Disqualification..Wrong Net Score???

[sJoe]

HI

My partner and I recently played in a 4BBB Stableford Comp. with an allowance of 3/4 handicaps. We were disqualified for signing for the wrong net score..
My partners handicap is 18.5, playing handicap 19 stroke allowance therefore 14.25 (14) he mistakenly entered 15. I didn't pick up on this and the round was played using 15 as his allowance..However his handicap on the card stated 19.. all Gross scores on the 18 holes played were entered correctly..My question is this, under the rules of golf. Rule 32 b a competitor/marker is responsible for the Gross score, and making sure his playing handicap is correctly entered, both of which were done..The net score and adjustment of handicap allowance to achieve the net score is the responsibility of the committee. Rule 33.5
I feel we should not have been disqualified, the adjustment to our score should have been made by the committee and our amended score used. It would have made a difference of 1 point over the whole round by the way..
Am I correct or is the committee correct in disqualifying us.

Many thanks

 

[rosecott]

You are 100% correct that you cannot be disqualified for an incorrect nett score if the correct gross scores were recorded and signed for by both marker and player. How were you notified of the disqualification? As far as I am aware, handicapping software would not allow such a disqualification in the procesing of scorecards.

 

[chrisd]

So, as I read things, he calculated his playing handicap as 15 instead of 14 and played on the day off a higher handicap than he should. I think that DQ is the only possibility


Chris

 

[sJoe]

Hi Chirs
my point is that the allowance of 15 is NOT the handicap it is a net allowance, from which the net score is calculated..His handicap was correct 19 the gross scores correct.. I must admit I agree with rosecott, see above, but then I would.. Im going to take it up with the committee, will let you know how it turns out

 

[sJoe]

Thanks rosecott..great minds etc LOL

 

[Ethan]

So long as he has recorded his accurate handicap (i.e. not higher than actually the case) and an accurate score for each hole, the rest is down to the committee, including applying the 3/4, adding up each 9 and the 18, and subtracting the handicap allowance from the gross.

That is explicit in the Rules and any Comp Sec that doesn't know it should be fired.

There is also a decision 6-2b/0.5 which confirms that, in this case, recording the handicap of 19 is sufficient. Tell your mate to challenge the DQ and appeal to the R&A if the DQ is not reversed.

Q: It is the condition of a stroke-play competition (e.g. four-ball) that players will not receive their full handicap allowances. Under Rule 6-2b, what is the player responsible for recording on his score card?

A: He must record his full handicap. It is the Committee's responsibility to apply the condition of competition to adjust his handicap.

 

[chrisd]

Hi Chirs
my point is that the allowance of 15 is NOT the handicap it is a net allowance, from which the net score is calculated..His handicap was correct 19 the gross scores correct.. I must admit I agree with rosecott, see above, but then I would.. Im going to take it up with the committee, will let you know how it turns out

I would like to be wrong and likely am. Normally I would do a check before posting but I'm laid up and took the lazy way out


Chris

 

[Ethan]

I would like to be wrong and likely am. Normally I would do a check before posting but I'm laid up and took the lazy way out


Chris

The Rules make it explicit that it is the gross handicap, not the reduced allowance, which must be recorded by the player. The Committee then applies the Competition Rules.

 

[sJoe]

Thanks Ethan I'd looked up the relevant rules and thought I was right..On Monday I;ll be at the club and ask to have the disqualification reversed..fingers crossed..

 

[mc73]

I have been dq'd before for a similar issue where playing partner incorrectly totalled my points score but had the gross score correct, I checked out and complained and was subsequently reinstated as the comp winner.

It's the committees responsibility to point the cards correctly, the players responsibility is to have and sign for a correct gross score.

 

[Phil2511]

Things like that occur regularly at our club. Many people do not seem to understand how exactly allowances work but as long as the correct gross scores are entered correctly the competition convenor has always made allowance for any nett discrepancies.
And has been said as long as those gross scores are correct and visibly checked and are entered into the computer the nett score will be displayed by the computer.
To disqualify for an incorrect nett score seems to be very harsh.

Even now in winter league as we play over the front 9 only with half handicap those with an odd handicap get an extra shot on a hole that if on full course would not and often a score for a 1 or 2 becomes a 2 or 3 when entered into the computer.

 

[CMAC]

It's the committees responsibility to point the cards correctly, the players responsibility is to have and sign for a correct gross score.

Interesting and well worth knowing, thanks.

As an aside I also believe if you add up and sign for a wrong gross score you are not DQ if the recorded score is higher than the actual score, is that correct?

 

[chrisd]

Interesting and well worth knowing, thanks.

As an aside I also believe if you add up and sign for a wrong gross score you are not DQ if the recorded score is higher than the actual score, is that correct?

No, you are not responsible for the adding up whether it is higher or lower, that is down to the competition organiser

Chris

 

[Steve In Spain]

As Chris said above, it's the committee's responsibility. YOURS is to record the correct score per hole.

 

[Imurg]

It's the committees responsibility to point the cards correctly, the players responsibility is to have and sign for a correct gross score.

Had a real embarrassing occasion at my last club - thankfully 1 month after my time on the Committee had finished.
Captains Day and all the cards are in. One real, genuine 28+ handicapper was saying he'd come in with 44 points which was at least 4 more than anyone else was admitting to.
Anyway, presentation time for the Trophy and it's duly handed over..

About an hour later, one of the Committee was checking through for something else on a card - whether someone birdied a particular hole - and saw the "winner's" card.
It had 8's and 9's on it - plenty of them. No way he could have scored 44 points with those numbers, even off 28.
A quick check through the card revealed that whoever marked the card took this guys word for the number of points. No cheating at all, amazingly he just had no clue how to score.
His real total was 21. Whoever checked the card - if it was done at all - made a right Pig's Ear of it.

The real winner had long since gone and there was much wailing and knashing of teeth to get him back to claim his prize.

Oh Boy the Committee looked sheepish after that one......

 

[MadAdey]

I would say you are definitely not disqualified. This rule says it all to me really.

33-5 Scorecard

In stroke play, the Committee must provide each competitor with a score card containing the date and the competitor’s name or, in foursome or four-ball stroke play, the competitors’ names.
In stroke play, the Committee is responsible for the addition of scores and application of the handicap recorded on the score card.
In four-ball stroke play, the Committee is responsible for recording the better-ball score for each hole and in the process applying the handicaps recorded on the score card, and adding the better-ball scores.
In bogey, par and Stableford competitions, the Committee is responsible for applying the handicap recorded on the score card and determining the result of each hole and the overall result or points total.
Note: The Committee may request that each competitor records the date and his name on his score card.

 

[CMAC]

so to clarify, even if you record and sign for a gross total score less than you actually scored you cannot get DQ as long as the individual holes are recorded accurately?

 

[Ethan]

so to clarify, even if you record and sign for a gross total score less than you actually scored you cannot get DQ as long as the individual holes are recorded accurately?

Correct.

You must fill in the correct gross handicap - the Committee makes the 3/4 (or whatever) adjustment

You fill in scores on 18 holes - the Committee is responsible for the totals for each 9 and the 18, as well as the net score or points.

 

[SGC001]

A problem that sometimes occurs in betterballs is markers putting a players score in their partners box, this can lead to problems if the players don't check their card fully before signing.

 

[CallawayKid]

Did they reverse it Joe?
I must admit we haven't disqualified anyone for a while as we choose to educate rather than penalise. First screw up is free, after that then we have a little chat...

CK