Handicap Certificates

[redmike]

Afternoon all,

I was just wondering about handicap certificates. I am not a member of a club, so do not have one. However, I am going over to Donegal in October with the missus and quite fancy a round at the club in the village we are staying. You can book and pay for teetimes online, but in the visitors section it says that handicap certificates are required. In people's experiences how likely are clubs to ask visitors for handicap certificates just before their round?

Cheers

 

[Imurg]

This to me is one of the biggest insults in golf. The way some clubs demand that you are a member of a club or be able to prove your worth makes my blood boil. They demand a certificate or you can't play -as if this is a mark that means you can. While I was "between clubs" I could still play to 12-14 handicap but as I didn't have an official one some clubs wouldn't let me on. However, they were quite willing to let on a 28 handicapper (apologies to all 28'ers) who is going to mess up their course more than me. Having a handicap certificate that shows you as a 28 only means that you can go round in anything between 28 over and X over. I have known 28'ers that can't break 130 but they could play some clubs I couldn't.
And anyway, the scrap of paper I get from my club is so easy to replicate with, oooh, 5 minutes hard labour on the PC it really begs the question - why bother in the first place. Personally, I think the clubs that demand a handicap certificate should extract their heads and get into the real world. Clubs should be trying to attract players not hinder them. And I know there are places that you can get certificate if you give them 3 cards and you don't have to join a club but this shouldn't be the case.

Birthday rant over!!!

 

[birdieman]

Have only played 2 courses that require a certificate - Old Course and Royal Dornoch. Old Course starter did not ask to see it, at Dornoch 1st time I didn't need one, second time I did, depends who's on the desk that day I suppose.

Happy birthday Imurg but I don't agree, you know you could play to 12 or 14 but the people at the course did not unless you show a handicap certificate so in order to keep play moving and more importantly have a good standard of etiquette, dress and safety on the course you need players who know the rules and how to behave correctly from experience at a club so the experience is good for all visitors. Having a formal handicap is away of ensuring this. That may sound elitist but it is probably necessary I'm afraid in this day and age.

 

[Imurg]

Appreciate what you're saying Birdieman, but how does a handicap certificate prove any of the above. if you can get one in the post from The Golfers Club then you can "forge" one yourself. All it proves is that you've joined a club. Doesn't mean you know the rules etc etc
Sorry to hijack your thread Redmike.... I've been asked plenty of times to show one - mostly in advance and I've been able to get one. But just as many times one has been requested but on arrival at the club nothing has been asked for
????

 

[redmike]

Thanks for the replies lads. I suppose I can see it from both sides, they dont want their courses ruined by hackers, but I wouldn't be dragging myslef out of bed at the crack of dawn at the end of October on the NW atlantic coast of Ireland to play if i didnt know what I was doing. Not cheap to play either!

Whats the easiest way to get a handicap certificate without paying to join a club?

 

[DCB]

It's not just a certificate nowadays. Granted there is a portion of the paperwork that has a bona fide handicap certificate, duly signed by the club secretary, but there is also the playing record. Last one I asked for, earlier this summer, had my playing record back to 2005 season attached. Gives a fuller picture of what you have been doing on the course.

I think like Birdieman, the only place I've been asked for and had to produce one was at Carnoustie... One of the BIG courses.

I've had updated versions when playing away in open comps etc but never had to show it yet.

 

[RGuk]

f.w.i.w. I've never had to show one anywhere, ever, zero, not asked, never failed to get on, always blag it.....etc.etc.

Make your own and do yourself a favour if you're worried.

 

[stevo]

I think if a club has rule to ask for a handicap cert,then you should provide one if asked.Members pay an annual membership to play the course and pay for its upkeep,they have a right to decided who plays and who doesn't.

 

[RGuk]

I think if a club has rule to ask for a handicap cert,then you should provide one if asked.Members pay an annual membership to play the course and pay for its upkeep,they have a right to decided who plays and who doesn't.

I won't argue with this. The point is one rarely gets asked.
I suppose it's like ID at the pub.....if you've got it, you never have to show it.
If members have this right (which I totally uphold b.t.w.) then maybe places should be more stringent.

 

[stevo]

I feel a big debate coming on !!

 

[Adjani]

redmike, there are online sites that will sort you out a certificate (google - online handicap certificates)

Not really bona fide, but hopefully get you on the course you want to play

 

[DCB]

" redmike, there are online sites that will sort you out a certificate (google - online handicap certificates)

Not really bona fide, but hopefully get you on the course you want to play "

Only a memebr club can issue a CONGU handicap. If your just looking for something to show you play golf to a certain level then one of these OnLine certificates may well suffice, but this is not a proper handicap certificate. You can't play in open comps etc with one of these.

Clubs pay a fee ot their national golf union to be able to a) rate the course, b) provide a recognised national handicap for a member based competitive golf over that course. The menebers in effect pay that fee as part of their subs.

If you want a proper handicap the only way to obtain one is to join a club and put in three cards to get a handicap. You then have to maintain that handicap by playing regular golf. In Scotland we have to put in three cards min per year to maintain the handicap otherwise it becomes lapsed as it is may not be a true reflection of your playing ability.

 

[redmike]

The other thing I was wondering about handicaps - if i do join a club - and a couple of us are thinking about it - i have no real interest (at the moment) of playing in competitions etc - but would just prefer to play with the friends i regulalrly play with - its a social thing as well, and is really the only chance I get to chat with some of them. If i didnt play in club comps etc, would the cards from our friendly games still count once I'd got my handicap? (I realise that to start with we'd probably have to have a member with us marking the cards to get the handicap).

Have just found out from my dad that one of my mums cousins was captain a couple of years ago at the club i fancy playing so might have a word with him. I dont want to upset the members, who, like someone said, have paid a lot of money for the privilege. HAve also found a couple of other courses close by that dont require certs so may just play there!

 

[viscount17]

can say if it works this way everywhere but your three handicap cards have to be signed by a member. handicap secretary will often fix you up with a member in order to get a signed card. non-competition cards don't count toward handicap thereafter.
you can't enter competitions until you have the handicap and can't enter major club competitions until you've played at least 3 medals.

 

[Cernunnos]

Some clubs you can use daily play to affect your handicap & at others it needs to be compo' play only that counts.

Personally I don't agree with clubs that insist you play comps to maintain your handicap.As I enjoy golf & enjoy playing golf with mates, & even the works competitions, but really have no time for playing golf with people I have little in common with or don't care to know any better at clubs I've been a member at. As I've come across some really stuck up players & in some cases downright obnoxious I've been essentially forced to play golf with in compo's. Don't get me wong I love playing with new people & making new mates & friends etc. But roll up on Competition day on say a Sunday when I have beeter things to do with the family. Mainly as I prefer to play my golf & compos during the week rather than on weekends.

I know its a big bugbear of mine. But with more & more people having odd working patterns, weekends are not the convinient time they once were, especially when weekends off work as rare as they are people like myself need to spend quality family time, even in-fornt of a pastime I love doing.

However, I digress... I've played at many courses that advertise that they ask for handicaps but when you get there, handicap certificate neetly ferreted away in wallet, when you pay for the golf, thinking the next question will be for the handicap cert', they don't even look as if they are about to ask.

If someone is holding up play at one of these courses, then maybe they might be asked midround for that piece of paper or booklet by a course marshall & might possibly be asked to leave. Though even this I've yet to see happen to anyone.

By all means join a club to get a handicap, or submit cards online or via post or pay the £30 or so to a club who advertise to fast track a handicap for the price of three rounds at their course... smart on their part.But in reality most people most of the time are unlikely to need a certificate, unless playing in Amature-Opens or pro-ams.

 

[grumpyjock]

Never been asked for one yet.
If you play with a works society its normaly accepted that at least you can hit the ball.
As far as a club is concerened its to keep the lads who lob it 25yards and take a large divot (which they never ever replace) at every hit including the teed up drive.
please just ask the starter when you ring up, tell him that you play a lot and give your normal playing level 24-28 or 20-24 handicap.
Better to be honest than loose out.

 

[RGuk]

Personally I don't agree with clubs that insist you play comps to maintain your handicap.

It will be interesting to see what they do at my club with my handicap. I have written to express my concern about what has happened this year and expect to receive a phone call or letter soon.
Essentially, the only comps that attract h'cap adjustments and selection for club teams are on Saturdays.....which I can't do. The Sunday comps are ignored totally, the mid-weeks have become Seniors or Ladies only and the Club night summer 9 holes are also pointless. At ALL my previous clubs, there have been midweek comps (off whites) and if only 4 members participated, then only those 4 could get adjusted. I got from 28-9 almost entirely on mid-week comps and Sunday comps. In effect, my club could suspend my h'cap at any time or refuse to let me put my name down for the big summer comps.
My argument is that if I play a proper game with fellow members, complete the card properly and play sh** I'm still due an increase of 0.1 on my exact and, more importantly, if I've played 50 (?) times then if any problems arose, there'd be hell to play.

What's wrong with marking one day each week as a proper comp day and letting 2 players who are free play a game which can affect both h'cap and team selection.

If I was in charge and had players at the club who couldn't do weekends and didn't want to play too regularly, I'd allow any proper cards to suffice in maintaining a h'cap.

 

[smange]

Where you planning on playing redmike? I live in Donegal and could meet up with you if you not gonna be too far away.

 

[Cernunnos]

I found out last year that strickly speaking any proper round signed by another pearson also with an official handicap at any club ought to be eligable at your own club, for handicapadjustment purposes. Ironically I don't know a single club that allows this for either increasing or reducing handicap.

Had this sort of thing beeen allowed I'd probably have had alower handicap than I did when I left my previous club. Add to this proper rounds on own club that wern't comp days. Just imagine how all those rounds of 84 or 85 on the Parr 68 Brailsford (my Previous course) would have meant I wouldn't have had a 28 handicap card.

Especially when you consider the Company golf day I won last September with an 84 around the Ramada Gloucester, and the good performance I had in North wales last year. All rounds accurately scored.

Ok so this year I've scored everything on my usual parr 72 course of 92 - 120, (mainly due to a case of the shanks not long ago), forunately the game is coming back.

So Tuesday should be interesting when i play another local course I really fell appart of on the back nine when the shanks hit big style, as I don't think there is a single horizontal lie on the whole back 2/3rds.

 

[DCB]

Some interesting thoughts on the handicaping process here. I thought that this years changes in the CONGU handicap system had taken the Extra Day Card out of the equation and that all normal adjustments had to be via a 'qualifying competition' Other than putting in my 'Away' scores after playing in open comps, the only way I've been adjusted is by playing comps at my home club.

Why join a club if you aren't going to play in the competitions ?

Why join a club that doesnt suit your working lifestyle in the way they put on cometitions ?

Not having a pop at anyone her but after forking out a lot of money to play I would be really narked if I couldn't play in many of the comps.