The Footie Thread

[Deleted member 16999]

I see no reason as to why this isnt possible to some extent to be honest.

Theres been a few corners for and against villa this season where its quite evident it was the wrong call - and as of yet, no goals have been scored on these occasions - but if one was, and it wasnt actually a corner, id be fuming if my team conceded.

Its a 2 second job for VAR to check who has the last contact on the ball. It isnt down to opinion or fine margins either.

I believe going back a few years they (the authorities) took the decision not to include Corners or Throw-ins to VAR’s remit as there would be too many stop start moments to the game.

 

[Orikoru]

Mate, without sounding rude, you are taking it out of context, my reply was a response to this year between him and Messi, I never said he should never win it or disagreed with any of the reasons you put.

Lewandowski is a superb player that I very much admire, but as I’ve also said I believe Salah should win it this year and I don’t think Egypt will ever win anything either.

The fact is you're probably right and winning the Copa America will be the excuse they use to give it back to Messi again. I always find it slightly odd when team trophies are used as justification in individual player awards, as nobody wins a trophy as a one man team. But they've pretty much always done the Ballon D'Or that way.

 

[clubchamp98]

Short of sacking the linesman for making a mistake (for a linesman who never makes mistakes), how would they sort it? Extend the use of VAR to checking when a corner is won? What about a throw in deep in the opponents half? Maybe we sack all the officials, and ask VAR to ref the entire game?

I agree with the shirt pull rule, no idea what is and what is not allowed. Another thing that really bugs me is when there is a little heated exchange between players, which happened in Newcastle game. Rondon simply was closest to sceen, and effectively broke it up by getting in the way. He did it in the most calm manner, and effectively stopped the angry opponent from getting close to the one he was having a go at. Yet, the referees feel the need that a yellow card for each team is the automatic penalty, and so he blindly gave Rondon a yellow simply because he was closet to the scene. Had he had a second yellow card, that would really be an injustice.

There must be plenty of Lino’s that can see that’s offside in the lower leagues.
They are supposed to be professionals now.
They used to put the flag up as soon as the offside player made an attempt for the ball.
So it goes out for a corner, but the flags up as he’s offside.
Remember the Lovren one when Spurs scored ? He’s offside.
They have messed with the rules so much nobody knows what’s going on now including some officials.

But if he didn’t see that offside he should not be in the PL imo.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

The fact is you're probably right and winning the Copa America will be the excuse they use to give it back to Messi again. I always find it slightly odd when team trophies are used as justification in individual player awards, as nobody wins a trophy as a one man team. But they've pretty much always done the Ballon D'Or that way.

Apparently it’s already been leaked and Messi has won it!
They tell the winner a few days before so the ceremony goes without a hitch, someone in his inner circle has leaked it.

 

[Bdill93]

The fact is you're probably right and winning the Copa America will be the excuse they use to give it back to Messi again. I always find it slightly odd when team trophies are used as justification in individual player awards, as nobody wins a trophy as a one man team. But they've pretty much always done the Ballon D'Or that way.

Give it to Jorginho then.. Won the Euros and CL this year!

 

[clubchamp98]

This is the result of playing on when the refs know its offside. I think the liners are programmed to just play on.

I understand the really tight ones but that was pathetic yesterday. I genuinely believe the liner tboight he was onside. It's a mistake.

I would've liked to have seen yernited score from the corner just to see how the PL/FA/PGMOL would've reacted.

The whole crowd knew that was offside!
Tight ones yes but that wasn’t even close.
I never like seeing UTD score.
But someone’s going to get badly hurt playing on like this.
That might be what it takes Unfortunatly.

 

[Bdill93]

I believe going back a few years they (the authorities) took the decision not to include Corners or Throw-ins to VAR’s remit as there would be too many stop start moments to the game.

Stupid decision though. Cant go half arsed into something!

Ive been at a game when a peno was awarded seconds before half time this year, minutes after the incident occured - peno missed and then they allowed him a rebound shot when it should have been blown dead...

If you can wait 5 minutes to award a peno, you can scratch off a goal 3 minutes later after checking the corner was indeed a corner.

 

[clubchamp98]

Short of sacking the linesman for making a mistake (for a linesman who never makes mistakes), how would they sort it? Extend the use of VAR to checking when a corner is won? What about a throw in deep in the opponents half? Maybe we sack all the officials, and ask VAR to ref the entire game?

I agree with the shirt pull rule, no idea what is and what is not allowed. Another thing that really bugs me is when there is a little heated exchange between players, which happened in Newcastle game. Rondon simply was closest to sceen, and effectively broke it up by getting in the way. He did it in the most calm manner, and effectively stopped the angry opponent from getting close to the one he was having a go at. Yet, the referees feel the need that a yellow card for each team is the automatic penalty, and so he blindly gave Rondon a yellow simply because he was closet to the scene. Had he had a second yellow card, that would really be an injustice.

I would tell all the players as well.
“ while a VAR decision is being looked at any whinging and harassing of the ref will be a yellow card”
It’s pathetic.

 

[Orikoru]

Give it to Jorginho then.. Won the Euros and CL this year!

You laugh but some people genuinely were suggesting that.

 

[clubchamp98]

Stupid decision though. Cant go half arsed into something!

Ive been at a game when a peno was awarded seconds before half time this year, minutes after the incident occured - peno missed and then they allowed him a rebound shot when it should have been blown dead...

If you can wait 5 minutes to award a peno, you can scratch off a goal 3 minutes later after checking the corner was indeed a corner.

Wasn’t really the corner award. But see your point.
You can have a goal disallowed because your toenail is offside.
But VAR can’t tell the officials that it’s not a corner as he was two yards offside.
They are there to help the ref get it right, and should he ( Lino) make a clear and obvious error he should be told imo.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

You laugh but some people genuinely were suggesting that.

Ballon d’Or shortlist in full

• Cesar Azpilicueta (Chelsea)
• Nicolo Barella (Inter Milan)
• Karim Benzema (Real Madrid)
• Leonardo Bonucci (Juventus)
• Kevin De Bruyne (Manchester City)
• Giorgio Chiellini (Juventus)
• Cristiano Ronaldo (Manchester United)
• Ruben Dias (Manchester City)
• Gianluigi Donnarumma (Paris Saint-Germain)
• Bruno Fernandes (Manchester United)
• Phil Foden (Manchester City)
• Erling Haaland (Borussia Dortmund)
• Jorginho (Chelsea)
• Harry Kane (Tottenham)
• N’Golo Kante (Chelsea)
• Simon Kjaer (AC Milan)
• Robert Lewandowski (Bayern Munich)
• Romelu Lukaku (Chelsea)
• Riyad Mahrez (Manchester City)
• Lautaro Martinez (Inter Milan)
• Kylian Mbappe (Paris Saint-Germain)
• Lionel Messi (Paris Saint-Germain)
• Luka Modric (Real Madrid)
• Gerard Moreno (Villarreal)
• Mason Mount (Chelsea)
• Neymar (Paris Saint-Germain)
• Pedri (Barcelona)
• Mohamed Salah (Liverpool)
• Raheem Sterling (Manchester City)
• Luis Suarez (Atletico Madrid)

 

[clubchamp98]

Ballon d’Or shortlist in full

• Cesar Azpilicueta (Chelsea)
• Nicolo Barella (Inter Milan)
• Karim Benzema (Real Madrid)
• Leonardo Bonucci (Juventus)
• Kevin De Bruyne (Manchester City)
• Giorgio Chiellini (Juventus)
• Cristiano Ronaldo (Manchester United)
• Ruben Dias (Manchester City)
• Gianluigi Donnarumma (Paris Saint-Germain)
• Bruno Fernandes (Manchester United)
• Phil Foden (Manchester City)
• Erling Haaland (Borussia Dortmund)
• Jorginho (Chelsea)
• Harry Kane (Tottenham)
• N’Golo Kante (Chelsea)
• Simon Kjaer (AC Milan)
• Robert Lewandowski (Bayern Munich)
• Romelu Lukaku (Chelsea)
• Riyad Mahrez (Manchester City)
• Lautaro Martinez (Inter Milan)
• Kylian Mbappe (Paris Saint-Germain)
• Lionel Messi (Paris Saint-Germain)
• Luka Modric (Real Madrid)
• Gerard Moreno (Villarreal)
• Mason Mount (Chelsea)
• Neymar (Paris Saint-Germain)
• Pedri (Barcelona)
• Mohamed Salah (Liverpool)
• Raheem Sterling (Manchester City)
• Luis Suarez (Atletico Madrid)

Kane ?

 

[Lord Tyrion]

I would tell all the players as well.
“ while a VAR decision is being looked at any whinging and harassing of the ref will be a yellow card”
It’s pathetic.

I can't remember whether it was Utd or Chelsea players doing it but at one point yesterday there was an incident and a group of players were surrounding the ref, right in his face, hands together in prayer, pleading and screaming at him to change his decision. It is going to be checked, stop it! It was horrible when players did this in the past but now there is even less excuse. I'm with you, book them, it will stop the dramatics.

 

[Swango1980]

I see no reason as to why this isnt possible to some extent to be honest.

Theres been a few corners for and against villa this season where its quite evident it was the wrong call - and as of yet, no goals have been scored on these occasions - but if one was, and it wasnt actually a corner, id be fuming if my team conceded.

Its a 2 second job for VAR to check who has the last contact on the ball. It isnt down to opinion or fine margins either.

It could be done, yes. Although, as mentioned, it would require more stoppages. And, a corner is not always won after an attack breaks down, but perhaps a throw in. Or, the ball may stay in play, and the attacking team somehow keep possession, play it back, and x passes later get another scoring chance. Imagine all the extra stoppages in play if VAR was introduced to more phases of a game rather than just immediate goals. At one stage yesterday, Chelsea seemed to be getting waves of corners, I wouldn't fancy having to wait for each one as VAR looked back to see if anything untoward happened that lead to that corner. On one hand fans want VAR gone as it has been disruptive enough, on the other hand fans are asking VAR to be used for even more parts of the game.

 

[Swango1980]

There must be plenty of Lino’s that can see that’s offside in the lower leagues.
They are supposed to be professionals now.
They used to put the flag up as soon as the offside player made an attempt for the ball.
So it goes out for a corner, but the flags up as he’s offside.
Remember the Lovren one when Spurs scored ? He’s offside.
They have messed with the rules so much nobody knows what’s going on now including some officials.

But if he didn’t see that offside he should not be in the PL imo.

That is exactly what would have happened had the linesman seen that Ronaldo was offside. He didn't see it, he didn't put his flag up. It was the wrong call, end of.

I doubt he is the only linesman in the world that would not have seen it? If we stop play a fraction of a second before the pass was played, where were the players? Were there any players across the pitch blocking his view at any time around the pass was played. I'd imagine human reaction time would find it impossible get a still snap shot of exactly were all the players were at the time the pass is played. I have seen much more shocking decisions from linesmen in the past than this wrong offside call. I am sure there have been even bigger shockers in lower league. And, there will be even bigger shockers in the future, especially if we stick to on field officials making human decisions for much of the game, instead of VAR taking most of this out of their hands.

I could be hugely critical of the official. It was a clear mistake. But, I have to assume that he has passed a fair few stringent tests to get to where he is in the game, and so his competence must be fairly high. I also assume he has not been bribed. I've no doubt if I was to run the line next weekend, I'd probably make some absolute shockers, things I do not see that are as clear as day when I get to see a replay. My mate had to ref in an over 35's league a few months ago for the first time, and suddenly realised being a ref is not as easy as it seems when you watch it on TV, and found himself having to guess many times. Put the role of being a match official into perspective.

 

[Bdill93]

It could be done, yes. Although, as mentioned, it would require more stoppages. And, a corner is not always won after an attack breaks down, but perhaps a throw in. Or, the ball may stay in play, and the attacking team somehow keep possession, play it back, and x passes later get another scoring chance. Imagine all the extra stoppages in play if VAR was introduced to more phases of a game rather than just immediate goals. At one stage yesterday, Chelsea seemed to be getting waves of corners, I wouldn't fancy having to wait for each one as VAR looked back to see if anything untoward happened that lead to that corner. On one hand fans want VAR gone as it has been disruptive enough, on the other hand fans are asking VAR to be used for even more parts of the game.

Im more pro VAR than I am against it. I believe it does lead to correct decisions and improves the game on the whole. I just dont like a half arsed approach. You only need to check the outcome if it leads directly to a goal from the last dead ball situation. With modern tech that literally takes seconds. Plenty of sports use video tech and use it so well, its hard to believe football cant too.

 

[Swango1980]

I would tell all the players as well.
“ while a VAR decision is being looked at any whinging and harassing of the ref will be a yellow card”
It’s pathetic.

Agreed. I can maybe understand them shouting for a penalty or a foul leading to a goal, as they might feel it wakes the VAR up a bit to actually look at it (if players do not make a fuss, I get the impression VAR will just leave it alone). However, once the ref says that VAR are looking at it, players should just shut up. It will be the VAR red that will decide if there is a reason a decision should be changed, and if they do the ref will likely change that decision once he reviews the monitor)

 

[Swango1980]

Im more pro VAR than I am against it. I believe it does lead to correct decisions and improves the game on the whole. I just dont like a half arsed approach. You only need to check the outcome if it leads directly to a goal from the last dead ball situation. With modern tech that literally takes seconds. Plenty of sports use video tech and use it so well, its hard to believe football cant too.

So, you'd allow the corner, but only check if the corner should have been given if that corner leads to a goal? You could be checking an incident that happened minutes ago, especially if subs are made in between, a players takes ages to take the corner, the ref has to hold up play as players are pushing in box, or the corner is taken, but it leads to a bit of drama in the box before goal is scored (rather than just scoring directly from the cross by heading it in). And, what about throw ins? Maybe say no for them, but then if a team has a Rory Delap in their side, a corner was preferable to a throw in for the defending side.

I agree VAR will make more correct decisions, but I still feel it has made the game really sterile and stale. Virtually any time my team scores a goal, I'm half delighted, but half thinking is there a potential offside to check. That fear remains with me until the teams kick off again. It has taken out a lot of the immediate joy in the game, as before VAR you knew a goal would be disallowed within seconds.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

A question for everyone. Has anyone ever seen an incident where the ref has gone across to the pitch side monitor and not changed his initial decision?

There was a big fuss about this happening this season but if all that they do is follow the recommendation of the ref back in ref HQ then are they really making the change themselves? Is there any point to them going across to the monitor? As soon as they do we know the decision will be reversed. Unless someone can remember a situation where this did not happen.......

 

[Swango1980]

A question for everyone. Has anyone ever seen an incident where the ref has gone across to the pitch side monitor and not changed his initial decision?

There was a big fuss about this happening this season but if all that they do is follow the recommendation of the ref back in ref HQ then are they really making the change themselves? Is there any point to them going across to the monitor? As soon as they do we know the decision will be reversed. Unless someone can remember a situation where this did not happen.......

I saw it happen once last season, but cannot remember the game or the ref. However, you are right, if the VAR asks the ref to have a look, it is ONLY because the VAR thinks he made a mistake. The only real decision the on field ref can realistically make in 99% of all cases is agree with VAR, as VAR is a trained ref like him, but also has all the camera angles / slow motions / etc. If the on field ref sticks with his original decision, they could easily come across as arrogant, as they are essentially saying to VAR "I know you have much more info than me, but you are wrong and I am right". Plus, they are all mates / colleagues, so at the very least they'd support their VAR mate by going with him, as the on field ref always has the easy get out clause that they got it wrong because it was difficult to see in real time from their position.