Carry only

[sweaty sock]

Another thread from 2017....

A golfer with a trolley does 1200% more damage than one carrying. But Liverpoolphil is probably right in that courses will recover anyway.

 

[Swango1980]

It does and it’s why we did it before when we wanted to protect work being done etc hence why I’m not sure why someone could post it’s not something we could do.

In fairness most greenkeepers only really close courses to trolleys and buggies for Health and Safety reasons - most are confident in their believe that they can recover the course by the time playing season arrives

If you refer to me here, you'll notice my post you replied to had several questions, and I said I am not sure it was something that could be done. So, I was not flat out saying it was impossible to do, I just felt it would be very difficult to achieve.

Fair enough, you have provided answers as to how it was achieved at your place. However, it still seems a flaff. Many golfers have trolley bags. If they then need to swap to carry bags, many may well just decide to carry anyway. If not, because they struggle to carry, then they may also deem it a struggle to carry on the holes that have the trolley ban. Maybe it works at yours, and it could be worth consideration if the trolley allowed holes were hilly, and the trolley banned holes were relatively flat (coupled with the fact the start and end of the trolley banned holed need to be where a player can leave, and then pick up their trolley). However, I suspect most clubs would find it extremely impractical

 

[Golfnut1957]

Although the club do not have a policy on the matter I decided to carry two months ago. The winter course being shorter is one consideration, but the main one is cleaning the trolley after a round. We have compressors, but it's still a fart on, and I need it clean as everything lives in my locker which I access via the clubhouse. Wouldn't want to be dragging half the course in there with me.

Plus, the exercise is good for me, I'm told.

 

[Yorkshire Hacker]

At present we are being advised to carry and not use trolleys. I believe buggies are banned throughout winter. If it is frosty, then it is carry only, trolleys are banned Not everyone is happy with this, but I agree with the policy wholeheartedly.

 

[hovis]

Next time its frosty at home go out with a pair of shears and cut a 1 foot square. Frozen grass stalks snapped by trolley wheels allows the frost to get inside the grass stalks, splitting the fibres and killing the grass.

But rather than have a "yes it will, no it won't" debate by all the different experts on here, go out and do the grass cut. You will end up with an ugly brown square that will last well into the spring before it is replaced by new grasses. I, like many, was sceptical till I saw the evidence with my own eyes.

When the ground is really wet and soft, spinning wheels will actually pull grass out, including the roots. Hence hedgehog wheels - less spinning.

I can't agree mate. The belfry allows golfers to use buggies all year and play on frozen greens. I've never seen this damage you speak of. Come spring the greens and fairways where spot on.

 

[Golfnut1957]

I can't agree mate. The belfry allows golfers to use buggies all year and play on frozen greens. I've never seen this damage you speak of. Come spring the greens and fairways where spot on.

We have had a policy of playing on frozen greens and course for approx 10 years now, it has had no detrimental effect on the course condition come summer at all. It all starts to grow back come the spring and is pristine come the summer.

The club do allow trolleys all winter but are selective when it comes to buggies, banning them when it is frozen (H&S?) or if it is particularly wet.

 

[nickjdavis]

Our old greenkeeper subscribed to the view that, when the greens were frosty/frozen, any thawing of the top surface could potentially lead to roots being snapped (when the thawing surface was walked upon) due to movement relative to the unthawed ground below. Hence we always played on temporary greens when it was frosty.

We got a new greenkeeper about 3 years ago, who allows play on frosty/frozen greens. I have not seen any evidence of deterioration of the condition of our greens as a result.

Now...it seems to be that there are many greenkeepers who fall into Camp A and many that fall into Camp B. There are many courses in both camps who have excellent greens....I'm guessing that there is far more going on that dictates the quality of a green than whether some roots get broken in frosty conditions. Familiarity with your "grass" and understanding how it reacts to certain "pressures" and how you can best help it recover can alleviate many of the ails that might occur due to frost.

By the way I'm not critical of proponents of either viewpoint....they have their reasons and I'm not one to argue with them....you only need to see that state of my own lawn to realise that my agronomy skills are perhaps lacking!!!

 

[LincolnShep]

Now...it seems to be that there are many greenkeepers who fall into Camp A and many that fall into Camp B. There are many courses in both camps who have excellent greens....I'm guessing that there is far more going on that dictates the quality of a green than whether some roots get broken in frosty conditions. Familiarity with your "grass" and understanding how it reacts to certain "pressures" and how you can best help it recover can alleviate many of the ails that might occur due to frost.

By the way I'm not critical of proponents of either viewpoint....they have their reasons and I'm not one to argue with them....you only need to see that state of my own lawn to realise that my agronomy skills are perhaps lacking!!!

Stop trying to be reasonable, there is no place for it on this forum! Everybody knows the issue is black and white with absolutely no amount of nuance.

 

[jim8flog]

Surely no club would allow buggies out in the wettest of wet conditions. That would be crazy behaviour.

We used to have no restrictions but we now have a dedicated buggy route but still have buggy bans when the course is extremely wet.

At one time we used to ban trolleys but now we restrict the access close to greens and tees (although a lot of idiots still ignore that).

 

[Foxholer]

No idea whether any research has been published. I haven't gone looking as I'm happy to accept that the greenkeepers know more about it than I do.

When I joined my current club, the idea of occasionally carrying my bag filled me with horror but it's been no problem at all.

It's also a simple Rule of Thumb that even the keenest of golfers can recognise. Frost on the ground is, or should be, pretty simple to notice. So if that's the case, carry only. It doesn't matter if that's slightly wrong - as long as it's 'the right side of wrong'.

 

[Backache]

I can't agree mate. The belfry allows golfers to use buggies all year and play on frozen greens. I've never seen this damage you speak of. Come spring the greens and fairways where spot on.

We have started to allow play on frozen greens, I don't know what the effects will be.
I suspect the Belfry employ a lot more staff to keep the course in condition than many members courses and there ability to maintain conditions may not transfer.

 

[Shooter McPowick]

Here’s the way I see it…. It’s the course managers / head greenkeepers job, they know more than me and are qualified. If they deem a trolley / buggy ban necessary then so be it. I carry all year anyway so it doesn’t bother me but I’m all for the course being absolutely mint in the summer. It also helps prevent unnecessary repair bills and or GUR areas.
The only buggies allowed at ours are for the course Marshall and a very small number of “unable” members.

 

[Shooter McPowick]

Surely the Greenkeeper is the one with the qualifications to do the job. He/She should know what is best for the grass having had to study it for so long, and deal with it on a daily basis. If you don't want to listen to him/her, then get rid of them and let the members decide what is best for the course...I am sure that will go down really well!

Exactly!