EU Referendum

[ColchesterFC]

Isn't the fact that the Daily Mail clearly wants us the leave the EU a good enough reason to vote to stay in? :mmm:

Isn't the fact that David Cameron clearly wants us to stay in the EU a good enough reason to vote to leave?

 

[Hobbit]

Why indeed - but many Scots will and do - you'll soon discover that! Have fun telling them to shut up.

I've not once said shut up, and did in fact say "happy to debate." However, I note you've now moved on to your usual rant about the NHS. Let's be honest here, for once, and admit you are a dyed in the wool anti-Tory who would say black is white rather than have a balanced debate.

if you and I sat down over a beer to discuss the whole issue you might just find we are closer in our opinions than you think, assuming you shut up long enough to listen.

 

[Fish]

I've not once said shut up, and did in fact say "happy to debate." However, I note you've now moved on to your usual rant about the NHS. Let's be honest here, for once, and admit you are a dyed in the wool anti-Tory who would say black is white rather than have a balanced debate.

if you and I sat down over a beer to discuss the whole issue you might just find we are closer in our opinions than you think, assuming you shut up long enough to listen.

😂😂😂

👍

 

[MegaSteve]

Isn't the fact that the Daily Mail clearly wants us the leave the EU a good enough reason to vote to stay in? :mmm:

Isn't the fact that David Cameron clearly wants us to stay in the EU a good enough reason to vote to leave?

This is possibly why many are confused about what to do...

Their daily read says out is good....
But, the leader of the pack says voting out is good but actually leaving will be bad...

Dave just wants a bit more leverage to enable him to get a better deal for his mates in business...
Who are off if we leave [apparently]..

Dave, despite what he keeps telling us. does not care two hoots about hard working folk...
Otherwise, why is he holding the proverbial gun against the head of our hard working junior doctors...

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Boils down to the question......who do you trust to tell you the truth about the EU.....David Cameron or Nigel Farage.

Simple answer for me to compute.

 

[MegaSteve]

Boils down to the question......who do you trust to tell you the truth about the EU.....David Cameron or Nigel Farage.

Simple answer for me to compute.

Depends on what you want the truth to be...

 

[SocketRocket]

Boils down to the question......who do you trust to tell you the truth about the EU.....David Cameron or Nigel Farage.

Simple answer for me to compute.

Farage seemed to be making the most sense on QT last night. Most of the points expressed by people to STAY were very garbled and playing on the tactics of fear.

 

[ColchesterFC]

So you obviously feel that for you the benefits of being in the EU outweigh the negatives. What are the benefits you see and what, if any, negatives?

That question is open to all those that will be voting to stay in, not just Delc.

I posed this question a couple of pages back but didn't get an answer from any of those that will be voting to stay in the EU so thought I post it again in the hope that it doesn't get lost in yet another flurry of posts about Scottish independence.

 

[Foxholer]

I posed this question a couple of pages back but didn't get an answer from any of those that will be voting to stay in the EU so thought I post it again in the hope that it doesn't get lost in yet another flurry of posts about Scottish independence.

Cheaper imports; Cheaper - therefore more - exports, meaning more employment, so a better economy. More global influence, via a larger organisation that UK has significant influence in, as opposed to a single relatively small other voice. Less bureaucracy overall as many/most of the shared bureaucratic functions that EU provide would need to be duplicated by UK, or added to the existing Civil Service functions.

Of course, that doesn't mean that there isn't 'wastage' within the EU!

 

[ColchesterFC]

Why are our imports and exports cheaper by being in the EU? If we left and had a trade agreement surely with the amount we import we would be in a strong position to negotiate a good deal due to the quantity of goods we buy from the EU.

Wouldn't our influence from being members of NATO and the G7 be greater than from simply being an EU member?

 

[SocketRocket]

Why are our imports and exports cheaper by being in the EU? If we left and had a trade agreement surely with the amount we import we would be in a strong position to negotiate a good deal due to the quantity of goods we buy from the EU.



Wouldn't our influence from being members of NATO and the G7 be greater than from simply being an EU member?

Yes.

The fact that we import more than we export to the EU seems to keep falling on deaf ears. It would not be in the interest of the EU to set up trade barriers with the UK. Oh no! We would also have a whole bunch of money that we currently post off to the EU to spend on our own projects. The 'out' benefits go on and on

IMO our influence in the World (If we want any that is) is watered down significantly by being one of the EU 28 and the 27 tend to have different opinions to us on most issues. Our influence as you say is mainly through NATO and coalitions with countries like the USA. How on earth do countries like Australia manage to get by!

 

[Foxholer]

Forgot to mention the effect of the multinationals that are only in UK because it is part of Europe! Their contribution to the UK economy is pretty significant, as is the potential loss of London as the major centre for Financial Services!

I've already shown that simply using import vs export figures is folly. But, in doing so, you seem to be suggesting that is good to be forever spending more than we earn! Are you really promoting that?

 

[SocketRocket]

Forgot to mention the effect of the multinationals that are only in UK because it is part of Europe! Their contribution to the UK economy is pretty significant, as is the potential loss of London as the major centre for Financial Services!

I've already shown that simply using import vs export figures is folly. But, in doing so, you seem to be suggesting that is good to be forever spending more than we earn! Are you really promoting that?

Regarding the Multinationals. I am not convinced that there would be any significant change after a Brexit and why do you believe London will lose the Financial Service industry, it has little to do with us being in the EU and is more to do with the Expertise in that sector, much like many other businesses.

Regarding us spending more than we earn! We already do that in the EU so surely staying in will perpetuate that situation. I cant understand why you ask me if I promote it. I should be asking you on the basis of being in favour of us continuing with being a member of a club that we haemorrhage money to.

 

[ColchesterFC]

Which multinationals are only here because we are part of the EU? I would agree that with the reliance of our economy on the financial services industry that loss would be a major blow to the UK economy but I'm not yet convinced that it would up and move to Frankfurt or wherever else if we left. I'm sure that far cleverer minds than mine could come up with some sort of incentive that would encourage them to stay in London if we weren't part of the EU and could work out our own inducements that wouldn't necessarily have to follow EU rules/legislation.

I'm not suggesting that spending more than we earn is a good idea, far from it, but my point was more that the EU wouldn't suddenly decide to stop trading with us if we left as they get more income from us than we get from them.

 

[ColchesterFC]

And I'd like to add that it makes a nice change to be having a sensible and rational conversation/debate on this without it descending into the usual name calling and petty insults that seems to happen all too often on here.

 

[SocketRocket]

And I'd like to add that it makes a nice change to be having a sensible and rational conversation/debate on this without it descending into the usual name calling and petty insults that seems to happen all too often on here.

Couldn't agree more. Well other than pointing out those in favour of a 'Stay' vote tend to be Yoghurt knitting, Yurt dwelling Codpiece faces

 

[MegaSteve]

Couldn't agree more. Well other than pointing out those in favour of a 'Stay' vote tend to be Yoghurt knitting, Yurt dwelling Codpiece faces

I'd just like to point out that those of us on the left of the left were against jointing in the first place...
But, I am sure you knew that already...

And, I am fairly confident the current leader of the pack [Jezza] remains unconvinced there's any real benefit in membership...

 

[Doon frae Troon]

I posed this question a couple of pages back but didn't get an answer from any of those that will be voting to stay in the EU so thought I post it again in the hope that it doesn't get lost in yet another flurry of posts about Scottish independence.

You did, but you did not like the replies.

 

[ColchesterFC]

You did, but you did not like the replies.

Once more you post just to get a reaction. Have you actually looked at the posts after I put that question there? It immediately went off onto a discussion about the Scottish and then junior doctors. Until Foxholer posted above there wasn't a single reply so there was nothing to like or dislike. I would suggest that you stop trolling for a reaction especially n this case where it is easy for anyone to re-read the previous posts and see straight through your pathetic response.

Not that it is unexpected that you refused to answer as you have history of avoiding answering questions you don't like. And as I posted above it WAS nice to be having a normal discussion about something without the petty insults/name calling etc but I suppose that now you are back involved it will quickly go back to the usual question avoidance and semantic arguments.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Farage seemed to be making the most sense on QT last night. Most of the points expressed by people to STAY were very garbled and playing on the tactics of fear.

It seems that no matter the words a STAY campaigner uses to extoll a benefit from being in the EU, a LEAVE campaigner portrays that as STAY playing on fears of losing that benefit by adding 'and you say we might lose that benefit if we leave'. When in fact all the STAY campaigner may be saying is 'look at this benefit'. Indeed it seems that the FEAR campaign is something that LEAVE are talking up. And so while it seems a bit-counter intuitive, I think STAY should almost completely avoid talking about 'losing' anything - just talk of the benefits and let LEAVE come up wit their counter-benefits

And as far as Farage is concerned - well he was very disingenuous on LBC last night. Letting one LEAVE supporter after another talk rubbish/fantasy about the EU and how England would be after leaving. Some complete barmy madness underpinning the leave arguments of many LEAVE supporters calling in - and Farage did little to counter what they were saying - even although he must have known they were talking complete rubbish. He clearly doesn't care what reasons individuals give if they are to vote LEAVE