New Callaway and TaylorMade Drivers

[Pants]

Five years ago Rick Shiels tested the original Rogue driver and the stats were: Ball Speed 161, Carry 282 and Total distance 300.

For the new Paradym they are: Ball speed 158, Carry 286, Total distance 308.

The 2018 Rogue Sub Zero, which would be the model compatible with the Paradym Triple Diamond had stats of: Ball Speed 161, Carry 288 and Total distance 309.

For the new Paradym Triple Diamond they are: Ball speed 160, Carry 298, Total distance 322.

Sorry if I seem to be a bit thick here but surely, once the ball has left the club face it's speed is it's speed and the club has no further effect on carry or distance. How can a slower ball give greater distance? The only variables as far as I can see are launch angle, spin or different ball characteristics. If that is true then they are not comparing like with like - or am I missing something?

 

[Bdill93]

Sorry if I seem to be a bit thick here but surely, once the ball has left the club face it's speed is it's speed and the club has no further effect on carry or distance. How can a slower ball give greater distance? The only variables as far as I can see are launch angle, spin or different ball characteristics. If that is true then they are not comparing like with like - or am I missing something?

Spin would be the one... and smash factor

 

[Pants]

And as for c£600 for a driver ...

 

[Orikoru]

Having watering eyes at the cost of my latest irons and seeing the cost of these I'm afraid I'm now being priced out of the "new" market...
I could buy them if I wanted to but I cant justify 600 quid for a driver to me let alone the Finance Director......
Time to start a sweep on who will have the first, mainstream, £1k driver.....

I feel the same, but it's highly annoying if you want to get fitted. They don't tend to fit anything but the latest stuff. When I got fitted for my current driver (G410) it had already been out a while, so I got it for £400. That is a lot as it is, without adding 200 to it. I doubt anyone will actually be selling this Callaway for full RRP, but it's a slippery slope that isn't slowing down at the moment.

I'm almost at the point now of saying, I've done a fitting for driver and irons in the past, so I'll just keep buying slightly older gear based on those specs. Or pay for a fitting and then try and get the latest model second hand, or the one model previous in the most similar spec I can find.

 

[Pants]

Spin would be the one... and smash factor

So spin would not be comparing like for like, and smash factor surely doesn't apply as that has already happened to get the ball speed.

I think that "spin" actually applies, but only in the context of the manufacturers claims about their new product.

 

[Golfnut1957]

Sorry if I seem to be a bit thick here but surely, once the ball has left the club face it's speed is it's speed and the club has no further effect on carry or distance. How can a slower ball give greater distance? The only variables as far as I can see are launch angle, spin or different ball characteristics. If that is true then they are not comparing like with like - or am I missing something?

I can't say I gave it any thought. I took the data off his videos and published it on here for a bit of context. I didn't analyse it at all.

 

[hairball_89]

Time to start a sweep on who will have the first, mainstream, £1k driver.....

I’ll take Taylormade!

 

[Backsticks]

Spin would be the one... and smash factor

Not really smash factor. That is only an after the fact ratio of ball speed to club speed.

 

[Jason.H]

In Ricks video they did show some numbers and the spin was a lot lower with the triple diamond. It’s a fraction smaller head size so maybe more aerodynamic. I’d always favour a fairway finder over distance.

 

[Pants]

I can't say I gave it any thought. I took the data off his videos and published it on here for a bit of context. I didn't analyse it at all.

It just struck me as odd that taking the last 2 examples, a lower ball speed gave an extra 10yds carry with 13yds extra total distance. Surely, spin and angle. That could probably be achieved by judicious change of shaft on your existing driver head plus a lesson.

 

[nickjdavis]

Sorry if I seem to be a bit thick here but surely, once the ball has left the club face it's speed is it's speed and the club has no further effect on carry or distance. How can a slower ball give greater distance? The only variables as far as I can see are launch angle, spin or different ball characteristics. If that is true then they are not comparing like with like - or am I missing something?

Launch angle, spin, flight profile, landing angle.

It is impossible to simply separate out ball speed and distance and say bigger X automatically equals bigger Y.

In reality, bigger X has the opportunity to create bigger Y, but only if other characteristics are optimal.

 

[Jason.H]

At least the Titleist has a more classic look. No need for shiny bits and bright colours ect

 

[jim8flog]

Sorry if I seem to be a bit thick here but surely, once the ball has left the club face it's speed is it's speed and the club has no further effect on carry or distance. How can a slower ball give greater distance? The only variables as far as I can see are launch angle, spin or different ball characteristics. If that is true then they are not comparing like with like - or am I missing something?

It's all to do with the new improved and uprated Prov1

 

[Teebs]

£599? Blimey. I picked up a Rogue ST Max in 2022 which is prob worth about £200 now

£399 to change, no thanks.

The Rogue was £429 from memory and it's brilliant ?

 

[r0wly86]

It just struck me as odd that taking the last 2 examples, a lower ball speed gave an extra 10yds carry with 13yds extra total distance. Surely, spin and angle. That could probably be achieved by judicious change of shaft on your existing driver head plus a lesson.

I would suggest other factors as well such as climate, even if indoors there could be a slight temperature change which could effect the ball's flight, not all balls are equal, doubt he would be using exactly the same balls, even if they were the same make and model, chances of them being from the same year or even batch is very slim.

Nice t have some numbers to compare but in no way is it scientific or statistically relevant

 

[AAC]

I feel the same, but it's highly annoying if you want to get fitted. They don't tend to fit anything but the latest stuff. When I got fitted for my current driver (G410) it had already been out a while, so I got it for £400. That is a lot as it is, without adding 200 to it. I doubt anyone will actually be selling this Callaway for full RRP, but it's a slippery slope that isn't slowing down at the moment.

I'm almost at the point now of saying, I've done a fitting for driver and irons in the past, so I'll just keep buying slightly older gear based on those specs. Or pay for a fitting and then try and get the latest model second hand, or the one model previous in the most similar spec I can find.

I went past that point some time ago.

 

[Pants]

So, basically, as the manufacturers have been at the legal limits for many years now, then any changes they make to the club can only be cosmetic or of minimal performance improvement and nothing that a good club fitter couldn't tweek with shaft, face angle etc on your existing club. I would suggest that Cat 1 and better golfers may find an improvement but 99% of us wouldn't.

Must admit that I haven't searched too hard for info on the "new" TM drivers but checked out the blurb for the Stealth range. Very clever use of language but not once did they indicate any better performance to previous clubs. Used phrases like " pushing the boundaries", "optimal performance", "maxed out" and the like but never actually claimed anything.

Me a cynic? Nah

Caveat emptor

 

[Orikoru]

I went past that point some time ago.

I fitted for new irons a couple of months ago, but it's only cost me £600 for the set (100 a club), which I was ok with given that plenty of irons have breached the £1000 mark now. So I haven't quite given up on new clubs yet, but if I fit for a new driver in a year or two and the minimum cost is £500 then yeah, it's probably game over.

 

[evemccc]

Genuine Q:

Assuming my driver / shaft doesn’t break, and my swing doesn’t change much (v much NOT expecting it to slow down at all for a number of years, and v likely not to gain any significant clubhead speed either), and the regulations on Drivers isn’t changed (max size or whatever that limited performance increases), why would I need to buy a new driver?

I spent a lot on a fitted one, new a year ago from a v reputable fitter..so presumably, I’m not likely to get any gains?

 

[r0wly86]

So, basically, as the manufacturers have been at the legal limits for many years now, then any changes they make to the club can only be cosmetic or of minimal performance improvement and nothing that a good club fitter couldn't tweek with shaft, face angle etc on your existing club. I would suggest that Cat 1 and better golfers may find an improvement but 99% of us wouldn't.

Must admit that I haven't searched too hard for info on the "new" TM drivers but checked out the blurb for the Stealth range. Very clever use of language but not once did they indicate any better performance to previous clubs. Used phrases like " pushing the boundaries", "optimal performance", "maxed out" and the like but never actually claimed anything.

Me a cynic? Nah

Caveat emptor

Legal limits will only make up part of it, materials, weighting, shape, construction will all make a difference, how much of a difference is the key. Probably only small improvements