Ladies in the comps

[golfdub]

Played our charity game today and a very good lady player won with 43 points ( I think hc is 14) I was very happy for her BUT when I got back to the club house there was a couple of players moaning as one of them scored 42 points and he thought he had it in the bag. They were saying the lady shouldn't be playing of the ladies tees in the comps as it isn't fair as we're all playing of the whites and on the last hole she almost beat the longest drive and the ladies tee is at least 20 yards in From the whites on that hole. So what would of happened if she beat the longest drive when she had a 20yrd head start ??? As its only a small club I ain't that bothered about it but I can also see some people's point as it sould be fair

Oh and the longest drive was 355yards with a 3 iron, wtf!!!

What do you think ?

 

[louise_a]

A we take our handicaps from the red tees, its obvious that that is where we should play from.


As for the longest drive that should be measured from where the drive was taken surely. Even with a 100yds srart I would get nowhere near a longest drive.

 

[Heidi]

i think i need to come and visit your course with the ladies from the forum and teach them a lesson
what a lot of moaning gits!

a 20 yard head start? pftt. thats nothing - some courses give 100 yard head starts

red tees rule!

 

[rosecott]

Whingeing men!

Tell us which club you play at and we'll tell you if the whingeing is justified.

 

[duncan mackie]

Played our charity game today and a very good lady player won with 43 points ( I think hc is 14) I was very happy for her BUT when I got back to the club house there was a couple of players moaning as one of them scored 42 points and he thought he had it in the bag. They were saying the lady shouldn't be playing of the ladies tees in the comps as it isn't fair as we're all playing of the whites and on the last hole she almost beat the longest drive and the ladies tee is at least 20 yards in From the whites on that hole. So what would of happened if she beat the longest drive when she had a 20yrd head start ??? As its only a small club I ain't that bothered about it but I can also see some people's point as it sould be fair

Oh and the longest drive was 355yards with a 3 iron, wtf!!!

What do you think ?

you are asking 2 separate questions -

longest drive will be up to the committee to decide if there is an appropriate hole from which both can fairy compete from their designated tees, or if separate holes should be designated. 20yds sounds slightly more in favour of the men than the ladies!

points are related to SSS and par; as long as the relationship is common to the two sets of tees then no adjustments are made and everything is fair ie mens tees par 72 SSS 72, ladies tees par 74 SSS 74 all OK. If there is a difference then adjustments are made ie men 72/72 ladies par 74 sss 72 - ladies should be deducted 2 points.

 

[Iaing]

I've never really understood why the ladies only get one set of tees to play from for both bounce games and competitions.
Surely it would be better if there was two sets of ladies tees, one for general play and one for comps.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

I've never really understood why the ladies only get one set of tees to play from for both bounce games and competitions.
Surely it would be better if there was two sets of ladies tees, one for general play and one for comps.

A good point actually. I have to be honest though and if the comp is open to men and women then sadly the men have to accept that women can potentially win. Providing the handicap is valid I don't see the issue and think the guy on 42 is just miffed and a poor case of sour grapes

 

[FairwayDodger]

I've never really understood why the ladies only get one set of tees to play from for both bounce games and competitions.
Surely it would be better if there was two sets of ladies tees, one for general play and one for comps.

It's because golf clubs are set up for and revolve around the men. This is only one of many inequities in clubs that claim to have equal rights. However lets not get into that argument again!


w.r.t. the OP, ladies need to play off the tees from which their handicaps have been calculated. Sounds just like sour grapes from your guys.

When we have mixed comps with a longest drive there are usually two - one on one hole for guys and another on a different hole for the girls.

 

[6inchcup]

women and juniors should not be allowed in men's comps,full stop.we play off comp tees that are 20-50 yrs back from the yellows,they play off the reds and they have stupid htc how can it be right to have a double bogey putt for par.

 

[dufferman]

I've never really understood why the ladies only get one set of tees to play from for both bounce games and competitions.
Surely it would be better if there was two sets of ladies tees, one for general play and one for comps.

Possibly the ladies could play off the yellows for comps - rather than setting up another tee box? Just a thought...

 

[virtuocity]

How about men start admitting that they'd rather lose to a man than to a woman, no matter what tee box is used.

 

[GreiginFife]

women and juniors should not be allowed in men's comps,full stop.we play off comp tees that are 20-50 yrs back from the yellows,they play off the reds and they have stupid htc how can it be right to have a double bogey putt for par.

Exactly the same as playing against a 28HC'er male golfer that has that opportunity on 10 of the 18 holes he plays. If the HC is valid then it's a measure that the player needs that many shots to be on a level playing field.
Again the same if you play a scratch player and put for a bogey and get a stroke to make it a par. It's all relative.

 

[DCB]

women and juniors should not be allowed in men's comps,full stop.we play off comp tees that are 20-50 yrs back from the yellows,they play off the reds and they have stupid htc how can it be right to have a double bogey putt for par.

Good to see an enlightened one amongst us

I know several cat 1 women golfers that would give the average gents comp a good run for their money. As for Juniors, they play their comps off the same medal tees as the gents, so it's really the gents running scared of them.

 

[DCB]

I've never really understood why the ladies only get one set of tees to play from for both bounce games and competitions.
Surely it would be better if there was two sets of ladies tees, one for general play and one for comps.

If the course is set up properly there should be the red blocks for the normal ladies tee and there should be a marker for the full medal course, just like the men have.

 

[MashieNiblick]

Seems a bit sad for someone to be complaining about the results in a charity day. Surely the emphasis is on raising money and having fun.

If the men think it is unfair for ladies to win due to h/caps or tees or whatever perhaps they should have a think about handicap comps in general. Is it any less unfair that a 24 handicapper's gross 92 beats a scratch player's 69? But that is accepted week in week out at clubs across the world as part of the game.

Unless all golf is scratch golf then some element of handicapping is necessary and the use of different tees is just a part of that.

In any event isn't the thing about red tees really a red herring? The ladies' handicaps are based on playing off their own tees. If they played all their golf off the men's tees their scores, and accordingly their h/caps, might well be higher anyway, so in practice it is arguable that it makes little or no difference if the ladies play off the reds in a mixed comp - they are simply playing from the tees on which their h/caps are based.

 

[Foxholer]

I've never really understood why the ladies only get one set of tees to play from for both bounce games and competitions.
Surely it would be better if there was two sets of ladies tees, one for general play and one for comps.

It's because there are generally fewer Ladies, so the wear and tear on the tee does not need another area to 'save' the Competition ones.

It's because golf clubs are set up for and revolve around the men. This is only one of many inequities in clubs that claim to have equal rights. However lets not get into that argument again!

Your perception perhaps, but that approach isn't going to help change! I've seen at least 1 where it seems to revolves around the Ladies. Neither spin-axis is correct imo.

w.r.t. the OP, ladies need to play off the tees from which their handicaps have been calculated. Sounds just like sour grapes from your guys.

When we have mixed comps with a longest drive there are usually two - one on one hole for guys and another on a different hole for the girls.

Absolutely agree with these 2 points though. Both sets play off the tees that are appropriate to their handicap - and from which it was earned.

Different conditions, so separate LD comps - and holes.

women and juniors should not be allowed in men's comps,full stop.we play off comp tees that are 20-50 yrs back from the yellows,they play off the reds and they have stupid htc how can it be right to have a double bogey putt for par.

Agree about Juniors (but for a different, related, reason), but...

What makes you think it's a 'Men's' comp? Time your attitude got into the 20th (sic) Century imo. Your last sentence is illogical - and it applies to anyone with handicap over 18!

 

[Ethan]

I have no strong objection to mixed comps so long as the situation is equitable, i.e the test is comparable for both genders. There is a debate going on at another forum about how the length of the course for women should be set up in order to achieve equity, with several experienced architects saying it should be around 75% of the length. If this is achieved, one would expect SS to be similar for both.

On the longest drive, it is a patent nonsense to allow someone to tee off further up the hole. The prize is the longest one, not the one closest to the green. There should be a separate prize for longest drive for women. But if the numbers of women and men taking part are not similar, that introduces another bias. I have played in a society event where there were 60 competitors, and separate and the same prizes for men and women. The event had 57 men and 3 women taking part, so purely on a random basis the women had 19 times the chance of winning. The prizes were funded by the entry fees of all 60, though, so the men were significantly subsidisng the women.

 

[Crazyface]

Seems a bit sad for someone to be complaining about the results in a charity day. Surely the emphasis is on raising money and having fun.

If the men think it is unfair for ladies to win due to h/caps or tees or whatever perhaps they should have a think about handicap comps in general. Is it any less unfair that a 24 handicapper's gross 92 beats a scratch player's 69? But that is accepted week in week out at clubs across the world as part of the game.

Unless all golf is scratch golf then some element of handicapping is necessary and the use of different tees is just a part of that.

In any event isn't the thing about red tees really a red herring? The ladies' handicaps are based on playing off their own tees. If they played all their golf off the men's tees their scores, and accordingly their h/caps, might well be higher anyway, so in practice it is arguable that it makes little or no difference if the ladies play off the reds in a mixed comp - they are simply playing from the tees on which their h/caps are based.

x 2

 

[bladeplayer]

Seems a bit sad for someone to be complaining about the results in a charity day. Surely the emphasis is on raising money and having fun.

.

Bang On .. If its charity or society it doesnt mater a jot , otherwise if women want to play in mens comps they play off the same tees as the men & equaly men are allowed play in the same number of womens comps aswell ..

Equality is what we all want isnt it ???

 

[GreiginFife]

Seems to be a fixation with it being a mens comp. Sounds to me like it was a mixed comp and therefore open to men and women (and probably juniors too).
Yes, a gents competition should consist of men and vice versa but where it's an organised and nominated mixed competition open to all then what's the problem?
We have several mixed comps through the year at my club and they are just as good, and testing.