Lake balls V new balls.

[Brian_C]

I stumbled upon this site that did a comparison between used lake balls and brand new out of the box balls and the difference is very minimal. I just wanted to share on here as I've seen a couple of heated debates - might help people decide.

http://www.knetgolf.com/topic/36-golf-ball-testing.aspx

How Do Recycled & Refinished Golf Balls Perform?

Numbers Don’t Lie!

Since the beginning of the Used golf ball industry there has been some controversy raised as to whether used golf balls retrieved from the water perform any different than new golf balls.

The questioning of the performance of recycled balls may have been relevant years ago when balls were made differently, but golf balls today are constructed completely different and are very resilient.

So here is the test:

We bought 10 dozen new golf balls from a major retailer and took 10 dozen of each grade of golf balls that we recover and recycle right off of our shelves to an independent golf ball testing facility (Advanced Golf Solutions) that tests new balls for many of the top manufacturers.

All the grades of balls we sell were tested except for those that are structurally damaged or too old. These we do not sell. We do not have the capability to repair a damaged ball either through recycling or refinishing and these are discarded.

We hoped to once and for all put an end to this hearsay controversy of “water balls” or "used golf balls"and do some independent scientifically controlled testing, not subjective anecdotal testing that has been the mainstay of the common thought on this topic.

And here’s what we found out:

Outside of cosmetics (which really is what the grading is all about), the balls in all the various grades tested against new golf balls right out the package show only a very minimal loss, in fact a statistically insignificant loss of carry distance.

With a driver the maximum loss of carry over a drive of about 260 yards is about 5 yards with a grade B ball while the mint recycled and mint refinished balls show only a loss of 1 yard or less. Similar proportional results with both a wedge and 6 iron as indicated in the graphs below.

Is this difference significant?

Since 99% of all golfers cannot swing with any consistency to attain these averages over many shots, this loss of carry distance form 1 -5 yards is absolutely minimal when you take into account all the other factors that come into play when you swing a club… plane of club, follow through, back swing, in/out or out/in, weight shift, lie etc.

The question then becomes is it worth it to pay 40% - 80% more for golf balls that you are going to lose anyway just to gain a yard or so under ideal swing conditions?

Please note that even though we achieved the following results in our testing the legall team has advised us that we must add this disclaimer:
The products we market do not meet the exact specifications of new golf balls and may be subject to performance variations from new golf balls. These balls do not fall under the original manufacturers warranty or guarantees. However, we believe strongly in our products and stand behind them 100%.

You be the judge… and if you decide to continue purchasing new balls after seeing this, we and all of our 300,000 customers thank you as you are now one of our suppliers.







Test Results Highlights: Overall Evaluation:
Insignificant Total Carry Difference “Our test data proves new balls and Knetgolf.com pre-owned balls are basically interchangeable,” says Tony Nelson, President of AGS. “I don’t see how the average golfer would notice a difference – except for the price.”

"As for the difference between recycled and refinished balls, there is certainly no statistically significant difference in performance that any golfer I know would be able to detect." Tony added, " This is a certainly a win for all golfers."


Test Parameters:
Tests were conducted by Advanced Golf Solutions LLC. an independent certified golf ball testing facility in Sarasota, Florida USA

Date of test: November 17 Temperature Range: 79F to 83F
Humidity Range: 49% to 54% Wind Direction: ESE
Wind Speed: 3.2 MPH to 6.4 MPH Wind Effect: Minimal Tail / Crossing

Tests were conducted by cannon for consistent RPM at an 18% launch angle with 0% side axis and at 57 PSI.

 

[CheltenhamHacker]

Looks interesting, but I have an inherent mistrust of any article paid for, and published by, the company that also sells that product!

There is always the phrase that statistics can show whatever result you want them to...

 

[stevie_r]

There is always the phrase that statistics can show whatever result you want them to...

And the result they wanted to show was that there was a negligible reduction in distance, they did that.

 

[Maninblack4612]

I have an inherent mistrust of any article paid for, and published by, the company that also sells that product!

So do I. That's why I would be VERY wary about taking Statins. all the research has been paid for by the manufacturers.

 

[MarkE]

I always go for pearl grade lake balls. I don't hit the ball well enough to justify paying at least double for balls that, to me, are the same.

 

[Brian_C]

And the result they wanted to show was that there was a negligible reduction in distance, they did that.

In fairness, you're not going to get the original ball manufacturers doing the same tests and publishing the results, so we have to go on what data we can gleen from the web.

And most golfers don't have a consistent enough swing to make or notice a differance.

 

[Imurg]

Recycled balls...no problem for me.
Every time you pick up a ball from the rough you've got a recycled ball in your hands and, as per the report, I doubt there's enough difference for us to see.

Refinished balls are a different kettle of fish
You have no idea what the original ball was - I have 2 or 3 refinished ProVs in my practice bag and they feel about as close to a real ProV as ManU are to winning the premier League this season....feels to me like they've taken a TopFlite and refinished it to look like a ProV, it certainly doesn't feel or perform like one.
Balls that have been lost in lakes will degrade but not for a few months I'd guess so, again, no real difference.

 

[Scrindle]

Nice find. I always play with lake balls because I can't justify playing with new (unless they're a present!). I personally don't see any difference in distance whether I'm playing a brand new ball or a dull looking lake ball from my bag. I know the distance each of my clubs go and don't see any variation other than the norm from shot to shot using different balls.

I've even taken a mixture of balls to our practice pitching area before and played approach shots with full swing PW/9 irons and not noticed any difference in carry.

At the end of the day those who want to justify buying brand new balls, or who feel they play better playing with new balls, will play with new balls. Similarly those who are happy to play will lake balls will do the same. People will always find a way to pick holes in evidence if it doesn't show what they want it to.

Maybe someone should pose the question to Mark Crossfield and ask him to do some testing. He has a monitor and could do some figures too. He's probably find it quite interesting too!

[Edit] The test perameters are listed (copied below) and the ball testers appear to be the 'real deal' as it were. I think any doubt cast on the figures is more likely to be straw clutching than anything else to be honest...

Test Parameters:
Tests were conducted by Advanced Golf Solutions LLC. an independent certified golf ball testing facility in Sarasota, Florida USA
Date of test: November 17	Temperature Range: 79F to 83F
Humidity Range: 49% to 54%	Wind Direction: ESE
Wind Speed: 3.2 MPH to 6.4 MPH	Wind Effect: Minimal Tail / Crossing
Tests were conducted by cannon for consistent RPM at an 18% launch angle with 0% side axis and at 57 PSI.

 

[mefromhere]

Not sure I completely understand ... If every test was launched at 18 degrees and at the same speed how have they got different figures for driver, 6 iron and wedge? And also, is it not the quality of the cover and core that determines the spin which in turn controls the distance on the iron and wedges especially?

 

[Rumpokid]

I think that good quality balls are so cheap these days, that Lake balls need not be an option.It's the type of ball with regard to abillity which helps a little more in the long run.Stick with a brand you like and stock up.

 

[Dave B]

There are that many good ball offers for the prudent buyer that make lake balls an non viable option in my opinion. Many of the shops offer free postage if you buy enough balls.

If you stock up in bulk you can buy mid range balls for £10-12 a dozen on special, (Bridgestone E series, Srixon AD333/Soft feel, Wilson DX2/3 and Callaway Hot Hex/Hex Pro).

If you're a premium ball buyer and you're willing to buy other than Titleist I've picked up Wilson, Bridgestones, Callaway Chrome + TM Lethals/Penta and Srixon Z Stars for £15 - £20 a dozen.

Best time to buy is Christmas to New Year, paying particular attention to Xmas and New Year day specials

 

[Foxholer]

Lake Balls are fine by me.

Pickups are just as good too - and even cheaper!

 

[G_Mulligan]

I do love stats, I would prefer to see the full figures though as like has been mentioned stats can be twisted to an extent and conflicting ones left out altogether.

For the record though I am a big fan of lake/recycled balls and is pretty much all I ever play with. I don't see a difference in my own play. I buy Srixon Trispeed Tour Pearl/A grade mix at £6.50 per dozen.

 

[palindromicbob]

I have a mistrust of found balls. Always seem to be in a hurry to get lost again.

 

[drawboy]

I disagree with this totally. I had a Penfold Commando from a lake it was crap compered to an out of the box Pro V1X. Nuff said.

 

[JCW]

Stats are what they are , any one can make stats suit their argument or promote what they are trying to sell , so for me you get what you pay for , for practice , knockabouts or just general play it matters not, but I always tee up in a comp with a brand new ProV 1 , Prov1x if its blowing hard ................EYG

 

[stevie_r]

I disagree with this totally. I had a Penfold Commando from a lake it was crap compered to an out of the box Pro V1X. Nuff said.

I found a Dunlop blue flash last week, sadly it is too small and has a bit of a smiler on it

 

[guest100718]

Company that sells lake balls tells us that lake balls are great.....

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Recycled balls...no problem for me.
Every time you pick up a ball from the rough you've got a recycled ball in your hands and, as per the report, I doubt there's enough difference for us to see.

Refinished balls are a different kettle of fish
You have no idea what the original ball was - I have 2 or 3 refinished ProVs in my practice bag and they feel about as close to a real ProV as ManU are to winning the premier League this season....feels to me like they've taken a TopFlite and refinished it to look like a ProV, it certainly doesn't feel or perform like one.
Balls that have been lost in lakes will degrade but not for a few months I'd guess so, again, no real difference.

I'm with Imurg on this. To be honest there are enough good quality balls (AD333, Wilson etc) on the market that should appeal to most pockets. Refinished balls are a lottery although in my own opinion, there is a difference in lake ball performance and so I am sceptical about the data. There again I'm professional cynic but my hearts not in it!

 

[G_Mulligan]

I am slightly confused by the new ball get what you pay for comments. I type this on a second hand laptop which I got for under £200 which was £800 new and has worked brilliantly for 4 years and the best laptop I have ever had. I am sat on a second hand sofa which is just as comfy and I buy preowned xbox games which play just as well.

I understand that the worry is that recycled balls especially lake balls deteriorate but after a (brief) internet search I can't find any stats that back this up. The only stats produced I can see are from the lake ball company saying they don't deteriorate very much if at all. This ties in with my own beliefs about the quality and value for money of lake balls I currently use with the added bonus of being able to use the same ball in practice as I play on the course. This would be far too expensive with boxes of balls whatever the deals and offers can be found and for me is the major reason I use them so readily.