(Sorry this has been done to death) The solution to slow play is slow play

[Liverpoolphil]

Maybe it should and possibly will, but it'll be in a more friendly manner then what I've been reading.

Use the R&A Guidelines ( even though it's an attitude you don't like ) - they help greatly :thup:

 

[3565]

I never said anything about the R&A. I read your and clubs poor attitude towards it's members IMO.

 

[chrisd]

Pompous letter I'd say!

 

[Smiffy]

Why what exactly is wrong with it - just saying how we want things to happen at our club -

Pompous, condescending, rude, elitist.
Just a few words that spring to mind Phil.
If Cooden sent out a letter to me which included that phrase, it would certainly leave a nasty taste in my mouth.

For years we have discussed trying to get away from the stuffy old fashioned and elitist attitudes of golf clubs..... to make the game more accessible and appealing to a wider audience.
Cooden itself, when discussing dress codes on their website, has a picture of a shirt and tie to reinforce the fact that they expect you to dress appropriately.
This was picked up by another member of the forum and commented on.
It smacks of elitism (or snobbishness), although it doesn't bother me personally.

The phrase that I took offence to in your letter annoys me.

 

[TheDiablo]

I think the problem is that you're only going to hear positive feedback from those that aren't causing the issue...

The bitching and moaning will take place in the little cliques and you won't hear about it.

I 100% commend the club for trying something new, but like others feel that letter is just too long and comes across very authoritarian. Still better than clubs ignoring it though!

 

[garyinderry]

I find no fault with the letter. Great move by the club.

Anyone offended is probably a slow player. How very dare they?

 

[Smiffy]

Anyone offended is probably a slow player. How very dare they?

I took offence at the opening paragraph.
I'm one of the fastest players you could wish to meet.

 

[garyinderry]

You could look at it as a pop at the way other clubs are run. They pride themselves are bastions of good etiquette.

The opening line could be viewed as something to be proud of, not be offended by.

 

[Smiffy]

nThe opening line could be viewed as something to be proud of, not be offended by.

I guess that depends on whether you are a prig or not.

 

[Khamelion]

My answer to slow play, starts with the tour pros:-

Get slow players on the clock, warning, final warning, docked 2 shots, docked another 2 shots then they get refused entry to the next major they were eligible to play in.

For us mere mortals on the Saturday comp, course marshalls around the course and then the same as above.

 

[3565]

My answer to slow play, starts with the tour pros:-

Get slow players on the clock, warning, final warning, docked 2 shots, docked another 2 shots then they get refused entry to the next major they were eligible to play in.

For us mere mortals on the Saturday comp, course marshalls around the course and then the same as above.

I agree, it starts at the top, these are the best in the world, hit the ball better, further, putt & chip better and make less mistakes then us amateurs yet take over 5 hrs in a 3 ball?

 

[Slab]

Re the example letter a few pages back, Phil obviously knows his audience and it may be a cracking letter for them

It’s really difficult to write a letter to a group audience and for everyone to accept the content/format etc but I think this could have done with a proof read from someone skilled in that area

For me this letters not personal enough. It reads as if its directed towards ‘Mr Generic Member’ rather than Mr Liverpool Phil

It’s also very much ‘we have’ or ‘the club has’ etc and I get the whole we are a team thing but if this is from the club president where is the ‘I have...’ ‘I will...’ Where’s the personal touch, the personal commitment etc. It reads like it was written by a committee rather than a real person

It’s also a bit wordy & lengthy and harking back in style with references to 19canteen instead of a pace plan for the future

That may be what that membership need though

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Pompous, condescending, rude, elitist.
Just a few words that spring to mind Phil.
If Cooden sent out a letter to me which included that phrase, it would certainly leave a nasty taste in my mouth.

For years we have discussed trying to get away from the stuffy old fashioned and elitist attitudes of golf clubs..... to make the game more accessible and appealing to a wider audience.
Cooden itself, when discussing dress codes on their website, has a picture of a shirt and tie to reinforce the fact that they expect you to dress appropriately.
This was picked up by another member of the forum and commented on.
It smacks of elitism (or snobbishness), although it doesn't bother me personally.

The phrase that I took offence to in your letter annoys me.

Have to say, rarely, I agree with you Smiffy. I read it twice, once last night after coming in from a night out, (and decided not to comment on what I felt at that time) and again just now and your four words opening the post are spot on.

Is it an intrinsic issue with Woburn? I know every clubs have members who moan like buggery about slow play and hanker after the days you could get done in three hours tops. At my place we can play a Saturday fourball in the roll up at 8.30 (so peak time) and be done inside four hours regularly, including looking got balls. In comps it's still rarely more than four hours, especially playing provisionals.

There are always slow players at every club. Some don't admit they are a problem, some oblivious to it all. It's good to see Woburn trying something but I just don't feel this is the best way of doing it

 

[PhilTheFragger]

Have to say, rarely, I agree with you Smiffy. I read it twice, once last night after coming in from a night out, (and decided not to comment on what I felt at that time) and again just now and your four words opening the post are spot on.

Is it an intrinsic issue with Woburn? I know every clubs have members who moan like buggery about slow play and hanker after the days you could get done in three hours tops. At my place we can play a Saturday fourball in the roll up at 8.30 (so peak time) and be done inside four hours regularly, including looking got balls. In comps it's still rarely more than four hours, especially playing provisionals.

There are always slow players at every club. Some don't admit they are a problem, some oblivious to it all. It's good to see Woburn trying something but I just don't feel this is the best way of doing it

Martin, Its Leighton Buzzard, Not Woburn..... Get with the program

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Martin, Its Leighton Buzzard, Not Woburn..... Get with the program

That'll be the hangover kicking in then

 

[pokerjoke]

This is an example of a letter to send to members

Good Etiquette; or, the way we do things around here
The oncoming Masters reminds us that the golf season is getting into full swing, and already we have had some feedback to suggest that a timely reminder on etiquette on the course would be helpful to us.

It is noteworthy that the first section proper of the R&A Rules of Golf is that covering 'Etiquette' and it is summarised as follows;

This section provides guidelines on the manner in which the game of golf should be played. If they are followed, all players will gain maximum enjoyment from the game. The overriding principle is that consideration should be shown to others on the course at all times.

This is a very clear statement that doesn't leave any room for, or need for, debate.

The section is dominated by the paragraphs on 'Slow Play', the acknowledged curse of the game. Indeed, golf writing as a whole is dominated by the topic. Golf Monthly magazine recently devoted 10 pages to the subject. The article is well written, interestingly presented, and makes good suggestions that, if followed by all, will quicken up play on our course. Copies are available in the members' bar.

Do not think slow play is a new concern. Henry Longhurst wrote in his article 'Don't muck about', published on 28th October, 1954, that 'These days a two ball going round in two and a quarter hours would excite favourable comment, whereas onceover it was the norm.' Be assured, this was for all eighteen holes. Nowadays, we feel we have done well if we get round in 4 hours.

The club has taken various measures to help speed up play: undergrowth and brush has been cleared; signage around the course has been improved; distance markers are accurate and available on every hole; playing conditions through the green have seen huge improvements.

We have considered introducing course marshals, and, also, taking sanctions against 'repeat offenders'. We have shelved the idea of course marshals because they are expensive and some people, who may already be playing quickly, find their presence disturbing. We don't want to go down the route of taking sanctions because we think our members are capable of being self policing and of helping each other to enjoy the game. However, we will keep a watching brief in this regard.

The answer to slow play is to take Henry Longhurst's advice and, 'Don't muck about'. Familiarise yourself with the suggestions to combat slow play in the aforementioned Golf Monthly article; the R&A rules of golf http://www.randa.org/RulesEquipment/Etiquette/Behaviour-on-the-Course ; the notes that have been in the locker rooms for two years; the suggestions in the Club Diary, and ensure that you follow them, and, if you are an example to the rest of us, don't be afraid to tell us, your playing partners, to get on with it and keep up with the game in front.

If all members follow this commonsense advice, we should be able to get round a three ball medal or a 4 ball betterball in four hours. But the key word is all.

If only one group fails to keep up with play, the enjoyment of the entire field is spoiled.

Please, don't be in that group!
Good golfing

In the words of Homer I am not totally convinced this letter has been sent to the members of LP club.

If I had posted this my opening line would have been "This is a the letter we have sent to all our members" not "This is an example of a letter to send to members".

 

[Liverpoolphil]

In the words of Homer I am not totally convinced this letter has been sent to the members of LP club.

If I had posted this my opening line would have been "This is a the letter we have sent to all our members" not "This is an example of a letter to send to members".

It has been sent with a few adjustments but not sure exactly

 

[pokerjoke]

It has been sent with a few adjustments but not sure exactly

This is then where a problem arises as people have been posting on the basis this was the letter sent because the way I read it was the way you were trying to perceive it.
If im wrong I apologies but just the first paragraph got peoples backs up but if this was not actually in the letter people might have posted a different response.

 

[Liverpoolphil]

This is then where a problem arises as people have been posting on the basis this was the letter sent because the way I read it was the way you were trying to perceive it.
If im wrong I apologies but just the first paragraph got peoples backs up but if this was not actually in the letter people might have posted a different response.

Adjustments understand were mainly grammar and the target audience is our members and our president who has been a member for 30 plus and knows the members.

Some people don't like the first paragraph and made judgements about it - I have no issue with and certainly don't see as rude etc nor does any of our swindle who have all read it.

 

[GB72]

After today I would add club pros to the list of problems. Played with 2 higher handicappers in a comp. Both had been to separate pros, both had been given extensive pre shot routines to follow. Ended up with my first ever 4.5 hour round at my club