Practice during round

[effayjay]

It different?

 

[robinthehood]

I'd have said one is practice the other finishing the hole, albeit incorrectly.
I'm interested what the rules experts views are .

 

[rulefan]

When he played the second ball he played from a wrong place and given the likely distance gained it would be deemed a serious breach resulting in a DQ for the hole for not correcting it. Zero points for the hole.

See #34

 

[PJ87]

Could this guy of not had a stroke and distance pen and finished the hole? Even if no score recorded with a blob still an option

You wouldn't apply that to the hole after either

 

[rulefan]

I was assuming he had gone forward to search and dropped from that place. However, the OP is not clear, he may well have played again from the tee. In that case, S&D and no other issue.

See #34

 

[Swango1980]

So, scanned through the various answers, and not sure if a definitive answer was given? But to clarify, had the player finished the hole after they gave up on their first ball? Yes, because the rules state that a player is between 2 holes in Stableford "When the player has holed out, or has picked up after scoring zero points, losing the hole or reaching the maximum score". So, he was clearly between two holes as he had picked up. He then made practice strokes, and therefore gets the general penalty. The rules also state, under 5.5c, "If the breach happens between two holes, the penalty applies to the next hole." So, the OP will have acted as the rules state. Apologies to those that have already said this, I seemed to be scanning through different opinions on the matter.

I don't think it is a harsh penalty either. Otherwise, if the rule didn't exist, a player could pick up their ball fairly early in a hole after starting it badly, then drop a ball down and start hitting 1, 2, 3 etc shots to try and get their swing going again. Or, maybe they have a 160 yard par 3 coming up, same wind direction, so decide to drop a ball 160 yards out and hit a shot or two to determine what club to take on that par 3.

 

[robinthehood]

If I tee off walk to where my ball is but can't find it. Then I'll need to go back and take s&d. If I put a ball in play from where I am , I'm playing from the wrong spot. Not practicing.

 

[Swango1980]

If I tee off walk to where my ball is but can't find it. Then I'll need to go back and take s&d. If I put a ball in play from where I am , I'm playing from the wrong spot. Not practicing.

Yes, a player can go back and play s&d if they can't find their ball. They are continuing the hole under the Rules of Golf. If a player plays from the wrong place, they are doing so in continuation of the hole (mistakenly). However, in this post this is not the case. The player had given up on the hole, and the rules are clear in stating that they are now between the play of 2 holes. They can no longer play from the wrong place on that hole, they are out of it. Therefore, their next shots are practice shots, not playing from the wrong place.

If the player genuinely did think they could drop a ball down if they lost their first, and so did that and played on, then they would be in breach of playing from the wrong place. But, that was not the situation in this case.

 

[Kellfire]

So, scanned through the various answers, and not sure if a definitive answer was given? But to clarify, had the player finished the hole after they gave up on their first ball? Yes, because the rules state that a player is between 2 holes in Stableford "When the player has holed out, or has picked up after scoring zero points, losing the hole or reaching the maximum score". So, he was clearly between two holes as he had picked up. He then made practice strokes, and therefore gets the general penalty. The rules also state, under 5.5c, "If the breach happens between two holes, the penalty applies to the next hole." So, the OP will have acted as the rules state. Apologies to those that have already said this, I seemed to be scanning through different opinions on the matter.

I don't think it is a harsh penalty either. Otherwise, if the rule didn't exist, a player could pick up their ball fairly early in a hole after starting it badly, then drop a ball down and start hitting 1, 2, 3 etc shots to try and get their swing going again. Or, maybe they have a 160 yard par 3 coming up, same wind direction, so decide to drop a ball 160 yards out and hit a shot or two to determine what club to take on that par 3.

You are of course totally wrong but at least I can see the (incorrect) logic you’ve used.

 

[Swango1980]

You are of course totally wrong but at least I can see the (incorrect) logic you’ve used.

Elaborate?

 

[robinthehood]

Yes, a player can go back and play s&d if they can't find their ball. They are continuing the hole under the Rules of Golf. If a player plays from the wrong place, they are doing so in continuation of the hole (mistakenly). However, in this post this is not the case. The player had given up on the hole, and the rules are clear in stating that they are now between the play of 2 holes. They can no longer play from the wrong place on that hole, they are out of it. Therefore, their next shots are practice shots, not playing from the wrong place.

If the player genuinely did think they could drop a ball down if they lost their first, and so did that and played on, then they would be in breach of playing from the wrong place. But, that was not the situation in this case.

Can you declare yourself out of a hole?, surely the rules can only deal with the situation in front of them. For the majority of golfers, a lost tee shot would not put them out of of the hole. At the point of throwing the ball down, I'd say he is still very much able to score and is playing from a wrong place .

I'll often play out a hole where I can't score , its allowed under the rules.

 

[Swango1980]

Can you declare yourself out of a hole?, surely the rules can only deal with the situation in front of them. For the majority of golfers, a lost tee shot would not put them out of of the hole. At the point of throwing the ball down, I'd say he is still very much able to score and is playing from a wrong place .

I'll often play out a hole where I can't score , its allowed under the rules.

The player said "no score, just played one down". What part of that phrase makes you think the player still believed they were playing the hole?

 

[robinthehood]

The player said "no score, just played one down". What part of that phrase makes you think the player still believed they were playing the hole?

I'm asking , as I don't know.
surely it's the rules that determine whether I'm stil inl the hole or not. If a score is still possible then I'm still in the hole.
A bit like declaring a ball lost, its not lost till the time is up, regardless if I say it is.

 

[rulefan]

I have reconsidered my view. As it was stableford the hole was completed when he said "no score, just played one down".

21.1b(1) The hole is completed when the player holes out, chooses not to do so or when his or her score will result in zero points.

 

[Swango1980]

I'm asking , as I don't know.
surely it's the rules that determine whether I'm stil inl the hole or not. If a score is still possible then I'm still in the hole.
A bit like declaring a ball lost, its not lost till the time is up, regardless if I say it is.

As Rulefan states (#33), the hole was complete once they chose not to complete the hole. They chose not to do so once they decided not to go back to the tee and play another as they lost their original ball, as per the rules.

Otherwise, if you just assumed they were playing a wrong ball, they could drop several balls down and just "play a few down".

 

[robinthehood]

As Rulefan states (#33), the hole was complete once they chose not to complete the hole. They chose not to do so once they decided not to go back to the tee and play another as they lost their original ball, as per the rules.

Otherwise, if you just assumed they were playing a wrong ball, they could drop several balls down and just "play a few down".

Oof no that would be practicing 😉

 

[Swango1980]

Oof no that would be practicing 😉

Exactly, hence the correct penalty in the original post

 

[Backache]

I have reconsidered my view. As it was stableford the hole was completed when he said "no score, just played one down".

21.1b(1) The hole is completed when the player holes out, chooses not to do so or when his or her score will result in zero points.

If we follow this logic any play away from the putting green following a point at which a player can only get zero points is practice after the hole is completed.
I have never heard of this being applied, and the preamble in the rules states that ' to help pace of play, players are encouraged to stop playing a hole when their score will result in zero points'
However it does not state that this is considered to be practice.

 

[Swango1980]

If we follow this logic any play away from the putting green following a point at which a player can only get zero points is practice after the hole is completed.
I have never heard of this being applied, and the preamble in the rules states that ' to help pace of play, players are encouraged to stop playing a hole when their score will result in zero points'
However it does not state that this is considered to be practice.

This is what the Rules say as an example of when a player is between 2 holes in Stableford "When the player has holed out, or has picked up after scoring zero points". In this case, it is quite clear that the player has picked up and ended the hole. However, had they already had too many shots and were going to score zero points anyway, they can still play on as per the rules, because they haven't picked up. So the penalty wouldn't apply in that case.

 

[robinthehood]

If we follow this logic any play away from the putting green following a point at which a player can only get zero points is practice after the hole is completed.
I have never heard of this being applied, and the preamble in the rules states that ' to help pace of play, players are encouraged to stop playing a hole when their score will result in zero points'
However it does not state that this is considered to be practice.

Yeah I find it confusing, I'll play on if I can't score sometimes. You could probably call it practice 😂