2023 Rules with change notes

wjemather

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Making Player Responsible for Handicap on Scorecard
Purpose. Rule 3.3b(4) states that there is no requirement for a player’s handicap to be shown on the scorecard and that it is the Committee’s responsibility to calculate the player’s handicap strokes for the competition in order to calculate the player’s net score.But in some circumstances, it can be difficult for the Committee to calculate players’ handicaps, for example, where the Committee does not have a computer system to help with the administration of the competition or where they do not have access to a database of player handicaps. In such situations, the Committee may choose to modify Rule 3.3b(4) to require players to show their handicap on the scorecard......
Precisely. I read your previous post as suggesting that it be used in the absence of electronic scorecards, which is clearly not the intent.
 

Colin L

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We're not disagreeing over anything but not having a computer system would result in an absence of electronic scorecards would it not?

My club's system was recently out of action for over a week following a cyber attack. Had that happened in season, we would have had to revert to physical cards and introduce this LR for the competitions affected. Otherwise, the Committee would have had to look up the handicap indexes and then the course handicaps of over a hundred players. I don't think it matters whether you describe that as not having a computer system or there being an absence of electronic cards.
 

D-S

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We're not disagreeing over anything but not having a computer system would result in an absence of electronic scorecards would it not?

My club's system was recently out of action for over a week following a cyber attack. Had that happened in season, we would have had to revert to physical cards and introduce this LR for the competitions affected. Otherwise, the Committee would have had to look up the handicap indexes and then the course handicaps of over a hundred players. I don't think it matters whether you describe that as not having a computer system or there being an absence of electronic cards.
Wouldn’t the committee have to look up the handicaps anyway to see if the handicaps that the players had put on their cards were correct?
 

SwingsitlikeHogan

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Reading changes to a Rule 9.3 Ball at rest moved by natural forces. Just being pedantic but hey…

’ If a ball at rest is moved…comes to rest in a different area of the course…’

Does ‘area of the course’ mean anywhere on the course, or does it refer to the different types of areas of a course as defined in the rules e.g. a force of nature causes my ball to move from green to general area - green and general area being different areas of the course defined under the rules. And so if my ball moves but stays in the same defined area then I do not replace it.
 

wjemather

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We're not disagreeing over anything but not having a computer system would result in an absence of electronic scorecards would it not?

My club's system was recently out of action for over a week following a cyber attack. Had that happened in season, we would have had to revert to physical cards and introduce this LR for the competitions affected. Otherwise, the Committee would have had to look up the handicap indexes and then the course handicaps of over a hundred players. I don't think it matters whether you describe that as not having a computer system or there being an absence of electronic cards.
The absence of a computer system to run competitions materially affects access to (and accessibility of) handicap information. There are many other reasons for the committee not having access to handicaps - e.g. non-affiliated organisations, having entrants from outside the jurisdictions for which the committee is able to access handicapping information, etc.

The availability of electronic scorecards is should not be conflated with the availability of competition management software/handicapping information, and their absence is not a reason to implement the MLR.
 

SwingsitlikeHogan

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It is referring to teeing area, putting green, bunker, penalty area, general area and the ball moving from one of these areas to a different one of these areas.
OK…so as I suggested if, for example, my ball is at rest on the fairway and the winds blows it to another place on the fairway, I do not replace it. And that applies even in scenarios such as where wind has blown it and it ends up at rest still on the fairway but 100yds closer to the green (unlikely but just to make the point).
 
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rulefan

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OK…so as I suggested if, for example, my ball is at rest on the fairway and the winds blows it to another place on the fairway, I do not replace it. And that applies even in scenarios such as where wind has blown it and it ends up at rest 100yds closer to the green (unlikely but just to make the point).
Yes. But remember the 'fairway' and 'rough' are in the General Area. (Unless in a Penalty Area ;))
 

rulie

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Seems to be some confusion here? Rule 9.3 says that if a ball at rest is moved by natural forces, it must be played from where it came to rest, regardless of area of the course.
However, Exception 2 to that Rule says that if a ball at rest after having been dropped, placed or replaced is moved by natural forces and comes to rest in another area of the course or out of bounds, the ball MUST be replaced at its original spot. This new Exception is referred to as the Rickie Fowler rule.
 

Steven Rules

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I had assumed the after having been dropped, placed or replaced bit was a 'given'. But, on reflection, I do concede that it was probably a pretty bad assumption.
 

jim8flog

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OK…so as I suggested if, for example, my ball is at rest on the fairway and the winds blows it to another place on the fairway, I do not replace it. And that applies even in scenarios such as where wind has blown it and it ends up at rest still on the fairway but 100yds closer to the green (unlikely but just to make the point).

Are you talking about before or after moving and placing in a different place e.g when using lift clean and place.

If the latter you would have to retrieve it and put it back where it was. The intention is to bring the rule in line with what happens on a putting green.

If the former you play it from where it comes to rest.

Rule 9.3 Ball Moved by Natural Forces
is very clear and easy to understand.
 
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SwingsitlikeHogan

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Are you talking about before or after moving and placing in a different place e.g when using lift clean and place.

If the latter you would have to retrieve it and put it back where it was. The intention is to bring the rule in line with what happens on a putting green.

If the former you play it from where it comes to rest.

Rule 9.3 Ball Moved by Natural Forces
is very clear and easy to understand.
I was thinking ball simply being at rest and such as a gust of wind getting it rolling again. When reading the new/updated rule it was really just the word ‘area’ that I was asking about.

So ball on fairway being blown and rolling into the rough - sorry but same area under the rules so have to play from where it ended up; ball in fairway blown and rolling into a bunker - different area under the rules so ball should (or can?) be replaced.
 

rulie

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I was thinking ball simply being at rest and such as a gust of wind getting it rolling again. When reading the new/updated rule it was really just the word ‘area’ that I was asking about.

So ball on fairway being blown and rolling into the rough - sorry but same area under the rules so have to play from where it ended up; ball in fairway blown and rolling into a bunker - different area under the rules so ball should (or can?) be replaced.
The Rule says MUST be replaced - no option available.
 

jim8flog

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I was thinking ball simply being at rest and such as a gust of wind getting it rolling again. When reading the new/updated rule it was really just the word ‘area’ that I was asking about.

So ball on fairway being blown and rolling into the rough - sorry but same area under the rules so have to play from where it ended up; ball in fairway blown and rolling into a bunker - different area under the rules so ball should (or can?) be replaced.

It depends on how it came to be at rest, you are not making that clear.

At rest because that is where it stopped after a shot it must be played from where it comes to rest regardless of where that is ((except of course if it comes to rest OB (tough luck)).
 

SwingsitlikeHogan

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It depends on how it came to be at rest, you are not making that clear.

At rest because that is where it stopped after a shot it must be played from where it comes to rest regardless of where that is ((except of course if it comes to rest OB (tough luck)).
Sorry. Two scenarios. Both start with the ball on the fairway. In 1st a wind blows it into the rough. As I understand it that’s tough, it’s played from where it’s ended up as ‘rough’ is in the same rules area of the course as ‘fairway’ 2nd finds the ball blown into a bunker. As a bunker is categorised under a different ‘area’ from that in which fairway is categorised, the ball must be returned to whence it came.

Unless I completely misunderstand the specific use of the word ‘area’ in the revised rule.
 

jim8flog

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Sorry. Two scenarios. Both start with the ball on the fairway. In 1st a wind blows it into the rough. That’s tough, it’s played from where it’s ended up as ‘rough’ is in the same rules area of the course as ‘fairway’ 2nd finds the ball blown into a bunker. As a bunker is categorised under a different ‘area’ from that in which fairway is categorised the ball must be returned to whence it came.

Unless I completely misunderstand the specific use of the word ‘area’ in the revised rule.


The rule makes no distinction about where a ball comes to rest


9.3 Ball Moved by Natural Forces
If natural forces (such as wind or water) cause a player’s ball at rest to move:

• There is no penalty, and
• The ball must be played from its new spot.
Exception 1 – Ball on Putting Green Must Be Replaced If It Moves After Having
Already Been Lifted and Replaced
(see Rule 13.1d): If the player’s ball on the putting
green moves after the player had already lifted and replaced the ball on the spot
from which it moved:
• The ball must be replaced on its original spot (which if not known must be
estimated) (see Rule 14.2).
• This is true no matter what caused it to move (including natural forces).
Exception 2 – Ball at Rest Must Be Replaced If It Moves to Another Area of the
Course or Out of Bounds After Being Dropped, Placed or Replaced:
If the player puts
the original ball or another ball into play by dropping, placing or replacing it, and
natural forces cause the ball at rest to move and come to rest in another area of the
course or out of bounds, the ball must be replaced on its original spot (which if not
known must be estimated) (see Rule 14.2). But for a ball on the putting green that
was replaced, see Exception 1.
Penalty for Playing Ball from a Wrong Place in Breach of Rule 9.3: General Penalty
Under Rule 14.7a.
 

jim8flog

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To add to #79

once the ball is at rest in a new position (excluding the exceptions) the rules for that new position apply.

If it it now OB then OB rules apply (looks like that needs clarification about where the next shot is played from)
If it is in a penalty area then penalty area rules apply.
 
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