difference in handicaps off diff tee's and courses

[patricks148]

chatting in the clubhouse yesterday after our game the subject was on what your handicap will be off the different tee's at our course and other courses we play reg.
off the blacks i would be off 9, but the greens 1... my index is 4.2 and was 5 in old money, one of the guys whos been off 6 the 10 years ive known him would be off 10 at his other course and 3 at the parkland course he's also a member.

going to make for some interesting Match play games

 

[Fish]

chatting in the clubhouse yesterday after our game the subject was on what your handicap will be off the different tee's at our course and other courses we play reg.
off the blacks i would be off 9, but the greens 1... my index is 4.2 and was 5 in old money, one of the guys whos been off 6 the 10 years ive known him would be off 10 at his other course and 3 at the parkland course he's also a member.

going to make for some interesting Match play games

It should only be a short term advantage though, as soon as some qualifying Comp scores get recorded off their changed handicaps their indexes will change quite quickly I’d think ?

 

[rulefan]

Odd. What are the slopes on those courses?

 

[fenwayrich]

Surely, if your index is 4.2, the maximum course handicap at any course in the world is 6?

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Have a feeling that it’s using the Course rating as well ? Don’t some countries use that to add on shots ?

If not then looking at the calculations using the slope it’s widely wrong

Looking at Nairn a 4.2 will give a course Hc of 5 on the blacks and 4 on the greens

 

[doublebogey7]

It should only be a short term advantage though, as soon as some qualifying Comp scores get recorded off their changed handicaps their indexes will change quite quickly I’d think ?

Why would that be?? Your current handicap index has been assessed under exactly the same criteria as any future changes. So unless a player hits a period of good/bad form we should not expect the HI to change significantly over time.

 

[Foxholer]

chatting in the clubhouse yesterday after our game the subject was on what your handicap will be off the different tee's at our course and other courses we play reg.
off the blacks i would be off 9, but the greens 1... my index is 4.2 and was 5 in old money, one of the guys whos been off 6 the 10 years ive known him would be off 10 at his other course and 3 at the parkland course he's also a member.

going to make for some interesting Match play games

You seem to be using 'Course Rating minus Par' in your calculation. While that applies to the multitude of Yanks that play your course, it doesn't apply in UK.
Effectively that (US/EGA style) PH would apply if you were expecting to play to Par; the UK style implementation (and what Pope of Slope - Dean Knuth recommends) should be used if playing to Course Rating (SSS in 'old money'!).
FWIW, unless playing in a 'mixed' group (where PH is calculated differently for different participants), it makes no difference in Matchplay (100% CH). It's simply that PH is against Par for one group and CR for the other. Equivalent to being against Par of SSS in 'old money'. It might make a difference (though not for you) in strokeplay (where PH = CH*95%)

 

[jim8flog]

chatting in the clubhouse yesterday after our game the subject was on what your handicap will be off the different tee's at our course and other courses we play reg.
off the blacks i would be off 9, but the greens 1... my index is 4.2 and was 5 in old money, one of the guys whos been off 6 the 10 years ive known him would be off 10 at his other course and 3 at the parkland course he's also a member.

going to make for some interesting Match play games

Either the charts at you place are wrong or you have got the maths wrong
You are 5 off either tee
Blacks 4.2x138/113= 5.129
95% = 5 (rounded)

 

[Foxholer]

Either the charts at you place are wrong or you have got the maths wrong
You are 5 off either tee
Blacks 4.2x138/113= 5.129
95% = 5 (rounded)

See my post above - re including 'CR minus Par' in the calc.

 

[Ethan]

chatting in the clubhouse yesterday after our game the subject was on what your handicap will be off the different tee's at our course and other courses we play reg.
off the blacks i would be off 9, but the greens 1... my index is 4.2 and was 5 in old money, one of the guys whos been off 6 the 10 years ive known him would be off 10 at his other course and 3 at the parkland course he's also a member.

going to make for some interesting Match play games

That is highly improbable, the two slopes needed to allow one handicap index to span 3 and 10 would be the minimum and maximum possible, respectively. I doubt someone is a member of a 155 slope course and a 55 slope course.

 

[Foxholer]

That is highly improbable, the two slopes needed to allow one handicap index to span 3 and 10 would be the minimum and maximum possible, respectively. I doubt someone is a member of a 155 slope course and a 55 slope course.

I believe Post 7 explains the reason!
Shows why Par is (or at least should be) irrelevant to handicap!

 

[williamalex1]

This is the charts for our tees

 

[IanM]

You seem to be using 'Course Rating minus Par' in your calculation. While that applies to the multitude of Yanks that play your course, it doesn't apply in UK.
Effectively that (US/EGA style) PH would apply if you were expecting to play to Par; the UK style implementation (and what Pope of Slope - Dean Knuth recommends) should be used if playing to Course Rating (SSS in 'old money'!).
FWIW, unless playing in a 'mixed' group (where PH is calculated differently for different participants), it makes no difference in Matchplay (100% CH). It's simply that PH is against Par for one group and CR for the other. Equivalent to being against Par of SSS in 'old money'. It might make a difference (though not for you) in strokeplay (where PH = CH*95%)

What calculation? You just read it off the chart..?.. (if you see what I mean)

 

[Foxholer]

What calculation? You just read it off the chart..?.. (if you see what I mean)

But it's a different 'chart' for UK players (where the CR minus Par calculation isn't included) to US/EGA players (where it is!).
If you use the R&A facility (https://www.randa.org/WorldHandicapSystem), there's a choice whether calculation is 'with (or without) Course Rating minus Par.

 

[patricks148]

That is highly improbable, the two slopes needed to allow one handicap index to span 3 and 10 would be the minimum and maximum possible, respectively. I doubt someone is a member of a 155 slope course and a 55 slope course.

these were calc by the R&A App where you put in the details of index, slope and CR and it gave these calculations, i've no idea what the other course details were but the ones i gave for mine where what he got out of the App. Inc we looked on the sheet today on the starters hut, and all of us have the same handicap for Black, white, Blue, green and even the silver. and between the Black and the silver theres a 6 shot diff according to SG... which is Ob wrong for a start

 

[patricks148]

What calculation? You just read it off the chart..?.. (if you see what I mean)

it was the R&A app

 

[Deleted member 15344]

these were calc by the R&A App where you put in the details of index, slope and CR and it gave these calculations, i've no idea what the other course details were but the ones i gave for mine where what he got out of the App. Inc we looked on the sheet today on the starters hut, and all of us have the same handicap for Black, white, Blue, green and even the silver. and between the Black and the silver theres a 6 shot diff according to SG... which is Ob wrong for a start

The R&A is not for UK golfers playing on UK course - all you need to use is the board on the first tee and work out your course handicap from that and then playing handicap

 

[jim8flog]

it was the R&A app

I do not know who your ISV is but we use IG

When I go to my account/my rounds I can see the information I need on there
If you have a different ISV I expect they do something similar

 

[Foxholer]

these were calc by the R&A App where you put in the details of index, slope and CR and it gave these calculations, i've no idea what the other course details were but the ones i gave for mine where what he got out of the App. Inc we looked on the sheet today on the starters hut, and all of us have the same handicap for Black, white, Blue, green and even the silver. and between the Black and the silver theres a 6 shot diff according to SG... which is Ob wrong for a start

Probably nothing wrong with the calculation of your index.
It's how you apply it - incorrectly using CR minus Par - that's the problem!

 

[Foxholer]

The R&A is not for UK golfers playing on UK course - all you need to use is the board on the first tee and work out your course handicap from that and then playing handicap

What App is that?
I seriously doubt it's N/A for UK golfers on UK courses. There's almost ceretainly a parameter to indicate that (where CR minus Par) doesn't apply. It is certainly an option on their website one!