EU Referendum

[Ethan]

A Guardian review of how the sides interpret the data for and against.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/ng-interactive/2016/jun/03/brexit-how-can-the-same-statistics-be-read-so-differently?CMP=fb_gu

 

[Khamelion]

‘Won’t you join our Common Market?’ said the spider to the fly,
‘It really is a winner and the cost is not too high’
‘I know De Gaulle said ’’ Non’’, but he hadn’t got a clue,
‘We want you in, my friends and I, for we have plans for you.
‘You’ll have to pay a little more than we do, just for now,
‘As Herr Kohl said, and I agree, we need a new milch cow,
‘It’s just a continental term, believe me , mon ami,
‘Like ‘’Vive la France’’ or ‘’Mad Anglais’’ or even ‘’E.E.C.’’.
‘As to the rules, don’t worry friend, there’s really but a few
‘You’ll find that we ignore them - but they all apply to you.
‘Give and share between us, that’s what it’s all about,
‘You do all the giving, and we all share it out.
‘It’s very British, is it not, to help a friend in need?
‘You’ve done it twice in two World Wars, a fact we must concede,
‘So climb aboard the Market Train, don’t sit there on the side,
‘Your continental cousins want to take you for a ride’

 

[delc]

We are being subjected far too much unsubstantiated bull from both sides. Will we gain or lose jobs if we leave. Will it stop the flow of migrants from the Middle-East? Will house prices go up or down? Who knows? My gut feeling is that we will be better off staying in, which is how I will vote. Just hope that the Daily Mail/ Express/Sun reading Little Englanders lose the argument. :mmm:

 

[Old Skier]

Just hope that the Daily Mail/ Express/Sun reading Little Englanders lose the argument. :mmm:

So is not only down to academic qualifications, we need to take into account what papers you read. :blah:

 

[delc]

So is not only down to academic qualifications, we need to take into account what papers you read. :blah:

The Daily Mail, Daily Express and the Sun have been coming out with anti-EU rhetoric for years, and especially in the last few months. It makes you wonder what their owners' vested interest is! Maybe they don't like their employees having any employment rights?

 

[Hobbit]

Whether you are a Remainer or a Brexiter could you please explain to me why the top four contributors to the EU budget pay what they do.

Germany; GDP is almost 50% higher than ours yet after their rebate they pay pretty much what we pay.

France; GDP not far short of ours yet after their rebate they're net contribution is way less - about half of ours.

Italy; GDP not hugely below ours yet the net contribution is miles away.

And then there's us...

Our benefits, support for the disabled, lack of social housing, increasing class sizes, our NHS and increasing retirement ages are all falling away... seriously, I just don't get why with their GDP's they get away with paying what they do.

Paying more proportionally, based on GDP as its supposed to be, fine I can accept that no problem. If we're staying in, at least get the payments sorted fairly.

We are mugs, absolute mugs to pay the disproportionate levels we do. And that doesn't even take into account the stupid fines we've paid.

And then there's the retirements ages... they will end up relatively close, eventually, but there's basket case EU countries out there with better retirement ages than the UK.

 

[ColchesterFC]

The Daily Mail, Daily Express and the Sun have been coming out with anti-EU rhetoric for years, and especially in the last few months. It makes you wonder what their owners' vested interest is! Maybe they don't like their employees having any employment rights?

Interesting that when a large number of companies came out in favour of staying in it was trumpeted by the Remain campaign but when some companies have opposing views they must have "vested interests". Even as a supporter of staying in that smacks of double standards to me.

 

[Hobbit]

Interesting that when a large number of companies came out in favour of staying in it was trumpeted by the Remain campaign but when some companies have opposing views they must have "vested interests". Even as a supporter of staying in that smacks of double standards to me.

"Large number of companies."

Only 17% of the companies approached responded to the question about Remain. But with the fantastic spin put on it you'd think everyone and their dog had said stay.

The more I look behind the hype put out by both sides, the more I think we're being led up the garden path by both sides.

 

[Old Skier]

Interesting that when a large number of companies came out in favour of staying in it was trumpeted by the Remain campaign but when some companies have opposing views they must have "vested interests". Even as a supporter of staying in that smacks of double standards to me.

Youve got to take into account who the poster is.

 

[SocketRocket]

We are being subjected far too much unsubstantiated bull from both sides. Will we gain or lose jobs if we leave. Will it stop the flow of migrants from the Middle-East? Will house prices go up or down? Who knows? My gut feeling is that we will be better off staying in, which is how I will vote. Just hope that the Daily Mail/ Express/Sun reading Little Englanders lose the argument. :mmm:

You may be surprised that the Referendum is not for 'Englanders' but the whole of the UK. Likewise I hope the 'Little EUr's' lose the argument. It's a Big Big world out there and I am looking forward to us playing an active growing role in it. We are a great nation and can be a great World Class leader if unchained.

 

[SocketRocket]

A Guardian review of how the sides interpret the data for and against.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/ng-interactive/2016/jun/03/brexit-how-can-the-same-statistics-be-read-so-differently?CMP=fb_gu

Typical lefty claptrap. These arguments work on the basis we will not trade anything to the EU if we leave. Anyone with more than two brain cells knows that wont happen.

 

[FairwayDodger]

You may be surprised that the Referendum is not for 'Englanders' but the whole of the UK. Likewise I hope the 'Little EUr's' lose the argument. It's a Big Big world out there and I am looking forward to us playing an active growing role in it. We are a great nation and can be a great World Class leader if unchained.

Yet your strategy for playing a big part in the world is to pull out of the biggest international cooperation organisation to which we belong. I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

 

[Hobbit]

Yet your strategy for playing a big part in the world is to pull out of the biggest international cooperation organisation to which we belong. I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

But you don't have to be in it to trade with it.

 

[SocketRocket]

Yet your strategy for playing a big part in the world is to pull out of the biggest international cooperation organisation to which we belong. I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

One where we have no power of direction as it's undemocratically directed and is incapable of dealing with any kind of international issues. Just look to the debacle that is taking place in the Mediterranean right now to see how ineffective the EU sloth is. Regarding your dilemma I suggest you wait a little longer as if we Stay you will end up crying over 'spilt milk' if our opportunities to do something really great are lost.

 

[SocketRocket]

View attachment 19687

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Four out of the last six posts from SR.............The Messiah, trying to hard or desperate?

 

[Hobbit]

Four out of the last six posts from SR.............The Messiah, trying to hard or desperate?

Now you know what we had to put up with two years ago with the Scottish referendum...

 

[FairwayDodger]

One where we have no power of direction as it's undemocratically directed and is incapable of dealing with any kind of international issues. Just look to the debacle that is taking place in the Mediterranean right now to see how ineffective the EU sloth is. Regarding your dilemma I suggest you wait a little longer as if we Stay you will end up crying over 'spilt milk' if our opportunities to do something really great are lost.

Really struggling to follow your logic. If the ROTW are mean to us like the EU have supposedly been will we run away again?

You must admit the inherent contradiction in your posts?

 

[SocketRocket]

Really struggling to follow your logic. If the ROTW are mean to us like the EU have supposedly been will we run away again?

You must admit the inherent contradiction in your posts?

You are moving from sensible debate to one of insults. If thats the way you feel you can score points then it's a bit of a disappointment but one we have become accustomed to with the Stay campaign. I will try not to attack your integrity just because you hold a different opinion though.

Who said anything about the EU or the ROTW being mean to us? The EU is just acting in their normal undemocratic manner due to them being on a one way track to a superstate that is run by Big Brother. I dont see that as being mean to us I just see it as the way it is. The ROTW have no such ambitions.

 

[SocketRocket]

Four out of the last six posts from SR.............The Messiah, trying to hard or desperate?

Heres another just for you. If thats the best you can add to the debate then it's not worth a reasoned reply