Putter design - non conforming

[fullongolf]

Hi,

Played a competition at my club on the weekend. A fellow competitor in the group had a weird looking home made putter. I'll try to describe it: it was a blade style putter but it had an extension at right angles to the putter face pointing forward toward the hole (the target). The extension was about 3" long.
I immediately wondered about it's legality because I'd never seen anything like it (given that there seems to be no end of different style putters that I see for sale in golf shops). I'm curremtly using an oddysey white hot OG 7 S putter and I think that's a pretty weird design.
I have had a look at the rule book and I found something close to what the putter looked like (see fig 18 (b) below).
The putter I have tried to describe has an "aiming bar" almost identical to the (b) putter image except that the aiming bar extends beyond the face of the putter by about 3 inches (not behind the face as shown in the (b) image.
I also found that at rule xxx that there can't be any guides protruding past the face of the putter....
FIG 31: FEATURES EXTENDING AHEAD OF THE FACE

Putter with projection ahead of the face for aiming (non-conforming).

As an aside, the player using the putter sunk a number of long putts during the round

Rule 2, Conformance of Clubs
2.2c, Attachment to clubhead

FIG 18 A B C: EXAMPLES OF NON-CONFORMING NECKS

a) Putter with two necks (non-conforming). (b) Putter with aiming bar attached to the neck (non-"plain", non-conforming). (c) Putter with holes through the neck (non-"plain", non-conforming).

FIG 31: FEATURES EXTENDING AHEAD OF THE FACE

Putter with projection ahead of the face for aiming (non-conforming).

 

[jim8flog]

Do you have a question?

Can you actually ask the player to measure it?

Did you bring it to his attention?

Have a look at the drawing Fig 18 D E F and the wording
f) If the shaft or the neck of a putter is attached to the head near the centre of the face, it must protrude forward of the face by no more than 0.84 inches (the radius of a ball). The neck on this putter extends forward by more than half of the ball (non‑“plain”, non‑conforming).

Would seen lie a definite non conforming putter to me.

 

[Imurg]

Unless you're glueing together components that have already been approved as conforming, I would suspect that any "home-made " club isn't going to conform as it won't appear on the conforming list of clubs......
If it resembles "b" then it doesn't look like its legal.

 

[jim8flog]

Unless you're glueing together components that have already been approved as conforming, I would suspect that any "home-made " club isn't going to conform as it won't appear on the conforming list of clubs......
If it resembles "b" then it doesn't look like its legal.

I know there is a list of conforming drivers but I have never seen one for conforming putters.

 

[backwoodsman]

You already said it yourself by quoting the section of 2.4a about club being 'plain in shape', and especially Fig 31 and the sentence immediately before it

• Features of any nature that extend ahead of the face are not permitted on any club – see Figure 31.

I'd say definitely not conforming.

 

[rulie]

I know there is a list of conforming drivers but I have never seen one for conforming putters.

And no need to look for such a list for putters. Imo, the Equipment Rules are sufficient for determining the conformance of a putter.

 

[fullongolf]

Hi,

I inadvertently posted this by mistake, I hadn't finished editing it. I thought I had saved it to be posted later on.

In any case, my query was simply whether the putter conformed with the rules. My limited research indicated it was non conforming.

I posted the query here to get the opinion of forum members (to see if they concurred or not).

In reply to jim8flog:

Do you have a question?

A: See above

Can you actually ask the player to measure it?

A: I haven't met the player before and it may be months or more before I see him again.

PS: I have no doubt the extension/aiming bar is longer than .84 inches.

Did you bring it to his attention?

A: I only asked where he had got it from and he told me it had been made for him.

 

[nickjdavis]

As far as i am aware, it is up to the "challenger" to prove it is non-conforming, rather than the owner of the club to prove that it conforms.

 

[rulie]

As far as i am aware, it is up to the "challenger" to prove it is non-conforming, rather than the owner of the club to prove that it conforms.

Not so!! rule 4.1 is clear that a player must use a club that conforms to the requirements of the Equipment Rules. It is the player's responsibility, nobody else's'.

 

[srixon 1]

I always thought that a club when made new had to be sent to The R&A to make sure it conforms. And you don’t get it back so you actually have to make two. Maybe this is from a long time ago.

 

[nickjdavis]

Not so!! rule 4.1 is clear that a player must use a club that conforms to the requirements of the Equipment Rules. It is the player's responsibility, nobody else's'.

That is not what I said.

Yes it is down to the player to make sure it conforms...however...if someone else challenges its conformity, it is down to them to prove it does not conform.

edit: that might be by the claimant waving the equipment rules in a players face, or by showing the player a copy of list of conforming drivers, or by seeking an official ruling as to whether it conforms or not. The user of the club doesn't actually have to do anything to prove it conforms.

 

[rulie]

That is not what I said.

Yes it is down to the player to make sure it conforms...however...if someone else challenges its conformity, it is down to them to prove it does not conform.

edit: that might be by the claimant waving the equipment rules in a players face, or by showing the player a copy of list of conforming drivers, or by seeking an official ruling as to whether it conforms or not. The user of the club doesn't actually have to do anything to prove it conforms.

Rule 1.2a All players are expected to play in the spirit of the game by:
- acting with integrity

Other players only need to notify the Committee, they don't need to prove anything. The player is responsible for using conforming clubs.
There's another word for a player who knowingly uses non-conforming equipment.

 

[Colin L]

That is not what I said.

Yes it is down to the player to make sure it conforms...however...if someone else challenges its conformity, it is down to them to prove it does not conform.

edit: that might be by the claimant waving the equipment rules in a players face, or by showing the player a copy of list of conforming drivers, or by seeking an official ruling as to whether it conforms or not. The user of the club doesn't actually have to do anything to prove it conforms.

Where did you get that from?

 

[Crow]

Rule 1.2a All players are expected to play in the spirit of the game by:
- acting with integrity

Other players only need to notify the Committee, they don't need to prove anything. The player is responsible for using conforming clubs.
There's another word for a player who knowingly uses non-conforming equipment.

I do on occasion.

 

[nickjdavis]

Where did you get that from?

I may have read something in the dim and distant past to such effect but couldn't quote verbatim, hence I qualified my statement with "as far as I am aware"...

Player A: Your grooves on your wedges look a bit wide....I think they are non conforming
Player B: No...I'm sure they are OK
Player A: I'm not convinced
Player B: Well I've just holed out from 40 yards so I'm happy with them

...where do you go from there?

Does player B have to sit in front of the committee and carry out the process for measuring his wedge grooves (or maybe demonstrating his driver COR is fine)? Or does he hand over the club to the committee for them to investigate and demonstrate non-conformity? Is he proving conformity...or is the committee proving non-conformity?

If someone comes up to me and says on the first tee that...your driver is not conforming...am I expected to extract a list of the conforming clubs from a pocket in my bag and show where it is listed? No. I expect the challenger to raise the issue with officialdom and would wait to be summonsed to the committee room for a severe caning across the backside with the offending club if it was found to be non conforming. I'll co-operate with said committee but I'm not going to go out of my way to prove anything, other than to had the club over for their examination.

There is a difference between a player doing everything that he can to ensure he is in adherence of Rule 4, and what actually should happen in practice should he be challenged by someone who thinks his club is non conforming, and who is responsible for doing what in order to settle such a challenge. Perhaps I should have asked a direct question back in post 8, rather than simply stating my understanding/belief of what should happen.

 

[fullongolf]

There is a pretty hefty difference between the grooves on a club and a putter that could also double as a lethal weapon.

I'm having trouble reading the numbers on a printed scorecard, so trying to gauge the width of the groove on the clubface isn't going to happen.

The putter in question is outlandish in design and looks, really in your face.

 

[rulie]

I may have read something in the dim and distant past to such effect but couldn't quote verbatim, hence I qualified my statement with "as far as I am aware"...

Player A: Your grooves on your wedges look a bit wide....I think they are non conforming
Player B: No...I'm sure they are OK
Player A: I'm not convinced
Player B: Well I've just holed out from 40 yards so I'm happy with them

...where do you go from there?

Does player B have to sit in front of the committee and carry out the process for measuring his wedge grooves (or maybe demonstrating his driver COR is fine)? Or does he hand over the club to the committee for them to investigate and demonstrate non-conformity? Is he proving conformity...or is the committee proving non-conformity?

If someone comes up to me and says on the first tee that...your driver is not conforming...am I expected to extract a list of the conforming clubs from a pocket in my bag and show where it is listed? No. I expect the challenger to raise the issue with officialdom and would wait to be summonsed to the committee room for a severe caning across the backside with the offending club if it was found to be non conforming. I'll co-operate with said committee but I'm not going to go out of my way to prove anything, other than to had the club over for their examination.

There is a difference between a player doing everything that he can to ensure he is in adherence of Rule 4, and what actually should happen in practice should he be challenged by someone who thinks his club is non conforming, and who is responsible for doing what in order to settle such a challenge. Perhaps I should have asked a direct question back in post 8, rather than simply stating my understanding/belief of what should happen.

Every player has an obligation to protect the field from other players who are not playing by the Rules of golf, including using non-conforming equipment, by reporting to the Committee in charge. I accept that responsibility and don't see fulfilling it as being overly taxing. The Committee can then fulfill their responsibility by doing the required follow-up.

 

[Steven Rules]

Played a competition at my club on the weekend. A fellow competitor in the group had a weird looking home made putter.

So, in light of everything that has been written here, will you be bringing your concerns to the attention of the player and the Committee?

 

[fullongolf]

I may never see the player again but I have spoken to a club official about it.

 

[Oddsocks]

Hi,

I inadvertently posted this by mistake, I hadn't finished editing it. I thought I had saved it to be posted later on.

In any case, my query was simply whether the putter conformed with the rules. My limited research indicated it was non conforming.

I posted the query here to get the opinion of forum members (to see if they concurred or not).

In reply to jim8flog:

Do you have a question?

A: See above

Can you actually ask the player to measure it?

A: I haven't met the player before and it may be months or more before I see him again.

PS: I have no doubt the extension/aiming bar is longer than .84 inches.

Did you bring it to his attention?

A: I only asked where he had got it from and he told me it had been made for him.

Did he win the match? And have you made him aware of this?