Minister grabs activist

Wilson

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He overreacted, but not as much as everyone who’s acting like he put her in a full nelson, and banged her head off a few pillars on the way out.
 
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He's wrong.

Yet he is trained in protection ?

This summed it all in an article I read about it and good old Boris

So many women will watch that footage of Barker being shoved against a wall, and instinctively wince. You don’t need to have felt the sharp edge of a man’s temper to be afraid of it, and there is something viscerally disturbing about the sight of a hand closing in on a vulnerable neck. If he really thought she was so dangerous, why not wrestle her to the ground? And if he just wanted to get her out before she caused trouble, why not steer her by the elbow? As it is, the whole thing looks horribly reminiscent of a controlling husband, hustling away a wife who has had a few drinks at a party and is now in danger of making a scene, while everyone else stares uncomfortably at their shoes.

But not everyone will see it that way. All over the country this morning, there will have been millions of Tory voters harrumphing that frankly she got what was coming to her; that it was her fault for bursting into a private dinner, wilfully causing a security scare when she must have known everyone was on edge. What happened split the room, never mind the country, with some guests reportedly horrified at what they saw as an overreaction while others broke into applause after she was removed.


Interesting couple of paragraphs
 

ColchesterFC

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Yet he is trained in protection ?

This summed it all in an article I read about it and good old Boris

So many women will watch that footage of Barker being shoved against a wall, and instinctively wince. You don’t need to have felt the sharp edge of a man’s temper to be afraid of it, and there is something viscerally disturbing about the sight of a hand closing in on a vulnerable neck. If he really thought she was so dangerous, why not wrestle her to the ground? And if he just wanted to get her out before she caused trouble, why not steer her by the elbow? As it is, the whole thing looks horribly reminiscent of a controlling husband, hustling away a wife who has had a few drinks at a party and is now in danger of making a scene, while everyone else stares uncomfortably at their shoes.

But not everyone will see it that way. All over the country this morning, there will have been millions of Tory voters harrumphing that frankly she got what was coming to her; that it was her fault for bursting into a private dinner, wilfully causing a security scare when she must have known everyone was on edge. What happened split the room, never mind the country, with some guests reportedly horrified at what they saw as an overreaction while others broke into applause after she was removed.

Interesting couple of paragraphs

A very subjective viewpoint and as for the "trained protection officer"; have we any idea by whom he was trained.

Knowing that might help confirm, or otherwise, the value of his opinion on the matter.
 
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A very subjective viewpoint and as for the "trained protection officer"; have we any idea by whom he was trained.

Knowing that might help confirm, or otherwise, the value of his opinion on the matter.

Yet the author has summed the feelings on this thread perfectly

And the trained protection officer is ex military I’m guessing training started there and then onto a number of courses from there but anyone who carries out close protection will need a license and you only get one of them from completing a certain level of training.
 
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Yet the author has summed the feelings on this thread perfectly

And the trained protection officer is ex military I’m guessing training started there and then onto a number of courses from there but anyone who carries out close protection will need a license and you only get one of them from completing a certain level of training.

So we still don't know the level or quality of this man's training.

Plenty of quotes have been obtained by the Press in the past and the source subsequently discredited.

In any event his is just one opinion amongst many.
 
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So we still don't know the level or quality of this man's training.

Plenty of quotes have been obtained by the Press in the past and the source subsequently discredited.

In any event his is just one opinion amongst many.
🙄 seriously ? He is a licensed close protection office - you can only get that license by completing a certain level of training and passing exams.

Yes it’s his opinion but it’s an opinion coming from someone with training and a license. As he said if he carried out the actions the man did he would lose his license - surely he is best placed to voice that opinion and how can someone say he is “wrong”
 
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Old Skier

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Is it really the right thing ? Right now he has been suspended with the police looking into his actions - saw a longer clip earlier and saw him marched her out gripping round the back of the neck ? Is that really the right thing to do ?. Is the right thing not to just let security deal with it and stay out of it ?

And we aren’t in France or Russia and I can’t recall the last violent Greenpeace protest in the UK

Very unlikely that he will be charged. It appears you're only interested in acts of violence in the U.K.
 

SocketRocket

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Sorry can you explain that please ?

All because I don’t like seeing a man use his physical strength against a women in a poor and over the top way.

I’m not sure why you need to start pointing fingers once again just because someone has an opinion that differs from yours
That's very ironic. You have been pointing fingers at people with different opinions to yours.

You are either taking this view to promote your saintimonious image or you are a member of the yogurt hugging easily offended. Both are elements of what's wrong in society.
 

Blue in Munich

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Yet he is trained in protection ?

This summed it all in an article I read about it and good old Boris

So many women will watch that footage of Barker being shoved against a wall, and instinctively wince. You don’t need to have felt the sharp edge of a man’s temper to be afraid of it, and there is something viscerally disturbing about the sight of a hand closing in on a vulnerable neck. If he really thought she was so dangerous, why not wrestle her to the ground? And if he just wanted to get her out before she caused trouble, why not steer her by the elbow? As it is, the whole thing looks horribly reminiscent of a controlling husband, hustling away a wife who has had a few drinks at a party and is now in danger of making a scene, while everyone else stares uncomfortably at their shoes.

But not everyone will see it that way. All over the country this morning, there will have been millions of Tory voters harrumphing that frankly she got what was coming to her; that it was her fault for bursting into a private dinner, wilfully causing a security scare when she must have known everyone was on edge. What happened split the room, never mind the country, with some guests reportedly horrified at what they saw as an overreaction while others broke into applause after she was removed.

Interesting couple of paragraphs

Very interesting Phil. You don’t just lead people out by the elbow, it doesn’t happen, trust me. Whoever wrote that clearly doesn’t have a clue about restraining people or removing them from situations. That’s on the same level of misunderstanding as shooting guns out of people’s hands instead of aiming at centre body mass to avoid fatalities.
 
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That's very ironic. You have been pointing fingers at people with different opinions to yours.

You are either taking this view to promote your saintimonious image or you are a member of the yogurt hugging easily offended. Both are elements of what's wrong in society.

Once again just like on all the other political threads you start to throw derogatory comments at posters - it happens every single time there is a strong debate on here. People had strong opinions about the incident and the thread was fine until you made it about the posters - you do it all the time. It appears you can’t handle people having a strong opposite opinion to you.

I didn’t point any fingers at anyone on this thread , I’m not offended by anything that has happened. I believe a person acted over aggressively towards someone when there was no need - and it’s clear many others think that same way , yet you suggest “I’m all that’s wrong with society” ?!? Yogurt huggers ?!?! What ever the hell that is.

What is wrong with society is people showing a lack of acceptance for others , people showing a lack of acceptance for people having a voice and an opinion. Maybe before you start suggesting others are the ills of society you take a good long hard look in the mirror and your own attitude - but then I expect your arrogance will overshadow that
 
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Very interesting Phil. You don’t just lead people out by the elbow, it doesn’t happen, trust me. Whoever wrote that clearly doesn’t have a clue about restraining people or removing them from situations. That’s on the same level of misunderstanding as shooting guns out of people’s hands instead of aiming at centre body mass to avoid fatalities.

I agree in regards restraining someone Rich - hence why unless the MP has been trained to do so he also shouldn’t be attempting to restrain someone if anything for fear of being sued or causing harm by holding them in the wrong place

If that was a policeman or a bodyguard etc who grabbed the women etc then I expect not many would have had a problem - they are trained to judge the situation and also trained to restrain the person in the correct manner relevant to the threat she posed.

Without being a body language expert when looking at his face the guy seemed angry and snapped - maybe it was with good intentions but I think the actions he carried out just crossed a line that he isn’t trained to deal with and it’s going to cost him his job and maybe worse.
 

Hobbit

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I agree in regards restraining someone Rich - hence why unless the MP has been trained to do so he also shouldn’t be attempting to restrain someone if anything for fear of being sued or causing harm by holding them in the wrong place

If that was a policeman or a bodyguard etc who grabbed the women etc then I expect not many would have had a problem - they are trained to judge the situation and also trained to restrain the person in the correct manner relevant to the threat she posed.

Without being a body language expert when looking at his face the guy seemed angry and snapped - maybe it was with good intentions but I think the actions he carried out just crossed a line that he isn’t trained to deal with and it’s going to cost him his job and maybe worse.

I get what you're saying about the person doing the restraining should be trained, and do think that amateurs can be dangerous. But that's great if the trained person is right there at the point of confrontation. In this instance that wasn't the case. Security might have been at the back of the room, maybe only 20 feet away. That's not much good when the person you feel is a threat is 3 feet away.

And as you say a policeman is trained to judge a situation. Maybe the MP should have Googled the right answer before getting involved... there wasn't time for security to get from the back of the room, nor did the MP have time to read a manual.

Was it the perfect outcome? That's subjective. He didn't thump her nor wrestle her to the floor. He frogmarched her out AND she was smiling.... kinda says lot that smile doesn't it.
 
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I get what you're saying about the person doing the restraining should be trained, and do think that amateurs can be dangerous. But that's great if the trained person is right there at the point of confrontation. In this instance that wasn't the case. Security might have been at the back of the room, maybe only 20 feet away. That's not much good when the person you feel is a threat is 3 feet away.

And as you say a policeman is trained to judge a situation. Maybe the MP should have Googled the right answer before getting involved... there wasn't time for security to get from the back of the room, nor did the MP have time to read a manual.

Was it the perfect outcome? That's subjective. He didn't thump her nor wrestle her to the floor. He frogmarched her out AND she was smiling.... kinda says lot that smile doesn't it.
The perfect outcome is the Minister security detail deal with the situation , they were near the minister - or the person leaves the women to walk past him because let’s be honest here she was posing no threat , none of the ladies in their were posing any threat and the only aggressive incident was the MP and this women , other ladies were asked to leave peacefully with the right level of minimum force. The smile is only relevant if people want to use it but it could mean many things.

But again it’s not the MP’s responsibility to act the way he did , he isn’t security , he isn’t the police , he wasn’t detailed to act as force , she walked past lots of other people with no incident , just like the other ladies in the room did, why did he feel a “threat” or did he just feel angry about what they were doing and just wanted them out ?

In his comments afterwards I don’t think I have seen or heard from him that he felt a threat from her ? There is a very thin line between doing the right thing and being the vigilant - I see lots of social media posts from people saying “let’s do this and that” “ let’s rise up” etc etc

Imo he was angry , had a bit to drink and reacted to something that made him angry - there is no suggestion from anyone in the room there was a threat, she was Greenpeace as can be seen from the sash she was wearing , Greenpeace have been peaceful protesters in this country so it’s hard to see where he saw the threat but no one else appeared to in the whole room

Now if it was a big 6 foot muscle bound man shouted and pointing and waving something at the minister and possibly in a foreign language then you could see a potential threat but then I suspect the MP would have cowered away

Either way right now this whole thing doesn’t look great - it’s all over media around the world , showing an MP grabbing and being forceful with a harmless women - he has been suspended , police looking into it , his own party chairman and leader condemning it alongside many many others- it’s a very sour event in the political world in the UK that once again makes you want to cover your eyes 🤦‍♂️

You did the best thing getting out
 

Imurg

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I've only just seen this and.......
Gatecrasher walks towards a senior politician, holding a bag that could contain anything that could harm others.
Someone forcibly prevents said gatecrasher from getting to the "target", uses sufficient force .
And the problem is..?
And to say that because we're in the UK and not France or Russia so these things can't happen is unbelievably naive.
This woman could have been after an autograph, she could have had a gun or a bomb.
She could have a supporter of Hammond, she could have been a terrorist on a suicide mission.
What if he'd done nothing and she was "on a mission"...? How did anyone know she was harmless.?
I applaud him.
 
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