EU Referendum

[MegaSteve]

Bosses of BIG business have threatened to depart in the past...
Yet, have remained here...

Yet, we are to believe them this time apparently ...

They are a bit like politicians...
When do you know they are telling porky's???


Much of our manufacturing has trucked off already anyway...
Because our membership of the EU made it all too easy for them to do so...


In the words of Wolfie "Power to the People" :thup:...

The 'bosses' have got the same number of votes as everyone else... ONE!

 

[ColchesterFC]

Not 100% sure what your point is? Large companies on the stock exchange nowadays are global, they are owned by many different institutions in many different countries. I work for a Finnish company that provides employment for over 100 people in this country. Is the point it should only be British companies owned by British people who can possibly comment on this?

What is the point of pointing out that 3 of the top managers in Vodafone are not British? It is a massively successful British service company employing 1000s of people in the UK. As do the others, they employ British workers and pay taxes (well most do) here as well. Who actually owns them or what nationality the chief exec is is not really here nor there in todays globalised economy

Also you are getting confused between Rolls Royce the small BMW owned car manufacturer and Rolls Royce the very British Derby based global player in power systems and engines. 2 very separate companies.

My point, as I suspect you actually understand, is that with pretty much all of Europe wanting us to remain in the EU it is hardly surprising that bosses of what are European owned or run companies would come out in favour of us staying in. Such as three of the top bosses at Vodafone hence the reason for mentioning them.

 

[Hacker Khan]

Bosses of BIG business have threatened to depart in the past...
Yet, have remained here...

Yet, we are to believe them this time apparently ...

They are a bit like politicians...
When do you know they are telling porky's???


Much of our manufacturing has trucked off already anyway...
Because our membership of the EU made it all too easy for them to do so...


In the words of Wolfie "Power to the People" :thup:...

The 'bosses' have got the same number of votes as everyone else... ONE!

It's not so much a threat of departure, especially in the short term, but they are saying that being in the EU makes the UK a more attractive place to do business and effectively make more profits for them. It is in the interests of everyone in the UK that companies based here employ as many people as possible and make as much money as possible. If they can't then having fewer immigrants will mean dick all in the general scheme of things if the economy can not function to the best of its ability.

I like anyone do not know for a fact that not being in the EU will mean that they will not be able to employ as many people and pay taxes. But that is what they are saying, so it's then up to people whether to believe them or not.

As for manufacturing then I imagine a lot has gone to the far east/China due to many factors, mostly down to the fact they have gained the required knowledge and are generally cheaper to employ. Plus I would argue the Conservative economic policies of the 80s and 90s did not help. And I am struggling to see the economic and political argument why us being in the EU has made that easier?

 

[ColchesterFC]

It's not so much a threat of departure, especially in the short term, but they are saying that being in the EU makes the UK a more attractive place to do business and effectively make more profits for them. It is in the interests of everyone in the UK that companies based here employ as many people as possible and make as much money as possible. If they can't then having fewer immigrants will mean dick all in the general scheme of things if the economy can not function to the best of its ability.

I like anyone do not know for a fact that not being in the EU will mean that they will not be able to employ as many people and pay taxes. But that is what they are saying, so it's then up to people whether to believe them or not.

Weren't similar claims made at the time there was the debate on whether or not to join the Euro?

 

[Hacker Khan]

My point, as I suspect you actually understand, is that with pretty much all of Europe wanting us to remain in the EU it is hardly surprising that bosses of what are European owned or run companies would come out in favour of us staying in. Such as three of the top bosses at Vodafone hence the reason for mentioning them.

So the argument is that Vodafone, the second largest mobile telecoms company in the world, the third largest company on the LSE, a British company based in Newbury that operate in over 150 countries, are not basing the reason to want the UK to stay in the EU on compelling economic arguments which they think will be ultimately be beneficial for their shareholders. But on the fact that their current Chief Exec was born in Italy? So of course because of that Vodafone will want the Uk to stay?

 

[Old Skier]

Can someone explain how that prior to 75 we were a major importer and exporter, since joining an ever beuracratic and costly organisation we have lost most of our export business but we are still a major importer.

Big business moves to wherever the tax advantages, manpower costs and government subsides are greatest, we even see businesses moving around the UK because of this.

The EU will never impose a levy on the UK just because they leave, they couldn't afford the loss of trade unless we become a major exporter with nett gains against the EU.

Im also not sure what this leap into the unknown is if we leave - we have been there before. The only real unknown is remaining in as we have no idea what an unelected commission in the EU will impose on us next.

 

[MegaSteve]

It's not so much a threat of departure, especially in the short term, but they are saying that being in the EU makes the UK a more attractive place to do business and effectively make more profits for them. It is in the interests of everyone in the UK that companies based here employ as many people as possible and make as much money as possible. If they can't then having fewer immigrants will mean dick all in the general scheme of things if the economy can not function to the best of its ability.

I like anyone do not know for a fact that not being in the EU will mean that they will not be able to employ as many people and pay taxes. But that is what they are saying, so it's then up to people whether to believe them or not.

As for manufacturing then I imagine a lot has gone to the far east/China due to many factors, mostly down to the fact they have gained the required knowledge and are generally cheaper to employ. Plus I would argue the Conservative economic policies of the 80s and 90s did not help. And I am struggling to see the economic and political argument why us being in the EU has made that easier?

As I indicated in the other thread despite my rantings I am actually wavering...
Really want to support the [seemingly] lone furrow Kate Hoey is ploughing...
But held back by 1 or 2 of the odious types on the Brexit platform...

What will NEVER sway my opinion is the 'guidance' of Cameron/Blair/Brown/Osborne et al...
Or the utterings of business leaders who HAVE prospered GREATLY through our EU membership and allowed VERY little of this to filter down...

Apologies for capitals... Totally un-necessary I know... Hanging head in shame...

A lot of 'our' food production has moved to the continent as business found it all to easy to do so because being in the club made it that way... Expensive to ship 'everyday' foodstuffs from Far East...

And, yes I cannot deny MaggieT wreaked a great deal of havoc on the working man/woman...

And finally, hand on heart, not fussed either way about immigration...
As long as they learn my lingo and work with my 'values' rather than against them...

It's a five minute walk to the polling station [for me]...
Suspect it'll be during those few minutes I'll be making my mind up what way to vote...

 

[Old Skier]

It appears Mr Corbyn is not overly keen to get involved in the EU In campaign according to opposition ministers. Source - Daily Polotics so it might be rubbish.

 

[ColchesterFC]

So the argument is that Vodafone, the second largest mobile telecoms company in the world, the third largest company on the LSE, a British company based in Newbury that operate in over 150 countries, are not basing the reason to want the UK to stay in the EU on compelling economic arguments which they think will be ultimately be beneficial for their shareholders. But on the fact that their current Chief Exec was born in Italy? So of course because of that Vodafone will want the Uk to stay?

I'm not yet convinced that there is a compelling economic argument for staying in the EU so would like to know more about it before deciding which way to vote. You are obviously happy to accept what these companies are saying as it supports your belief that we should stay in the EU. I want to see the facts from both sides of the argument to be able to make an informed decision.

And it is you that has focussed on Vodafone rather than any of the other companies I mentioned. Do you really think a Spanish or Dutch owned company would do anything other than come out on the side of the UK staying in the EU?

 

[MegaSteve]

It appears Mr Corbyn is not overly keen to get involved in the EU In campaign according to opposition ministers. Source - Daily Polotics so it might be rubbish.

This is exactly what I was hoping...

There's no need for him to get involved...

Stand aside and leave it all to the tory boys 'n girls...

 

[Old Skier]

This is exactly what I was hoping...

There's no need for him to get involved...

Stand aside and leave it all to the tory boys 'n girls...

Only because he can be called out as an out man.

 

[MegaSteve]

Only because he can be called out as an out man.

Not fussed as to his reasons...
As long as he remains faded into grey...

Best opportunity, so far, for Labour to distance themselves from Blair/Brown...
Who were tory boys aside from the red rosettes they falsely wore...

 

[Foxholer]

... we have no idea what an unelected commission in the EU will impose on us next.

Can you explain what you mean by 'unelected commission'?

As far as I know - and I'm certainly happy to be corrected - all legislation enacted by the EU has been approved by the EU Parliament -all members of which are elected! There's absolutely no difference between the 'unelected bureaucrats' in Brussels and the unelected bureaucrats in any other Civil Service - Whitehall for example!

 

[Old Skier]

Can you explain what you mean by 'unelected commission'?

As far as I know - and I'm certainly happy to be corrected - all legislation enacted by the EU has been approved by the EU Parliament -all members of which are elected! There's absolutely no difference between the 'unelected bureaucrats' in Brussels and the unelected bureaucrats in any other Civil Service - Whitehall for example!

We can start with acceptance of the budge - were the elected body refused to pass or accept it but the unelected commission have said tough (for over 16 years) that's what it is take it or leave it. As it shows a black hole of several billions each year that the commissions cannot account for I think that's not a bad area to high light.

 

[Foxholer]

We can start with acceptance of the budge - were the elected body refused to pass or accept it but the unelected commission have said tough (for over 16 years) that's what it is take it or leave it. As it shows a black hole of several billions each year that the commissions cannot account for I think that's not a bad area to high light.

Nope! While that's certainly an area of (great) concern - presuming you mean 'budget' - that's not legislation!!

In fact, it's quite possibly the legislation passed by the elected Parliament that has been causing the overspend! Along with the usual levels of ineptitude and fraud!

Would similar 'black holes' be discovered if the same approach was taken to the likes of PFI?

Try again!

 

[Old Skier]

Nope! While that's certainly an area of (great) concern - presuming you mean 'budget' - that's not legislation!!

Try again!

How can an organisation legislate for anything that requires financing when they don't know what they have to spend or are you in favour of the deep pockets spending policy where you just demand more money when you have spent what you have.

 

[Foxholer]

How can an organisation legislate for anything that requires financing when they don't know what they have to spend or are you in favour of the deep pockets spending policy where you just demand more money when you have spent what you have.

Sounds like badly thought out (uncosted) legislation to me! Which is down to the elected Parliament!

Get the elected officials to do their job properly!

You still haven't given any example of legislation by unelected officials!

 

[Old Skier]

You still haven't given any example of legislation by unelected officials!

Your not a Liverpool fan are you.

 

[Foxholer]

Perhaps you should read this link!

http://ec.europa.eu/budget/explained/myths/myths_en.cfm

or this one!

http://johnmccormick.eu/2014/05/three-of-the-most-persistent-myths-about-the-european-union/

 

[Old Skier]

Perhaps you should read this link!

http://ec.europa.eu/budget/explained/myths/myths_en.cfm

or this one!

http://johnmccormick.eu/2014/05/three-of-the-most-persistent-about-the-european-union/

Nice one - the first one appears to be a European commission documents. I unfortunately can only go on news reports stating that the budget has not been signed off by auditors for the last 16 years, I have no other facts to go on.

I also don't think I have mentioned legislation this week and not in this thread but I'm willing to be corrected.