Brexit - or Article 50: the Phoenix!

[Tashyboy]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47551266

And this quite frankly is what boils my piss. The government release this information stating that 87% of imports will be tariff free. At the moment it is 80%, With the current EU trade deals. So in essence we still need to stay in Europe and pay Billions to get a worse bloody deal.
Remainers and MPs that want an extension need to open there closed eyes.

I posted this on March 13th, post 6708 nowt was said then. 👍

 

[Foxholer]

That tweet shows the issue not my fault people don’t understand that they at the moment are more than all our other exports put together

Even a 20% fall in sales to them through brexit (not saying a complete no trade agreement) but say knock 20% off due to it becoming more difficult or any reason would damage our economy .. that would be over 70 billion wiped out just 20%... now put that in perspective .. 20% off that would be the same as knocking off 50% the rest of the world .. I don’t see the 20% being made up so easy ..

That’s why it’s so important

Any % knock off would be huge as they are our biggest customer

Please explain what we sell specifically to 'the EU' - as opposed to 'the 27 (other) EU member countries'! Germany is our biggest customer, followed by Netherlands, France and Ireland. The fact that they are all EU members is simply geographic/convenience!

 

[Foxholer]

Since the vote in 2016 the balance of exports has shifted. The UK actually exports more to the rest of the world than it does to the EU.

Shifted? Not according to this Gov.UK article! https://www.gov.uk/government/news/uk-exports-to-non-eu-countries-continue-to-outstrip-eu

 

[Foxholer]

We trade with the EU with a trade defecit. We trade with the USA with a trade surplus.

I'm pleased to see you've finally worked out what the term 'trade' actually means!

 

[Foxholer]

Well, the Koreans have enough faith in their product to offer five year warranties unlike the supposed 'quality' German marques...

Wrong!





At least for Kia!




They offer 7 year warranties!

 

[Foxholer]

If quality is linked to reliability, I don't know why anyone would want to buy a Merc or BMW. 30th and 31st respectively in Warrenty Direct's reliability list.

https://www.reliabilityindex.com/manufacturer

Porche came 37th out of 40 - but we all know why some men buy Porches (and BMW's) , don't we

I've bought German, UK and Japanese made cars, along with NZ assembled Japanese and UK ones.

Bottom of the scale for quality were UK ones. Others were all pretty similar 'quality' but I've always preferred the German 'feel' - older UK cars (that I grew up riding in/driving) were similar.

 

[Foxholer]

Which ones are they ?

Check out where the various models of BMW are acrtually made!

 

[Foxholer]

Have a Merc, and two BMWs. Love them all, and would not buy anything else.

That said, my Chrysler was ridiculously cheap to run, and reliable too.

Based on Mercedes?
Chrysler is, after all, owned by Mercedes (Daimler-Benz)!

Generally though, 'traditional' US cars don't 'transfer' well to the European market! US's spacious, easy driving, cheaply fuelled style doesn't fit with Europe's more restricted approach!

 

[Foxholer]

Why are they going to be cheaper ? Transport costs are going to be a bit higher coming from further , car imports are huge from the EU with the golf being the second biggest seller in the UK and half the cars in the top ten I believe are from the EU.

You seriously think the cars from US , Canada are going to be cheaper and from China and Korea ( already import from there ) are going to be the same quality ?

Technology and labour are (or at least were when I was involved) the major costs for car manufacture - and Asia is/was far ahead of Europe in performance in both catagories! Transport was a, somewhat surprisingly, significantly smallr consideration!

 

[Foxholer]

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp....-eu-face-9bn-tariff-bill-under-no-deal-brexit

So what about this forecast of £9bn extra tariffs
...

Perhaps you should actually read the article rather than simply just the headline!

...

And this says cars possibly having an extra £1k on them

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/business-47551266
...

So what...Buy a different brand!

...
This is another report that reads not great

https://www.itv.com/news/2019-03-13...mports-from-outside-the-eu-in-no-deal-brexit/

That's twaddle! Buyers would simply adjust - buying non-EU brands

 

[Leftie]

I've bought German, UK and Japanese made cars, along with NZ assembled Japanese and UK ones.

Bottom of the scale for quality were UK ones. Others were all pretty similar 'quality' but I've always preferred the German 'feel' - older UK cars (that I grew up riding in/driving) were similar.

Very strange reply from you Foxy. My post in reply to LP started with "If quality is linked to reliability" and I linked to a list which was produced by (supposedly) experts this year, 2019. This clearly demonstrates that Mercedes, BMW, Audi, Porsche and VW have produced cars that are currently way below average for reliability - yet you decided to go off on a tangent about cars that you had bought and/or grown up with in the past.

You may well prefer the German "feel" (no sniggering at the back of the class please Smithers) of earlier cars, but that was not the discussion.

 

[Deleted member 18588]

Based on Mercedes?
Chrysler is, after all, owned by Mercedes (Daimler-Benz)!

Generally though, 'traditional' US cars don't 'transfer' well to the European market! US's spacious, easy driving, cheaply fuelled style doesn't fit with Europe's more restricted approach!

Isn't Chrysler owned by Fiat (a watchword for reliability and build quality)?

 

[Slime]

So we are already importing them ? And whilst Hyundai and Kia make very good cars - they aren’t at the level of the BMW’s etc

Quality wise, in regards to plain reliability, I'd say they are as good as any car.
They may not be on a level with BMW in regards to performance, optional extras or, indeed, standard equipment but they are also not on a level with BMW in regards to price or running costs!!
Give me my KIA and several thousand pounds in my pocket over any BMW I've ever owned.

 

[Foxholer]

Isn't Chrysler owned by Fiat (a watchword for reliability and build quality)?

Oops - good point! I forgot Mercedes wasn't the end of the 'Chrysler sold' story! Indeed Fiat is current owner. Indeed, Mercedes 'got lucky' selling it when it did!

 

[Deleted member 18588]

Quality wise, in regards to plain reliability, I'd say they are as good as any car.
They may not be on a level with BMW in regards to performance, optional extras or, indeed, standard equipment but they are also not on a level with BMW in regards to price or running costs!!
Give me my KIA and several thousand pounds in my pocket over any BMW I've ever owned.

I feel the same towards my Hyundai compared with a series of Mercs I owned.

Also, depending upon spec the level of standard equipment compares favourably.

Yes the Mercs were superior cars but I am not certain that justified the difference in costs.

 

[Hacker Khan]

As the person who originally mentioned BMWs as a play on the much mentioned quote by leavers that the German car industry proves that they need us as much as we need them then I am sorry.

The last few pages have been like Top Gear, not the Clarkson version but the Chris Goffey days. And no one who has an Audi says 'I wish I had a Hyundai instead'

 

[Foxholer]

Very strange reply from you Foxy. My post in reply to LP started with "If quality is linked to reliability" and I linked to a list which was produced by (supposedly) experts this year, 2019. This clearly demonstrates that Mercedes, BMW, Audi, Porsche and VW have produced cars that are currently way below average for reliability - yet you decided to go off on a tangent about cars that you had bought and/or grown up with in the past.

You may well prefer the German "feel" (no sniggering at the back of the class please Smithers) of earlier cars, but that was not the discussion.

Seems you prefer 'one-liner' replies to explanations!

In my post, 1st para provides the background to the 1st part of the 2nd para - the summary! Surely you noticed the word 'quality' in there. And while that report may have been produced in 2019, the cars in that report are, generally, not 2019 ones! So 'in the past' is totally relevant - at least 5+ years!

 

[Foxholer]

So we are already importing them ? And whilst Hyundai and Kia make very good cars - they aren’t at the level of the BMW’s etc

I'd suggest you go test drive and check 'cost of ownership' over 5+ years, or however long you keep (your own) cars for. I'm pretty sure 'BMWs etc' are 'taking significant advantage of their image', while Hyundai and Kia are (probably) using a different pricing model!

 

[Foxholer]

As the person who originally mentioned BMWs as a play on the much mentioned quote by leavers that the German car industry proves that they need us as much as we need them then I am sorry.

The last few pages have been like Top Gear, not the Clarkson version but the Chris Goffey days. And no one who has an Audi says 'I wish I had a Hyundai instead'

You may regret introducing the concpt, but it would suggest that you were totally correct! Whether UK actually needs the German car industry though....!

 

[Deleted member 18588]

As the person who originally mentioned BMWs as a play on the much mentioned quote by leavers that the German car industry proves that they need us as much as we need them then I am sorry.

The last few pages have been like Top Gear, not the Clarkson version but the Chris Goffey days. And no one who has an Audi says 'I wish I had a Hyundai instead'

It's OK if I wanted a VW I would buy one and not pay the unjustified Audi premium.

And as for going off topic, well we have got nowhere over the last near three years by sticking to the subject.