The Footie Thread

[Don Barzini]

You lot moan about Referees and VAR, the officiating down the pyramid is like the Wild West!

Aldershot keeper last night comes out to clear a ball. Attacker gets there after he's kicked it and cleans him out. Red card.... for the keeper.

I'd love to hear the chat when that appeal is reviewed.

Got a link to any footage of it? Google wasn't my friend.

 

[Don Barzini]

It seems the Saudi Pro League Transfer window is open until the 10th September

Seems stupid to have mismatch of windows

Anyone see any further high profile transfers going there ?

Hoping a couple of Forest fringe players who aren't going to make the squad go there for more than they're really worth.

 

[IanM]

Got a link to any footage of it? Google wasn't my friend.

Had to chop it to fit. Guy in red slams into keeper when ball gone, the rolls around on the floor. The Ref, "Durkin" is a known wally!

Could (should) have sent off the forward off for late clatter of the keeper.

 

[Swango1980]

Had to chop it to fit. Guy in red slams into keeper when ball gone, the rolls around on the floor. The Ref, "Durkin" is a known wally!

Could (should) have sent off the forward off for late clatter of the keeper.
View attachment 59306

I'll trust your account of it, but I'll hold judgement until I see a video. Pictures can be misleading. He clearly looks to win the ball first from that pic, I certainly agree with that. Did he follow through high perhaps? Or kick it against striker, deflecting ball towards goal and then inadvertently stop the strikers run?

 

[IanM]

Ball ended up in the other end of the pitch from the clearance. He jyst ran out and kicked the ball.

The video on Facebook won't load on here properly.

 

[Don Barzini]

Been thinking about the VAR issues - things like the Fulham disallowed goal last week.

Why can't Howard Webb tell his team the following:

"Right lads. When you're about to make a VAR decision, the acid test is as follows. Stop for a moment and ask yourselves if anyone could justifiably use the phrase "The game's gone" about the decision you're about to make. If the answer is "Yes", just don't make that decision. We'll get far less abuse."

Realise it wouldn't solve all issues, but I think it would go a decent way towards improvement.

 

[Swango1980]

Been thinking about the VAR issues - things like the Fulham disallowed goal last week.

Why can't Howard Webb tell his team the following:

"Right lads. When you're about to make a VAR decision, the acid test is as follows. Stop for a moment and ask yourselves if anyone could justifiably use the phrase "The game's gone" about the decision you're about to make. If the answer is "Yes", just don't make that decision. We'll get far less abuse."

Realise it wouldn't solve all issues, but I think it would go a decent way towards improvement.

Sadly, there are plenty of incidents that some fans will say "the games gone", but if VAR doesn't intervene, there will also be many fans kicking up a storm that VAR didn't get the ref to review it.

But, for the Fulham incident, it just seems simply bizarre VAR acted, because I've not heard any other person think it was a foul in any way, shape or form. I've heard the VAR chat. It seems like the VAR guy had simply fallen down the rabbit hole of looking at it in so much detail, seeing a Chelsea player on the ground, and finding ways to convince himself a foul had taken place. And when the on-field ref came over to review it, it was almost as if he was already prepared to accept VAR's version (because VAR should only act if they think the original call was most likely wrong, so based on probability, VAR should almost always be right), so his instinct was to immediately agree with his colleague. Rather than, for once just saying "hang on a second here, the Fulham player was challenged, not making a challenge. It was a natural movement to receive the ball, it is definitely not a foul. Why did you even get me to delay the game for this, come on lads, be better"

 

[clubchamp98]

Ive got sympathy for Marc. He fancied the move to Liverpool and we had told him he could go if we found a suitable replacement and both Glasner and Parish have said that.

We didn't though and therefore for me he had to stay. I think Marc, as long as he knows we tried as hard as we could to replace him, will understand that. Our first choice pulled a hamstring and also apparently lost a bit of interest when we lost our Europa place,.the next one from Milan relied on them signing a replacement (Gomez apparently) so that fell down and the 3rd choice at the last minute demanded a guaranteed starting place which apparently West Ham were willing to provide and we were not. Left us with no replacement and Parish decided to pull it. He also wanted to reduce the risk of Glasner leaving and with no replacement he might have walked (the stories that Glasner pulled the deal are compelte rubbish by the way as are so many of the stuff we are fed. There are press saying Marc may rip up his contract, hand in the captaincy or down tools, all complete rubbbish). Marc understands how it all works and will bide his time. We will be offering him a huge new contract with a low release clause soon in the hope he signs it, which might get us some money for him when he does go, but even if he does not keeping Marc is worth a lot of money and gives us a great chance to have another decent year.

Thanks for a reasoned reply.
While I understand the clubs reasons it’s not a great outcome for a model pro given Isak and Wissas way of forcing their moves.
Money talks.

 

[clubchamp98]

Presumably Palace knew there was a chance they could replace Guehi on the last day, so they were happy to accept Liverpool's offer, so that if Palace get in the replacement at the last minute, the Guehi deal could happen. But, it was always on conditional on them getting the replacement. As that didn't happen, Guehi stayed.

It doesn't seem that strange, it seems very logical. If Liverpool were desperate to get Guehi and get him in well before deadline day, they could have tried to increase their offer, making it high enough that Palace couldn't turn it down. But, Liverpool didn't want to do that, and were happy to risk leaving it until the last moment. And risks don't always work out for the best, which is why it is a risk.

It seems it wasn’t about money though!
It was more his replacement backed out for whatever reason.

So £35/50 million in the bank is no good if you have no CB.

 

[clubchamp98]

Had to chop it to fit. Guy in red slams into keeper when ball gone, the rolls around on the floor. The Ref, "Durkin" is a known wally!

Could (should) have sent off the forward off for late clatter of the keeper.
View attachment 59306

I’m sure they will get a nice apology.

 

[Swango1980]

It seems it wasn’t about money though!
It was more his replacement backed out for whatever reason.

So £35/50 million in the bank is no good if you have no CB.

Money talks eventually. If Liverpool offered £500 million, you can guarantee Palace would have accepted on the spot.

Extreme example, but if palace were eventually prepared to accept a fee of £35 million, if Liverpool started offering £40, 45, 50 million, etc, then at some point it would have been much easier for Palace to say yes without waiting for a replacement.

 

[clubchamp98]

Been thinking about the VAR issues - things like the Fulham disallowed goal last week.

Why can't Howard Webb tell his team the following:

"Right lads. When you're about to make a VAR decision, the acid test is as follows. Stop for a moment and ask yourselves if anyone could justifiably use the phrase "The game's gone" about the decision you're about to make. If the answer is "Yes", just don't make that decision. We'll get far less abuse."

Realise it wouldn't solve all issues, but I think it would go a decent way towards improvement.

Most refs have never played the game so didn’t know what it looked like in the first place so wouldn’t recognise if it was “ gone”

It’s the only reason I can think of for some of these decisions.

 

[clubchamp98]

Money talks eventually. If Liverpool offered £500 million, you can guarantee Palace would have accepted on the spot.

Extreme example, but if palace were eventually prepared to accept a fee of £35 million, if Liverpool started offering £40, 45, 50 million, etc, then at some point it would have been much easier for Palace to say yes without waiting for a replacement.

They accepted £35 then said no at the last moment!

 

[Swango1980]

Most refs have never played the game so didn’t know what it looked like in the first place so wouldn’t recognise if it was “ gone”

It’s the only reason I can think of for some of these decisions.

I often think that is a poor statement made by ex-player pundits. Most refs have never played the game at a high level, agreed. But, surely most refs have actually played the game to a level most fans have played to? Surely most referees have enjoyed the game to the same level most fans do? Why else would they ever get into refereeing in the first place?

Most (i.e. nearly) all football fans could see the Fulham player did not make a foul. Even football fans who are too unfit and unsporting to have ever actually been able to play football at any level, still know the game well enough to recognize it wasn't a foul. So, using the "the referees have never played the game" doesn't make too much sense when trying to explain why they got it wrong.

Conversely, we have heard the opinions of some pundits who were great players, and occasionally their views are generally viewed as absolute garbage. One of the reasons one of Goldbridge's catch phrases is "I played the game" when he is sarcastically taking the mick out of Graeme Souness, who seemed to use that argument often when trying to justify his own opinion.

 

[Swango1980]

They accepted £35 then said no at the last moment!

Yeah, I know what ended up happening. I was simply saying that they would have said yes earlier and got the deal done, if the offer was high enough

 

[clubchamp98]

I often think that is a poor statement made by ex-player pundits. Most refs have never played the game at a high level, agreed. But, surely most refs have actually played the game to a level most fans have played to? Surely most referees have enjoyed the game to the same level most fans do? Why else would they ever get into refereeing in the first place?

Most (i.e. nearly) all football fans could see the Fulham player did not make a foul. Even football fans who are too unfit and unsporting to have ever actually been able to play football at any level, still know the game well enough to recognize it wasn't a foul. So, using the "the referees have never played the game" doesn't make too much sense when trying to explain why they got it wrong.

Conversely, we have heard the opinions of some pundits who were great players, and occasionally their views are generally viewed as absolute garbage. One of the reasons one of Goldbridge's catch phrases is "I played the game" when he is sarcastically taking the mick out of Graeme Souness, who seemed to use that argument often when trying to justify his own opinion.

I can understand a ref making a mistake.
But for VAR it should not happen.

How he managed to convert the ref to say that’s a careless foul by the Fulham player defies belief
That’s the problem imo.

 

[Aztecs27]

I know I'm a few days late, but Christ...end of the window was a bit dramatic wasn't it!

Forest had probably the best window in their history - having upgraded our depth at almost every position....only to have more off-the field drama in not selecting OH in our Europe League squad so of course everyone's kicking off about it calling for Nuno's head (I'm not that arsed personally...someone had to miss out and record signing or not, he's a long term prospect and will get plenty of chances to shine in other comps this season)

If they're going to get rid of Nuno, I just hope they do it sooner than later so that whoever else they end up getting in (would love Glasner ) has time to get stuff sorted.

 

[Don Barzini]

Ooof! Lolz!

 

[Swango1980]

I can understand a ref making a mistake.
But for VAR it should not happen.

How he managed to convert the ref to say that’s a careless foul by the Fulham player defies belief
That’s the problem imo.

Agreed. But it is why I think VAR will never work in the form it is in, regardless of who is asked to operate it. There are just to many subjective opinions, and even when the subjectivity is 0.5% one way, 99.5% the other, 1 time out of 200 the VAR will be in the 0.5% category. And VAR may actually make the correct call for 199 decisions (i.e. to act or to not act), but we'll all have the meltdown the one time they are seen to make the ridiculous call.

So, I still feel a version where the someone from one of the teams can request a VAR call. The onfield ref will be less likely to accept their version, because often it'll probably just be biased. But, if the ref has clearly missed something obvious, the team can point it out, and the ref has the chance to have a more detailed look. I mean, I'm sure that would still bring it's own set of problems, but given I don't think they'll ever scrap VAR, it might be an OK compromise

 

[Skytot]

https://www.tiktok.com/video/7546154542249839879