EU Referendum

[User20205]

When Boris Johnson says "Take back control", what he actually means is that he wants to take control! ��

the irony about taking back control, is that our financial future is controlled by hedge fund managers and stock market speculators, who are faceless, non elected and motivated obviously by self interest. All 'taking control' means is providing a political environment to satisfy their requirements in the vain hope they won't ruin us all

 

[drdel]

Thank God the whole thing will be over tomorrow! 🙄

Here, here!

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Very convincing stuff from the remain camp, it does make you wonder sometimes how on earth did me manage on our own for so long without "help" from the EU.

Macmillan saw that whilst the UK was doing OK recovering post-war - that was not going to last - hence his keenness for UK to join the EEC (was never formally called the Common Market btw) in 1961 as he could see the EEC forging ahead of the UK and the UK starting to struggle. And eventually UK joined in 1973. Hence the success of the UK economy today is despite it's starting position.

 

[Hobbit]

Macmillan saw that whilst the UK was doing OK recovering post-war - that was not going to last - hence his keenness for UK to join the EEC (was never formally called the Common Market btw) in 1961 as he could see the EEC forging ahead of the UK and the UK starting to struggle. And eventually UK joined in 1973. Hence the success of the UK economy today is despite it's starting position.

Totally agree with the history lesson, and France vetoed our first effort to join. However, that isn't what we are a member of at present... not that that makes it a bad thing.

As to Turkey; they may not have ticked all the boxes but why are two of our senior diplomats out there looking at accelerated visas for 1.5 million Turkish nationals? Gisle, in last night's debate, is the first politician to allude to it, even though it was in the Times two weeks ago.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

the irony about taking back control, is that our financial future is controlled by hedge fund managers and stock market speculators, who are faceless, non elected and motivated obviously by self interest. All 'taking control' means is providing a political environment to satisfy their requirements in the vain hope they won't ruin us all

Not to worry - Bojo has said that if the UK exits and we go into recession he'll say sorry. Well that's OK then Bojo. That'll fix things.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Totally agree with the history lesson, and France vetoed our first effort to join. However, that isn't what we are a member of at present... not that that makes it a bad thing.

As to Turkey; they may not have ticked all the boxes but why are two of our senior diplomats out there looking at accelerated visas for 1.5 million Turkish nationals? Gisle, in last night's debate, is the first politician to allude to it, even though it was in the Times two weeks ago.

On Turkey -why are Leave simply ignoring the fact that every member country has a veto over any other country joining. So regardless of what is happening now in respect of Turkey's accession - it will not happen unless the UK agrees. What is so hard to understand about that?

 

[Beezerk]

On Turkey -why are Leave simply ignoring the fact that every member country has a veto over any other country joining. So regardless of what is happening now in respect of Turkey's accession - it will not happen unless the UK agrees. What is so hard to understand about that?

From what I recall from a radio debate last week, whether are not they get EU status is irrelevant, as Hobbit mentioned, deals are currently been struck to allow some form of free travel for Turks within Europe.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

From what I recall from a radio debate last week, whether are not they get EU status is irrelevant, as Hobbit mentioned, deals are currently been struck to allow some form of free travel for Turks within Europe.

That may be the case off the back of Turkey acting as Europe's eastern border control. So let's just scrap that and see where we get with refugee migration from the east. Because In or Out of the EU - we will have to deal with significant numbers of immigrants and refugees - and it will be tougher without Turkey acting as our border guard, and 'control of our own borders' is not going to help us much on the refugee front.

 

[ColchesterFC]

On Turkey -why are Leave simply ignoring the fact that every member country has a veto over any other country joining. So regardless of what is happening now in respect of Turkey's accession - it will not happen unless the UK agrees. What is so hard to understand about that?

There is nothing hard to understand about that but are you so naive to think that a certain amount of horse trading doesn't go on within the EU? For example Germany says to the UK if you back us on Turkey joining then we'll back you on something that you want.

And it's also interesting that you are willing to believe Cameron when he says that Turkey won't be joining despite you and DfT being two of his biggest critics about what you say were broken promises made during the Scottish referendum. I assume that you are willing take his word for it on this occasion because he is saying something that supports your opinion.

 

[Crazyface]

Anyhoo, the vote tomorrow will be in favour of staying, as will not be as close as predicted, as most people fear change and that is what the campaign to remain has used...FEAR.

The Leave posters and placards are up all over my town, with the Remain ones nowhere to be seen, which indicates that the Leave vote is more passionate but that won't carry them over the line....unfortunately.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

There is nothing hard to understand about that but are you so naive to think that a certain amount of horse trading doesn't go on within the EU? For example Germany says to the UK if you back us on Turkey joining then we'll back you on something that you want.

And it's also interesting that you are willing to believe Cameron when he says that Turkey won't be joining despite you and DfT being two of his biggest critics about what you say were broken promises made during the Scottish referendum. I assume that you are willing take his word for it on this occasion because he is saying something that supports your opinion.

Cameron is going to be history when (decades down the line) any vote on Turkey's accession might be held.

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

That may be the case off the back of Turkey acting as Europe's eastern border control. So let's just scrap that and see where we get with refugee migration from the east. Because In or Out of the EU - we will have to deal with significant numbers of immigrants and refugees - and it will be tougher without Turkey acting as our border guard, and 'control of our own borders' is not going to help us much on the refugee front.

How do you work that out? If we vote to leave then WE decide who comes in and not the EU.

 

[ColchesterFC]

So you are happy to believe Cameron when he says that they won't be joining in the next few years then?

I mean it's not as if the EU have bent/broken the rules before to allow new members to join when they haven't met all the criteria is it?

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Anyhoo, the vote tomorrow will be in favour of staying, as will not be as close as predicted, as most people fear change and that is what the campaign to remain has used...FEAR.

The Leave posters and placards are up all over my town, with the Remain ones nowhere to be seen, which indicates that the Leave vote is more passionate but that won't carry them over the line....unfortunately.

Spot on apart from the last word
It has been like that since day one........all that hot air, porkies, promises, devil deals and energy have been totally wasted.

 

[Hobbit]

On Turkey -why are Leave simply ignoring the fact that every member country has a veto over any other country joining. So regardless of what is happening now in respect of Turkey's accession - it will not happen unless the UK agrees. What is so hard to understand about that?

From what I recall from a radio debate last week, whether are not they get EU status is irrelevant, as Hobbit mentioned, deals are currently been struck to allow some form of free travel for Turks within Europe.

That may be the case off the back of Turkey acting as Europe's eastern border control. So let's just scrap that and see where we get with refugee migration from the east. Because In or Out of the EU - we will have to deal with significant numbers of immigrants and refugees - and it will be tougher without Turkey acting as our border guard.

The EU border control is in Greece, not Turkey. Why not give the €3.2billion to Greece and Italy, not Turkey? Or alternatively, lets call it foreign aid, but at least lets be honest about it.

You're fudging and you know you are. 3 months ago Cameron agreed with the rest of the EU on accelerated membership AND free movement of special status Turkish nationals, i.e. those with diplomatic passports. Unfortunately, even a road sweeper, if he's state employed, can get a special passport. Moving forward with that scenario, the roadsweeper comes to Britain, and his replacement is then also eligible for a special passport.

Whether you like it or not, Cameron has lied and lied again about Turkey. Don't get me wrong, I'm voting in but that doesn't mean I agree with a hell of a lot that has been put out there by Remain or Brexit. I've not lapped up the propaganda

 

[CheltenhamHacker]

Whilst the Turkish issue is a big one, what happens if we vote out, BUT have to agree to free movement of labour (which everyone is saying we'll have to). We'll still end up with the same Turks coming over, but will have had absolutely no say in the arrangements behind it

 

[Hacker Khan]

There is nothing hard to understand about that but are you so naive to think that a certain amount of horse trading doesn't go on within the EU? For example Germany says to the UK if you back us on Turkey joining then we'll back you on something that you want.

And it's also interesting that you are willing to believe Cameron when he says that Turkey won't be joining despite you and DfT being two of his biggest critics about what you say were broken promises made during the Scottish referendum. I assume that you are willing take his word for it on this occasion because he is saying something that supports your opinion.

Personally I take what the major politicians are saying with a pinch of salt. Instead I prefer to listen to professors who have studies the EU for years and are experts in EU law, and as I have already posted once this is what said professor said about this: -

It is also worth recalling that the accession of future Member States requires the unanimous agreement of the 28 governments plus their national ratification processes. The only large applicant is Turkey – and there is no realistic prospect of Turkey joining the EU within any of our lifetimes – not least since several countries have indicated that they would hold national referenda on any Turkish deal, obviously in the expectation that their populations would overwhelmingly reject it.”

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

I really feel that we are about to blow a golden opportunity to improve our country by voting to stay in

 

[bluewolf]

I really feel that we are about to blow a golden opportunity to improve our country by voting to stay in

I feel like we could possibly be about to blow decades of hard work and cause serious damage to our economy and security by voting to get out....

In all honesty though, there's no way to definitely know which is the correct decision, even after the result is known.. All we can hope for is that after the result is announced, we show how "Great" we are as a nation by all pulling together to make the future better.... Unfortunately, as we all know, what will actually happen is that Politicians on both sides of the argument will attempt to gain power by saying/doing whatever they feel is necessary to undermine the other side..

Sadly, whichever way we vote, we'll be sabotaged from within by those who put their own advancement ahead of the welfare of the nation...

 

[Hacker Khan]

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/...ys-in-so-they-can-keep-whining-20160219106386