Buchanan Castle Golf Club - Disgraceful open payouts

[garyinderry]

Is there something wrong with a club making a profit of an open?

Was it £10 for the golf and comp.

Surely some of that will be the fee to play the course and some will be comp fee.

 

[Blue in Munich]

The results are online which show how many teams entered

It seems the OP got his facts a little bit mixed up

You know the rules Phil; never let the truth get in the way of a good social media rant.

 

[Jacko_G]

I guess most of your clubs throw £££'s away.

Our club competitions get the greens cut, bunkers raked on the morning of the competition, the week running up to it is the "presentation" time and the greenkeepers work a rota for who works Saturday morning which is part of their salary.

I fail to see where the o/t comes from.

Anyway this thread is going round in circles (not quite sock gate circles) so I shall now out having had my say.

👍

 

[bobmac]

Its a fair point. How many staff would they have in on a club comp day, and do their club comps have less players and, hence, less staff on? I accept that the green staff may not turn in on most Sundays but may have cut the greens late on the Saturday night and raked the bunkers and swished the greens on the Sunday. 3 hour between 2 staff for both occasions. 6 hour at double time, 12 hours @ £30/hr = £360. Take the £360 off leaves £750. Paying approx £300 out, leaves £450... 40% profit?

Did they really only make £160 profit. Maybe they did, maybe they didn't.

The prizes were £450
Add in the cost of flowers/hanging baskets and a gardener (post no. 63) and there's your £140.

 

[Hobbit]

The prizes were £450
Add in the cost of flowers/hanging baskets and a gardener (post no. 63) and there's your £140.

The competitors have paid for hanging baskets that will be there for the summer, and that's part of the competition costs?!? What a load of rubbish. The club have applied that as part of the competition costs, and people are buying into that excuse? Seriously?

Extra greens and bar staff/hours I'd happily accept as a competition cost, but hanging baskets... really? They might have bought them in time for the comp to make the place look better, but that's a coincidental benefit, not a comp cost. If I'd put that in front of my Financial Director he'd have laughed his white socks off.

 

[bobmac]

I'm only repeating what was said in post 63.
Anyway, I've said my piece, I think that £10 for a round of golf is a bargain, throw in a green fee voucher and a £50 prize and the OP has no reason to call it disgusting.
I think the next time he wants to criticise a club on a public forum, he should get his facts right first.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Some people still seeming to get very uppity despite having the facts and costs explained throughout the thread. I can't understand the outrage and need to split the costs down or complain that green staff may have had to work on the day of the event and therefore receive overtime. We had the Jamega tour earlier in the year (bottom tier developmental tour) and all our green staff were there on the Sunday (pro-am day) to mow the greens, rake the bunkers and basically ensure the course was in as good a condition as possible and repeated that on Monday and Tuesday of the event. It is their chance to present the course to as many people as possible and they take great pride in their work so why wouldn't they be there for an Open event to ensure everything was as good as it could be. Can only reflect well on them if the course looks and plays well and so any overtime would be well deserved.

 

[ScienceBoy]

Anyway this thread is going round in circles (not quite sock gate circles) so I shall now out having had my say.

👍

You made a fair point and made it well, but some people won’t be swayed.

Well done for making it and not endlessly battling against people where you both have opposite opinions and won’t change them.

 

[Hobbit]

Some people still seeming to get very uppity despite having the facts and costs explained throughout the thread. I can't understand the outrage and need to split the costs down or complain that green staff may have had to work on the day of the event and therefore receive overtime. We had the Jamega tour earlier in the year (bottom tier developmental tour) and all our green staff were there on the Sunday (pro-am day) to mow the greens, rake the bunkers and basically ensure the course was in as good a condition as possible and repeated that on Monday and Tuesday of the event. It is their chance to present the course to as many people as possible and they take great pride in their work so why wouldn't they be there for an Open event to ensure everything was as good as it could be. Can only reflect well on them if the course looks and plays well and so any overtime would be well deserved.

I refer you to post #169.

I'm happy to respect other people's views on it but that doesn't mean I have to agree with them.

I have over 30 years golf club admin experience, inc. Chair of Comps, Chair of the Finance committee. In this instance, I feel the golf club have skimmed too much. That said, how another club runs its business is up to them. But I feel changing basket and Gardner expense being applied to the comp is a bit of a stretch - I'm being polite.

As for your uppity comment... Mmm, it would appear you've taken the club's excuse, and I use the word excuse deliberately, at face value. Fine, its your opinion.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

I refer you to post #169.

I'm happy to respect other people's views on it but that doesn't mean I have to agree with them.

I have over 30 years golf club admin experience, inc. Chair of Comps, Chair of the Finance committee. In this instance, I feel the golf club have skimmed too much. That said, how another club runs its business is up to them. But I feel changing basket and Gardner expense being applied to the comp is a bit of a stretch - I'm being polite.

As for your uppity comment... Mmm, it would appear you've taken the club's excuse, and I use the word excuse deliberately, at face value. Fine, its your opinion.

And as far as basket and gardening costs go I agree. It was more the people alluding to about green staff doing additional work on the course and being paid overtime that I was referring to and as I said they want the course to be its best and a reflection of their work so have no issue paying that. If you take off the money for the baskets and gardener (was it £145 - can't be asked to re-read it all) I am not sure the club skimmed too much. Again you could argue the club wanted the baskets etc to show the facility as a whole at its best to visitors (free publicity and worth of mouth recommendations usually a good form of getting your name known). I still find the original post and moans smack of a pot hunter (reticent to use the word bandit without proof although the tales of some from things like the Trilby tour clearly leave a mark) who thought they would play and there would be richer picking on offer.

 

[bobmac]

I refer you to post #169.

I don't think a club taking anything over 15%, after costs, as being fair.


I have over 30 years golf club admin experience, inc. Chair of Comps, Chair of the Finance committee. In this instance, I feel the golf club have skimmed too much.

£1110 entrance fees
£160 profit
14.4%

The OP stated as fact there were 56 teams so an extra £570 and if that was the case, he would have had a point.
But there was only 37 teams, so he doesn't.
He also assumed £300 were spent on prizes not the actual figure of £450
He also forgot to mention EVERYONE got a green fee voucher.
So he heavily criticised the club publicly based on wrong assumptions and incorrect ''facts'' and I think he's out of order and should apologise for his ''disgraceful payout'' comment.
Just my opinion of course.

 

[doublebogey7]

Interesting thread but not sure the OP has a genuine case. Two weeks I played an Open AM AM at top West Midlands Course. Entry Fee was £35 a little steep for an open but I was more than happy to pay it as the green fee would normally be nearly twice that. We were very surprised to come in fifth place with a less than spectacular score and also surprised but delighted to find we had won £70 each. Having read this thread I decided to do my own calculations and found this club made over £2600 from the event with a net profit rate of over 50%. I personally have no problem with that as I play opens to enjoy a new course I perhaps would not want to pay a full green for and to meet new people. Some people on here though seem to play them for their own personal financial gain, a sad reflection on life for some people today I feel.

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

It's pretty simple really, if you don't think a particular open offers decent VFM then don't enter it. End of.

 

[Siolag]

It's pretty simple really, if you don't think a particular open offers decent VFM then don't enter it. End of.

Especially if the prize is a big factor in your enjoyment of an event.

 

[Hobbit]

£1110 entrance fees
£160 profit
14.4%

The OP stated as fact there were 56 teams so an extra £570 and if that was the case, he would have had a point.
But there was only 37 teams, so he doesn't.
He also assumed £300 were spent on prizes not the actual figure of £450
He also forgot to mention EVERYONE got a green fee voucher.
So he heavily criticised the club publicly based on wrong assumptions and incorrect ''facts'' and I think he's out of order and should apologise for his ''disgraceful payout'' comment.
Just my opinion of course.

I agree, the OP has gilded the lily to make his argument sound stronger, and in doing so has painted the club in a bad light. Giving green fee vouchers to everyone who played is a huge giveaway, and very generous, although not everyone will use their voucher. However, charging hanging baskets as part of the competition costs is a joke - I'd guess that's been thrown in the mix by the guy that replied on behalf of the club as some sort of mitigation.

 

[Hobbit]

It's pretty simple really, if you don't think a particular open offers decent VFM then don't enter it. End of.

Is the right answer.

Pretty much every advert for an Open lists the prizes, and if doesn't suit the eye, don't go.

 

[bobmac]

However, charging hanging baskets as part of the competition costs is a joke - I'd guess that's been thrown in the mix by the guy that replied on behalf of the club as some sort of mitigation.

To be fair, he didn't mention hanging baskets, just flowers, I don't know where I got hanging baskets from. My apologies.
It could be an idea for next year though.

 

[Swango1980]

I can see why the golf authorities have strict guidelines in avoiding cash prizes at amateur level. Just look at the reaction to winning £50 worth of vouchers, pathetic really. If you are genuinely only motivated by the prize fund, then by all means don't enter again. By the sounds of it, the club won't miss you as it seems a popular event anyway. And, if you really want to play the course again, albeit not in a competition, you can always pay a green fee (probably higher than the open entry fee), accepting that there will be no prize regardless of how you play.

 

[Marshy77]

I can see why the golf authorities have strict guidelines in avoiding cash prizes at amateur level. Just look at the reaction to winning £50 worth of vouchers, pathetic really. If you are genuinely only motivated by the prize fund, then by all means don't enter again. By the sounds of it, the club won't miss you as it seems a popular event anyway. And, if you really want to play the course again, albeit not in a competition, you can always pay a green fee (probably higher than the open entry fee), accepting that there will be no prize regardless of how you play.

Pretty certain the prize fund wasn't the motivation as they didn't know what that would be, think it was the spliting of the prize pot from the entries that was the issue.

If he did go back he could use his free green fee voucher.

 

[Jacko_G]

Pretty certain the prize fund wasn't the motivation as they didn't know what that would be, think it was the spliting of the prize pot from the entries that was the issue.

If he did go back he could use his free green fee voucher.

It WASN'T A FREE ROUND OF GOLF!

It was a £60 voucher club still making money.