clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
Agree .
Hes been there long enough to know that’s not acceptable.
So why is he behaving like this ?
Does he want UTD to get rid of him.?
Maybe they should ,that might teach him a lesson!
Hes been there long enough to know that’s not acceptable.
So why is he behaving like this ?
Does he want UTD to get rid of him.?
Maybe they should ,that might teach him a lesson!
Assuming he has been unprofessional, and went on the razz on a school night what on earth was going through his head… he’s a Manchester lad playing for the club he grew up supporting. It’s one of the biggest clubs in the world. If he does want out, who’s going to take him if he’s being unprofessional? Who can afford to take him? Of the top clubs worldwide, who needs him when his form and attitude is so poor? If he wants out he needs to knuckle down, show some form and bang in a transfer request.
If this is a player ‘v’ manager/club I hope it’s a battle he loses. Utd can’t keep allowing the dressing room to dictate policy, and certainly can’t keep paying up outgoing manager’s contracts.
Sounds like he needs a Fergie to tell him a few home truths in no uncertain terms.
Pin-seeker
Well-known member
Talking to a lad at work about this yesterday and said imagine if he did that under Fergie.
But if Fergie was to get involved then ETH might aswell resign.
I get the impression that he hasn’t got the respect of the players as it is.
Swango1980
Well-known member
I think this runs much much deeper than any manager. I think a culture within the club may well have built up over the years, one of entitlement. A culture where young players think they are untouchable. How can anyone criticise them, they play for Man Utd after all. Playing for a huge club, that had recently enjoyed huge success under Fergie years. Probably think they've made it to the big time as soon as they join the Under 12's.
Then they make it to the 1st team and realise Fergie years are over. The team they play for is inferior to many, and the players realise it is much harder than they expected. They aren't the world class stars they were told they were as youngsters. They can't just show up to games and win by default. If they don't work to the maximum, forget being competitive with City and Liverpool, they'll struggle against sides like Bournemouth and Palace. At which point they'll blame everyone around them. Can't be their fault as they are world class, must be the manager and coaching staff.
The above might not be far from truth, when you think of players like Rashford, Greenwood, Lingard, Ravel Morrison, etc. And other players coming in may easily fall into that culture as they all become buddies, like Martial.
Maybe that culture will naturally change eventually, as being associated with Man Utd as a kid is becoming less and less prestigious as 1st team has been a circus. But I also wonder if the whole set up of people that work in the club needs big changes, the open heart surgery Ragnick suggested. Get people in there that can be great mentors, and people that can give players a strong mentality and great attitude. Otherwise, I don't think any 1st team coach has a chance. Not if so many of the team's core have stinking attitudes, regardless of what is said to them.
I suspect Ratcliffe will look into all these aspects in detail, get top people in at a high level and then they can hopefully start restructuring the club beneath them. Fingers crossed anyway.
In a decent sized, well run business a manager would refer disciplinary issues to HR for support. Equally, whilst I think ETH is a decent manager from a football perspective, I feel there may be an internal issue in how he handles confrontation. Did he handle Harry Maguire, Jadon Sancho and now Rashford well, and they’re just the ones we have heard about?
Chicken & egg? Is there a culture within Utd’s dressing room that makes it extremely difficult for even the best managers? Or have Utd been picking poor managers?
Pin-seeker
Well-known member
Yes I agree maybe someone else could get involved,even his mother.
But I just think if Fergie got involved it sends a bad message.
Swango1980
Well-known member
As per my above post, I think if Fergie was in charge now the players would do exactly the same.
Difference was, Fergie had control of whole club and the staff that worked there. He could kick out the clubs top players if he wanted, let alone youngsters that he didn't think were up to it.
No manager will probably ever get that sort of control again. Clubs are so massive now, probably many more players to deal with, many of whom are on gigantic salaries where clubs can't as easily bin.
Of course, Utd fans were crying out for discipline at the club before Ten Hag came in. I think many Utd fans are happy Ten Hag is doing that, although the media (usually non Man Utd fans) have been critical of him in doing so. At end of day, if players are not acting right and been disciplined, they probably aren't going to be best mates with the manager. Question is, do they have the character to see their faults and improve, or is that beyond them due to stubbornness?
Swango1980
Well-known member
I think he was trying to deal with Sancho for a long long time, before things kicked off in media. He even sent him to Netherlands to try and help him.
Maguire has been nothing but professional, so I don't see there being an issue there with the manager. He took him out of the side, and just about everyone agreed. The club considered selling him as everyone knew he wasn't first choice (but Ten Hag, as I remember it, didn't tell the world this. He actually said he'd still like him to stay, but understood it was difficult for Maguire not starting). Maguire wanted to stay.
And Rashford just seems to have a week mentality. It isn't a football manager he needs, he needs Robin Williams in Good Will Hunting.
D
Deleted member 21784
Guest
Removed him as captain tho. When does that ever really go down well? Even if a captain isn't playing very rarely is a new captain fully appointed until that captain leaves the club.
That was very poor management
I think it has become a player culture thing knowing that most managers will fine them two weeks wages and maybe put them on the bench and that will be an end of it so no more than a slap on the wrist. I think there were/are some managers that would take a harder line. Fergie is the obvious one but I think Klopp and Arteta would perhaps take a dimmer view and a player could well find themselves frozen out for a while. I think the players know ETH hasn't got the gumption, or the squad to take the hard line
Tashyboy
Please don’t ask to see my tatts 👍
I have been reading on some City Sites than fans should support Walker and that the press is giving him to much stick. These are the same fans that thought Rooney and Beckham were fair game when sleeping around. 
Re Rashford, if I went home and told me mum I had been fined £600k she would go ballistic. So why are his parents not pulling up their son/ a role model. I would seriously question the people that Rashford is hanging around with. They are not a good influence. The problem is that Southgate will pick him for England Ten Haag will pick him for Utd.
£600k to him is like £10 to me.
Re Rashford, if I went home and told me mum I had been fined £600k she would go ballistic. So why are his parents not pulling up their son/ a role model. I would seriously question the people that Rashford is hanging around with. They are not a good influence. The problem is that Southgate will pick him for England Ten Haag will pick him for Utd.
£600k to him is like £10 to me.
Swango1980
Well-known member
He removed him as Captain after club had effectively decided to sell him at start of season.
If that had gone according to plan, yet he had started the season keeping him as Captain, Ten Hag would have been hung out to dry. He'd have been left without a Captain, and then a few weeks into season have to select another.
Swango1980
Well-known member
Your last line is a joke, right. Are you forgetting Sancho, forgetting Maguire forgetting Ronaldo?
Many complaints on Ten Hag is he has been too hard on players, yet you think he won't take the hard line???
Tashyboy
Please don’t ask to see my tatts 👍
If TH has been taking a hard line why are players still being idiots. Surely they would and should learn from other players being disciplined, fined and shipped out.
Swango1980
Well-known member
Sancho was completely dropped from the side and training with the 1st team. Did he learn? What more should ETH done. Got him over his knee and given him a good spanking?
It seems too many players have fallen into that attitude of entitlement, and never accepting thet are the ones who need to change. If there is no discipline, they just do what they want. If there is discipline, they huff.
I think there are too many players that are past saving. And because a lot of them hang out together, the bad influences spread.
Slime
Tour Winner
Who would take him on at that salary? How many years does he have left on his contract? If something has to give then it is Utd having to take another massive hit on a big payout, subsidising his wages whilst he plays for another team etc.
Manchester United say Marcus Rashford 'disciplinary matter closed'
Manchester United say forward Marcus Rashford "has taken responsibility for his actions" after reports he was seen in nightspots in Northern Ireland.www.bbc.co.uk
Read elsewhere that he’s been fined something like £600k - so the standard two weeks wages. This can’t go on, surely. Something has to give.
I think it would be healthier for both parties for him to move on but I am not sure who would take him on the term he is currently on.
It happened all the time under Fergie but it wasn’t as well known because people didn’t have camera phones and there wasn’t a drive to put everything on social media.
Tashyboy
Please don’t ask to see my tatts 👍
I think they get to a stage where they think they are untouchable coupled with the fact they think they have
“ made it”.
Bunkermagnet
Journeyman Pro
I would say UTD are a goup of individuals, nothing more. They are not a club with players all working for each other. That is evident, and that is why they will continue to keep sliding down.
