Inflation of Greens Fees for the Top UK Courses

[Deleted member 17920]

Last year it was £90 a round Mon - Thu, £105 Fri and £120 Sat/Sun i think

Is that Dunbar?

They have really pushed the prices up over the last few years, very nice course though.

 

[KenL]

Our visitor green fee is £40 ( 4 ball £120) for the 18 hole course and £20 for the 9 hole.

You wouldn't pay £40 for a round of golf?

Is that anywhere or do you not think your course is worth £40?

 

[AliMc]

Is that Dunbar?

They have really pushed the prices up over the last few years, very nice course though.

Yeah Dunbar LQ, as someone said earlier probably just keeping pace with similar courses in the area, North Berwick at £160 - ridiculous, would never ever consider paying that to play there, just my opinion obviously !

 

[KenL]

Last year it was £90 a round Mon - Thu, £105 Fri and £120 Sat/Sun i think

Twilight available too. That is very good value.

Shoulder rates too.

 

[KenL]

Yeah Dunbar LQ, as someone said earlier probably just keeping pace with similar courses in the area, North Berwick at £160 - ridiculous, would never ever consider paying that to play there, just my opinion obviously !

NB is up to £175 for this summer.

Nuts. You could get a game on the New AND Jubilee courses at St. Andrews for that.
They also are not part of the East Lothian members access scheme where we get on elsewhere for half price.

 

[IanM]

Birkdale at £15 would be very silly as well, so can't we just meet in the "middle" and say £40 for a twilight tee-time?

That would be great, count me in. Last time I was there, was as a member's guest and he paid!

 

[brfcfan]

Why are people criticising those who would pay it as daft? £200 -£300 gets you 4 hours great golf on a fantastically prepared course, following in the footsteps of legends of the game.

Some people are happy going to McDonald where others would pay £200 for a top restaurant, £500 to go to Spain or others spend more as a treat to go somewhere different. There is nothing wrong with this its personal choice.

I think lockdown has created a new wave of keyboard warriors who enjoy trolling and putting down the opinions of others rather than living and let live.

 

[Imurg]

Why are people criticising those who would pay it as daft? £200 -£300 gets you 4 hours great golf on a fantastically prepared course, following in the footsteps of legends of the game.

Some people are happy going to McDonald where others would pay £200 for a top restaurant, £500 to go to Spain or others spend more as a treat to go somewhere different. There is nothing wrong with this its personal choice.

I think lockdown has created a new wave of keyboard warriors who enjoy trolling and putting down the opinions of others rather than living and let live.

I don't think people are criticising those who want to spend their money on a top course, just the amount that those top courses are charging.

 

[mikejohnchapman]

Thing is it's not 'us' that's the target audience. It's yanks and Japanese and there is an endless supply of them willing to pay over inflated prices.

You make a base assumption that they want visitors - i'm not sure they do.

There are several instances where clubs have hiked green fees to reduce numbers to ensure their members can get a tee time and eventually move to no play unless you are a member or guest. As the number of courses continues to decline and the numbers of nomadic golfers increase, I can see a lot of the courses following a similar route because they just don't need the green fees. The fact most of the top courses don't participate in the County Card scheme supports this.

A model that encourages country membership vs visitors is much more likely to evolve.

 

[jim8flog]

You wouldn't pay £40 for a round of golf?

Is that anywhere or do you not think your course is worth £40?

It is that I would not pay £40 for a round of golf

Hard up pensioner

 

[KenL]

It is that I would not pay £40 for a round of golf

Hard up pensioner

Fair enough. Plenty opens at great courses for not much money.

 

[birdyhunter]

Not that we can play Augusta, but for those members who can, the course is nothing like the course at the Sunday Masters

That's a very simplistic way of looking at it. Of course not many amateurs can play Augusta and throughout the year the course is nothing like the Masters.

However, many UK courses like Celtic Manor, Woburn, Hanbury Manor, Forest of Arden are available to play all year round and even after Seniors tour events where Langer, Montgomerie, Woosnam have just played.. you just have to pay the green fee. Sure not everyone wants to, or can afford to pay, but plenty do and that's why they charge premium prices.

 

[jim8flog]

Fair enough. Plenty opens at great courses for not much money.

Being a senior I have played all the great courses in this area in interclub matches for free and a lot of the others in Opens, about the only other time I play away these days is in society days.

 

[Liverbirdie]

Know this will be slightly against the flow, but how many of you run a business that sells to locals, national and international ?

If you do, do you discount(massively) different for those markets or would you?

I know I wouldn't and don't to be honest, the price is my price, you could be english, Belgium, welsh, from herts or london or overseas doesn't make a difference to my price ......

Anyone can be a busy fool in business, as the saying goes. Birkdale could price it at £50 a round and have every tee time filled, but why do that......

That said the prices are stupid and way to high and most of the time isnt worth it

No, but for me its a bit like football/sport. It is a business but its also a part of this nations fabric and should act differently.

Im sure that some lobdon clubs, man u and liverpool could just auction or sell their tickets every week to tourists and sell out and get 2-3 times the price, at the expense of long standing supporters, locals and season ticket holders, but currently dont.

It should be british sport for british people, and irish. Same with the golf courses, or are we just a disneyland for tourist golfers and the rich only?

 

[Liverbirdie]

England Golf are the governing body of the game in England for amateur golf.

They are not business owners so they cant force any club into offering a green fee discount, that is what the county card is for as loyalty for golf club members in England.

Then its down to each individual club to accept the county card.

As you will know a lot of the top top courses dont accept the county cards and I have no idea why but its there decision as a business and unfortunately its the clubs own policy on setting green fee prices and any loyalty offering.

There are a few of the top clubs in Scotland that offer a local green fee but I dont believe it is that many but I stand to be corrected, it showed last year when some brought down green fees considerably to show how much they are truly overcharging the american market. There was some serious deals to be had last year and I imagine this year will be the same.

Correct, but if they do "benefit" the 637,000 england club golfers that they claim to do, maybe they should try and bring pressure to bear in whatever way they can.

 

[Wildboy370]

The prices they charge are what plenty of folks pay. Will be interesting to see if they keep them high this year with a travel ban or difficult travelling restrictions. Obviously most of them will have hefty bank balances and can probably ride the lack of visitors out. But interesting to see a difference of who wouldn’t who wouldn’t pay that amount. But a £200 + round of golf every year over a lifetime of able to play and enjoy is small fry to the average amount someone in London spends on alcohol in a lifetime £88000. Know where I would rather spend my money..

 

[sunshine]

You make a base assumption that they want visitors - i'm not sure they do.

There are several instances where clubs have hiked green fees to reduce numbers to ensure their members can get a tee time and eventually move to no play unless you are a member or guest. As the number of courses continues to decline and the numbers of nomadic golfers increase, I can see a lot of the courses following a similar route because they just don't need the green fees. The fact most of the top courses don't participate in the County Card scheme supports this.

A model that encourages country membership vs visitors is much more likely to evolve.

I'm not sure it works like that.

The top clubs want some visitors because charging £1000 for a 4 ball subsidises the running costs and keeps membership fees low. The visitors also spend big on merch. They don't need to let in many members, a few tee times a day at quiet times is all they need, and it maintains the exclusivity and pricing structure.

Top clubs don't participate in the county card scheme because the scheme is based on reciprocity. There's no benefit to the members to let in people from the local muni on the county card scheme for cheap. Those members probably have no desire to go and play the local goat track in return. They probably have bi-lateral reciprocal arrangements negotiated with one or two other top clubs.

 

[Liverbirdie]

I'd really like for it to be done in this way, but I don't think that's in line with reality unfortunately. A lot based on what I'm reading here, as although most seem to agree that the prices are way over the top, there's a lot of people who are willing to "treat themselves" every once in a while to play these courses that come in at £200+.

A quick check tells me there's about 1 million golfers in the UK who plays once or twice a month. If we just take 5%, which I don't think is an exaggerated number (although don't have anything to back this up with really other than speaking to everyone I know who plays golf), that's 50,000 "treat myself rounds" from the UK only. Split that out on say the top 50 courses and that's 1,000 rounds a year for each course, bringing in some fairly serious dosh. Add overseas golfers and corporate bookings on top of that and I don't see any chance of prices go down or even to slow down.

I think it is realistic, and like most dont mind paying premium fees to an extent, but due to the levels where getting to, basically only rich Brits or well off foreigners will be able to play them.

I'm not saying release hundreds of tee times for £30, but make it easier to afford for the people who have made these clubs what they are over the last 100 years, as an occasional treat.

However, no letting carpetbagging scandinavians take advantage until they have been here, at least, ooooo, 20 years.

 

[Liverbirdie]

Alas the SG hasn't done much for local golfers either, apart from the odd club, most of the deals are not there any longer, i think the best of the unions is the Irish one they do appear to offer a reduced reasonable rate to locals.
Most yanks don't have a clue what they are paying, for many of the clubs that do get overseas visitors you can get away with charging what you like, you get less visitors which members like and still get the same or more money coming in.

if i wanted to play Dornoch for instance i'd still have to pay £210, there is no local offer, they couldn't care less if locals can't play, why would they. they can, our could get close to 20,000 overseas visitors. my clubs the same, we don't get anywhere close the the same numbers they do and membership isn't subsidized as much.. already prompted for a big rise next year.


as you say Members should be putting pressure on the unions to do something about this, it is one of the great things about the sport is you can get to play the same courses as some of the greats of the game, not just the wealthy

Yourselves will know more of which courses do and which ones dont, but down here it feels like a lot of them do, but maybe its more the new kids on the block like Castle Stuart, Dumbarnie and KB who do rather than the old traditional courses.

I would also say that them three are more businesses than golf clubs, so it just goes to show that "businesses" can operate using this model, so renders that argument as moot, by others.

 

[howbow88]

Unfortunately it is an example of wider trends in the way our society and the world is going.
I don’t like it in golf or elsewhere.
But..I know it is going to get worse, or more expensive, and so I choose to play those bucket-list courses that I truly want to play, as soon as I can. Doing so in the knowledge that ‘less is more’ (as I can’t afford or won’t choose) to make a habit out of it...so it is a one-off, and I think that will help me to truly enjoy the moment

Yep. Events have become more desirable than material items. Partly because so many material items are now redundant due to smart phones/TVs, eg no real need for a sound system, CDs, blurays, etc.

Events have also become huge thanks to social media. The 'keeping up with the Jones's' thing used to be about material items more than events, but Instagram has made fancy holiday pics, music festivals/gigs the new aim.

And golf is seeing a similar trend, especially with 'influencers' making clubs that were once fairly secret, known to millions.

The American tourists are often here only once, partly because of the logistics in that it isn't a short flight, but also because they get an incredibly small amount of holiday allowance from their workplaces. So if you're on a genuine 'trip of a lifetime', then you are understandably going to splash out and not worry too much about your credit card bill.