Post Office - Horizon scandal

[nickjdavis]

One of the guys in a brewing group I'm a member of was a sub-postmaster when the Horizon system was implemented.

He actually had a PO official and a Fujitsu representative in his post office and he was able to demonstrate live issues with the system to them. They just told him it was isolated and not a widespread issue.

 

[Bunkermagnet]

Watching all of the series now.
All I can say is, it's bleddy disgusting anyone to do with Fujitsu and the PO are walking away free people. Downright disgusting.

 

[Voyager EMH]

Absolutely brilliant that they managed to get Zahawi to play himself in the drama.
The real footage is even more shocking in depicting the evasiveness and obfuscation of Paula and Angela.

 

[Mudball]

Absolutely brilliant that they managed to get Zahawi to play himself in the drama.
The real footage is even more shocking in depicting the evasiveness and obfuscation of Paula and Angela.

I found zahawi laughable.. liked what he did in that hearing.. but he was exactly like that when the shoe was on the other foot and they questioned him about his own affairs ..

 

[Hobbit]

There was a BBC Panorama documentary on this back in 2015. BBC took down the documentary, saying there was no evidence of wrong doing. And there’s some great vids of Commons Select Committee hearings which include Paula Vennells, PO CEO, and Second Sight the independent organisation brought by the PO to investigate the issue.

The PO stopped sharing info with Second Sight when Second Sight‘s forensic accountants started asking difficult questions.

Just why did the Beeb remove the Panorama documentary from its site? Several experts were interviewed as part of the documentary, and their ‘evidence’ is damning. But why was the documentary pulled? I’ve managed to find the documentary on YouTube, and watched it through. First of all, the PO didn’t have to bring in the Police nor submit the evidence to the CPS to go for a criminal trial. The PO withheld evidence from the defence and have, subsequently, lost that evidence. Some Sub-Postmasters foolishly signed off loses, in effect false accounting, to hide losses they couldn’t find. And the PO were happy to accept that…

And a Jeremy Kyle documentary from 4 months ago. How can investigative journalists come up with all the evidence but the PO couldn’t?

Jeremy Kyle Investigates The Post Office Scandal | 31-Aug-23

Jeremy Kyle Live at 7pm sees the straight-talking voice of the people take on the issues that really matter. Tonight Jeremy Kyle investigates the Horizon Pos...

www.youtube.com

EDIT; the Beeb have found the documentary and have made it available via iPlayer.

 

[Voyager EMH]

A few days after 39 convictions were quashed, Paula Vennells resigned her non-executive directorships of Morrisons and Dunelm.

On the same day she resigned her duties as a minister in the diocese of St Albans.
The Bishop of St Albans is the son of a retired postmaster.


826,000 signatures.

 

[Hobbit]

For anyone that feels strongly enough there’s a GoFundMe page supports legal fees etc for the SubPostmasters group that is fighting this.

Welcome to the Horizon Scandal Fund, helping subpostmasters rebuild their lives

We help Subpostmasters who have been victims of the Post Office Scandal and who are still waiting for proper redress

www.horizonscandalfund.org

 

[cliveb]

A bit off topic, and I don't know if it belongs here or the random irritations or laughter thread...

One of my pension providers has recently deployed a new computer system to administer the fund. And the name have they chosen for this new system is...
Horizon.

 

[Voyager EMH]

861,916 at 10:20am

863,809 at 10:30am

Two thousand in ten minutes - should see this topping a million fairly soon.
Went up by 300 as I typed the previous line.

 

[Tashyboy]

There’s a piece out today. Checkout how much Fujitsu have had off the government in contracts. Over 200 contracts and over 6 billion

 

[Hobbit]

861,916 at 10:20am

863,809 at 10:30am

Two thousand in ten minutes - should see this topping a million fairly soon.
Went up by 300 as I typed the previous line.

914,000 almost

 

[Voyager EMH]

It will be well over a million by the 10pm news, I reckon.

 

[cliveb]

Just finished watching the ITV drama. The thing that was news to me and absolutely stunned me was that the Post Office was allowed to conduct its own investigations and prosecutions of criminal (not civil) cases without involving the police or CPS. It seems to me that because the prosecutor was the same as the "victim", there was a direct conflict of interest.
Had these cases been investigated by the police - who would have had no vested interest - they would never have been brought to court.

How on earth was that ever allowed?
Please - someone who knows reassure me that they have now been stripped of that privilege.

And are there any other organisations that enjoy the same powers?

 

[Voyager EMH]

Just finished watching the ITV drama. The thing that was news to me and absolutely stunned me was that the Post Office was allowed to conduct its own investigations and prosecutions of criminal (not civil) cases without involving the police or CPS. It seems to me that because the prosecutor was the same as the "victim", there was a direct conflict of interest.
Had these cases been investigated by the police - who would have had no vested interest - they would never have been brought to court.

How on earth was that ever allowed?
Please - someone who knows reassure me that they have now been stripped of that privilege.

And are there any other organisations that enjoy the same powers?

Post Office have "given an assurance" that they will no longer act as investigator and prosecutor.

I think this has lessened the rush to legislate to remove this anachronism. But still likely to be done in the future.

 

[Tashyboy]

Just finished watching the ITV drama. The thing that was news to me and absolutely stunned me was that the Post Office was allowed to conduct its own investigations and prosecutions of criminal (not civil) cases without involving the police or CPS. It seems to me that because the prosecutor was the same as the "victim", there was a direct conflict of interest.
Had these cases been investigated by the police - who would have had no vested interest - they would never have been brought to court.

How on earth was that ever allowed?
Please - someone who knows reassure me that they have now been stripped of that privilege.

And are there any other organisations that enjoy the same powers?

I think if you start at the very beginning. The major share holder gave the contract to Fujitsu. That major shareholder being the government. It gave the contract to the cheapest bidder. The Post office knew literally from day one of Horizon being active there was problems.
So Paula Vennels was tasked with keeping her bosses in the loop. That being the Government. If she didn’t she lied. If she did. Then governments have kept a lid on this for a couple of decades. I think the lid has been lifted and I have a strong feeling there is still going to be a lot of crap that hits the fan. I find it interesting and astonishing that Rishi and the government are now exploring all options to put this to bed. Why? And no one is going to convince me it’s because of correcting a sense of injustice.

 

[Voyager EMH]

It will be well over a million by the 10pm news, I reckon.

Gone past the 950,000 mark, but we might fall short of a million before my bed time.

Now then.
Will she decide to give back the CBE tomorrow?
If not, she faces the petition figures being reported repeatedly on the telly and the ever increasing likelihood of being stripped of it anyway.

Tried, but could not find any betting odds.
Giving it back tomorrow is my imaginary bet.
Hope she shows herself up by calling the petition something like "vindictive". That will give me a laugh. Maybe it should make me more angry? Both is OK.

 

[Bunkermagnet]

I wonder if "someone" would advise Prince Andrew to put his hand in his "pocket" to make this, and by virtue his own "problem" go away

 

[need_my_wedge]

Just finished the TV drama. Was vaguely aware of the story way back but not to the extent of what we watched………..just wow.

Unbelievable really, it’s so off the chart unreal. Can only hope that everything gets put right for the people that suffered so much damage.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

My wife was saying that after legal fees were paid, less than £160k in total has been paid out to less than 20 post masters/mistress's

 

[cliveb]

Another thing: how the hell did the legal fees for the civil action against the post office get up to £46 million? Sounds like the "no win no fee" bunch have got their noses not just deep in, but right through the bottom of the trough.