DQ'd from Competition under rule 3.3b

[Deleted member 15344]

Missing the point as people usually do in here. It may well be a rule of golf, I'm just saying it's a redundant and obsolete rule now. Why make people write in pencil what a computer already knows and works out absolutely? It doesn't make sense. I don't know why he told us we didn't need to write them if that wasn't the case, but I can only imagine he felt the same as me - it's redundant info and not something they need to check anyway. Perhaps some clubs are being more lenient on pernickety details like that since we've just come through a pandemic where nobody was handing in cards anyway. Surely only a matter of time until the need to write your handicap(s) on the card is dropped.

when was that announced ?

Can you confirm when the governing bodies have decided it’s now redundant and obsolete

 

[Swango1980]

Give it a rest. It obviously matters more if your club doesn't have the computer tech. It doesn't matter that much at my club where we do have it.

What I said was there was a good chance I wouldn't have considered the possibility of it being out of bounds, i.e. I'd have potentially got it wrong and not even known I'd got it wrong and proceeded unawares. If you think that's the same as wilfully and knowingly disobeying rules then there's something wrong with you. But let's not dredge up old ground and do all that discussion again as well. Even if dragging up old arguments to repeat ad infinitum does seem to be a speciality of yours.

And this isn't about signing the card. It's about writing your handicap on the card. Not the same thing.

No, it is not the same thing. Clearly. However, when that discussion on out of bounds took place and people demonstrating how one should define the rules, they could easily have used handicap being on the card as an example in which one might like to use their own interpretation, but there is no place for interpretation under the Rules. You, of course, would say out of bounds and putting a handicap on a card are not the same thing. Yet, a few weeks later you then go on to tell people that it really shouldn't matter about having a handicap on a card. And, in a few weeks time, I wouldn't be surprised if you said it really doesn't matter if someone forgets to sign a card, or it really doesn't matter what rule you choose not to apply. In that sense, it really is the same thing, as we are talking generally about the application of the Rules of Golf. That is all.

Ultimately, not putting your handicap in a card is incorrect under the Rules, and your Club are wrong in ignoring this. Whatever, if the Club and all members are happy with this, including risking getting DQed elsewhere by not realising the actual rule and applying it, then I guess that is OK with me. Doesn't impact me. Probably not OK with the Union, but unlikely to be an issue unless someone complains. However, what your club does is not helpful to a general forum where posters are members of clubs that actually apply the rules, and they could easily get the wrong impression if they took your answers as a well informed statement.

Perhaps there should be a separate thread entitled "Rules which you think are stupid or happy to ignore", at which point you'd have a completely reasonable platform to at least debate your arguments .

 

[doublebogey7]

when was that announced ?

Can you confirm when the governing bodies have decided it’s now redundant and obsolete

You've missed the point Phil, it is clearly the rules of common sense that have changed and they are the preserve of the poster ??.

 

[Orikoru]

when was that announced ?

Can you confirm when the governing bodies have decided it’s now redundant and obsolete

Did you not know that as human beings we are actually allowed freedom of thought and expression without it being mandated to us by a governing body?? Yes that's right, you are allowed to think for yourself. Shocking isn't it?

 

[Orikoru]

No, it is not the same thing. Clearly. However, when that discussion on out of bounds took place and people demonstrating how one should define the rules, they could easily have used handicap being on the card as an example in which one might like to use their own interpretation, but there is no place for interpretation under the Rules. You, of course, would say out of bounds and putting a handicap on a card are not the same thing. Yet, a few weeks later you then go on to tell people that it really shouldn't matter about having a handicap on a card. And, in a few weeks time, I wouldn't be surprised if you said it really doesn't matter if someone forgets to sign a card, or it really doesn't matter what rule you choose not to apply. In that sense, it really is the same thing, as we are talking generally about the application of the Rules of Golf. That is all.

Ultimately, not putting your handicap in a card is incorrect under the Rules, and your Club are wrong in ignoring this. Whatever, if the Club and all members are happy with this, including risking getting DQed elsewhere by not realising the actual rule and applying it, then I guess that is OK with me. Doesn't impact me. Probably not OK with the Union, but unlikely to be an issue unless someone complains. However, what your club does is not helpful to a general forum where posters are members of clubs that actually apply the rules, and they could easily get the wrong impression if they took your answers as a well informed statement.

Perhaps there should be a separate thread entitled "Rules which you think are stupid or happy to ignore", at which point you'd have a completely reasonable platform to at least debate your arguments .

I would LOVE that! I would start one but I can never think of them off the top of my head, it's only when I see one being discussed.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Did you not know that as human beings we are actually allowed freedom of thought and expression without it being mandated to us by a governing body?? Yes that's right, you are allowed to think for yourself. Shocking isn't it?

But you are “stating” that the rule is obsolete - so when was that decided ?

And sorry you are playing a sport that is mandated by a governing body and when you play in any handicap qualifying round you are required by the rules to follow them - there is no leeway for “common sense” to ignore the rules

It’s a mandated rule so it must be followed and any golfer not following the rule is penalised as per the rule book

Any rules you want to ignore ?

 

[Orikoru]

But you are “stating” that the rule is obsolete - so when was that decided ?

And sorry you are playing a sport that is mandated by a governing body and when you play in any handicap qualifying round you are required by the rules to follow them - there is no leeway for “common sense” to ignore the rules

It’s a mandated rule so it must be followed and any golfer not following the rule is penalised as per the rule book

Any rules you want to ignore ?

Do I need to write a disclaimer that all views contained with my posts are my own opinion unless otherwise stated? Or shouldn't that be obvious? Dear me.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Do I need to write a disclaimer that all views contained with my posts are my own opinion unless otherwise stated? Or shouldn't that be obvious? Dear me.

Well at least know you should be quite clear how you must proceed when filling out your scorecard - hopefully soon you will realise that common sense isn’t in the rule book

 

[Blue in Munich]

Did you not know that as human beings we are actually allowed freedom of thought and expression without it being mandated to us by a governing body?? Yes that's right, you are allowed to think for yourself. Shocking isn't it?

And you can exercise that freedom of thought and expression by just playing with your mates and not entering the competitions, plenty do at mine. Or you can exercise your freedom of choice to enter the competition & abide by the rules of that competition, which are in place to try and ensure a level playing field for all involved. Or you could exercise your freedom of thought & expression to engage with the governing bodies of the game and petition them to change the glaring deficiencies that you've found with they system?

 

[Orikoru]

And you can exercise that freedom of thought and expression by just playing with your mates and not entering the competitions, plenty do at mine. Or you can exercise your freedom of choice to enter the competition & abide by the rules of that competition, which are in place to try and ensure a level playing field for all involved. Or you could exercise your freedom of thought & expression to engage with the governing bodies of the game and petition them to change the glaring deficiencies that you've found with they system?

I do both, and then I come on here and talk about it.
(Wouldn't know where to begin with the third one.)

 

[chrisd]

I do both, and then I come on here and talk about it.
(Wouldn't know where to begin with the third one.)

Funny that , with the 3rd one is pretty easy, you just write, or email, the R&A rules section and tell them that most of their rules are bollocks, outdated, ridiculous, and, not formed of common sense and ask them to consider scrubbing them. It would pay to list the rules you think fall into that list of categories and then eventually we all won't have to worry about breaking rules that someone pretty new to the game has decided are too old fashioned, nonsensical and unnecessary.

 

[Orikoru]

Funny that , with the 3rd one is pretty easy, you just write, or email, the R&A rules section and tell them that most of their rules are bollocks, outdated, ridiculous, and, not formed of common sense and ask them to consider scrubbing them. It would pay to list the rules you think fall into that list of categories and then eventually we all won't have to worry about breaking rules that someone pretty new to the game has decided are too old fashioned, nonsensical and unnecessary.

And I'm sure that'll get me really far.

 

[chrisd]

And I'm sure that'll get me really far.

If you are talking common sense why you do you not believe that they wouldn't act on your advice?

 

[Orikoru]

If you are talking common sense why you do you not believe that they wouldn't act on your advice?

Because this is golf we're talking about.

 

[Foxholer]

Did you not know that as human beings we are actually allowed freedom of thought and expression without it being mandated to us by a governing body?? Yes that's right, you are allowed to think for yourself. Shocking isn't it?

I suggest you don't apply that same attitude when you drive (a vehicle).

 

[chrisd]

Because this is golf we're talking about.

The R & A will always accept suggestions from golfers. They changed a fair few rules at the end of 2019 and , if I remember correctly, they took quite a lot of opinion from clubs and individuals on their rule changes and, also the way the rule book was written in order to make it simpler to understand.

I just wonder whether you've written to the FA to tell them that the offside rule is nonsense, as that rule is far more stupid than any golf rule !

 

[Swango1980]

And I'm sure that'll get me really far.

Of course it won't get you very far. Because, what you'll find is that all the rules are there for a reason. The case for the rule may have been stronger at some point in history, but will still apply to this day in cases. And, to ensure that the rules are completely fair to all involved in the game, the rules remain in place. This remains fair, until individuals or Committees decide to use "common sense" to do something that opposes the Rule related to their action. I can guarantee those involved in the Rules of Golf are far more qualified in determining the suitability of each rule in comparison to one's common sense. No doubt they look at all implications of the rule, and ultimately decide exactly why it is still required, no longer required, or needs tweaking.

Once a rule truly becomes obsolete, I'm sure the Rules of Golf would be updated accordingly.

You're post #134 confuses me, stating "because this is golf we are talking about". I'm not sure what you may be implying with such a statement.

But, as has been suggested, you should write a list of rules you think are obsolete. You could go directly to the R&A, or post it on a thread on Golf Monthly to help you refine the list, before going to the R&A. I suspect your first 2 entries would be:

• no longer a requirement to include handicaps on a scorecard, or for it to become an option for it to be a condition of competition, so Committees can ignore it if they wish.
• if out of bounds is marked only by white stakes, a player can define the boundary line based on where they feel it should be (common sense), and no requirement to use a straight line between the stakes

 

[Colin L]

I don't know or care really. All I know is I wasn't told to write the handicap, ...........

Perhaps this illustrates exactly what Swango is getting at. You are told to record your handicap: Rule 3.3b(4) tells you to.
And you should have been disqualified if you didn't. Rule 3.3b(3) tells the Committee that.

 

[Orikoru]

Perhaps this illustrates exactly what Swango is getting at. You were told to record your handicap: Rule 3.3b(4) tells you to.

Why would I doubt the word of the pro/general manager by then researching the rule I've just asked him? Seems rude.

 

[chrisd]

Why would I doubt the word of the pro/general manager by then researching the rule I've just asked him? Seems rude.

You dont seem to mind doubting the word of a fair few people on this forum !