 or ProV1X at that time.

Just find it strange that so many are recommended that ball. Could it be that we are looking at our stats as 'best ever' rather than 'average' ball strike/flight/shape stats ?

 

[One Planer]

My response to this is not that a pro v isn't suitable, just that the quality and consistency of strike made by the high handicapper just doesn't make any use of the technology in the more advanced ball.

Take "control around the green" as mentioned by the 28 handicapper. to an advanced player the pro v offers consistent spin and check which means that the player can make contact with the ball with the sweetspot of the wedge and rely on his own distance control and reliable spin on the ball to check the ball up near the hole for a makeable putt.

the higher handicapper's short game shots will be very inconsistent and will rarely hit the type of crisp descending blow needed to impart a consistent level of spin, if he can obtain any spin or check at all. so the soft consistent spin properties of the top level ball is largely lost on him because he can't hit a consistent shot to rely on the properties of the ball.

in theory, yes the high handicapper wants to get the ball close, in reality he wants to chip it somewhere on the green where he can 2 putt from at worst. he can do that as easily with a pts as he can with a pro v. maybe the test was supposed to disprove this, but my experience in playing golf with all types of handicappers tells me that the higher handicapper sees no difference.

so using a premium ball doesn't harm his golf, but neither does it give him any benefit. it's no more or less suitable than any other ball because they can't really see any difference in results. most of the time.

Agree.

As I said earlier in the thread. It's all about choice off-set by a persons financial position.

Take myself as an example.

I play off 16. Do I get the most from a Pro V1, absolutley 100% definately not.

However, I do find the ball excellent. It deliveres good distance, I like the limited amount of control I can generate with it and it's nice to putt with.

I don't lose too many balls, so I have no issue paying £35+/ Dozen.

Would an NXT or NXT tour be better suited to me? Arguably yes, but why change if I've settled on a ball and am happy with how it peforms?

I supose the point of my question was to ask why people find it neccecery use handicap as a guide to what ball to use?

 

[Evesdad]

I don't see why high hcps can't use a premium ball. Being one myself I quite like the prov1x but at the cost i get through too many. I have quite a decent short game for my hcp and do see benefits from using a cheaper ball. As said before its the cover that creates spin, the irons and wedges have grooves and so add more spin whereas the driver doesn't. I've actually found my drives can be better with a premium ball but as said if I put a shonky swing on it it's going to hook/slice no matter what ball I'm using I don't see these premium balls carving anymore than a cheaper ball.

Although I was sceptical as last year at golf live titielst also recommended me the 2 prov versions, maybe they are the best and their other balls are based on a cost basis.

 

[Hacker Khan]

To me that sort of diminishes the benefit of these ball fitting events when the person giving the advice has already pre-determined that one of two options is the best for you before seeing anything.

One may say 'sort of diminishes the benefit', other may say it makes them utterly pointless and turns them into just a marketing exercise for pro V1s

As all you get is 'fitted' (and I use that word lightly in this case) for either for a ProV1 or a Pro V1 X. And in reality how many people having these fittings have a low enough handicap that they can honestly and truthfully tell the difference between a Pro V1 and Pro V1X, and that the subsequent choice will make a difference to their game? Which I thought was the whole point of being fitted

God I am getting cynical in my old age.

 

[Hacker Khan]

I don't see why high hcps can't use a premium ball..

Don't think anyone has said high handicappers cant use the balls, just that there may be better value options out there and that the benefits the higher handicappers may get are not worth the increased price you pay for them. But of course it's free world and anyone can play the ball they want.

By the way I also can't do with the attitude of saying that you have to be below a handicap of X to play with this or that. It's just that I have a problem when a manufacturer is recommending their most expensive option no matter what.