Tricky rules question

[upsidedown]

We were playing with a friend on Monday whose a beginner so were marking his card so he can get a handicap.

On the 15 th ( Stroke index 3 ) his tee shot went into the trees on the right.

He disappeared into them and then shouted across to me " What's the penalty for moving a stick that then caused his ball to move " I replied with " 2 shots "

He then played the ball on to the fairway next to me where I noticed it was a Wilson not his taylor made. Asked if he'd changed on the tee , No was the answer.

So do penalty shots apply to the wrong ball as penalty shots.

To confuse the issue further we didn't find his original ball.

As I understand it it would be back to the tee and play from there , Is it 3 or 5 off the tee? Or indeed 7 for moving the wrong ball , but shots played with wrong ball don't count, so long as you find original ball.

To save time as ,folks waiting to tee off behind us I scored him a 8 ( maximum allowed on that hole for handicap calculations ).

 

[0]

Think the shots taken with the wrong ball count plus penalty for playing the wrong ball.
I think the biggest issue is he didn't complete the round and should be disqualified, I understand you kept play going and he would have prob got at least an 8 on the hole but rules is rules.

http://shop.randa.org/index.cfm?action=p...tid=&free=1

 

[bobmac]

Think the shots taken with the wrong ball count plus penalty for playing the wrong ball.
I think the biggest issue is he didn't complete the round and should be disqualified, I understand you kept play going and he would have prob got at least an 8 on the hole but rules is rules.

Wrong I'm afraid
Shots taken with a wrong ball DO NOT COUNT. 15 3b

And what is he being disqualified from if he doesnt have a handicap, hes not playing in a comp.
Just mark down NR for the hole explain to the h/cap sec what happened and he will make the decision.

 

[upsidedown]

Think the shots taken with the wrong ball count plus penalty for playing the wrong ball.
I think the biggest issue is he didn't complete the round and should be disqualified, I understand you kept play going and he would have prob got at least an 8 on the hole but rules is rules.

Wrong I'm afraid
Shots taken with a wrong ball DO NOT COUNT. 15 3b

And what is he being disqualified from if he doesnt have a handicap, hes not playing in a comp.
Just mark down NR for the hole explain to the h/cap sec what happened and he will make the decision.

So should be 3 off the tee then ?

 

[chrisd]

So should be 3 off the tee then ?

Outcome as Bob says

Had he gone back to tee wouldn't it be 1 shot for the original tee off plus 2 shot penalty for playing wrong ball. Therefore he would be playing 4



Chris

 

[MashieNiblick]

I reckon it's 5 off the tee.

Tee shot (1), 2 shot penalty for playing a wrong ball (3) and stroke and distance for lost ball (4). So I think when he goes back to the tee he's playing 5.

Also by the way the penalty if you move your ball when moving a loose impediment is only 1 stroke not 2 and the ball must be replaced. Rules 23-1 and 18-2a. However the penalty for breach of rule (i.e. not replacing the ball) is 2 strokes.

Of course as Bob says in this case, as it was a wrong ball, any strokes played with the wrong ball, including any penalty strokes wouldn't count.

 

[chrisd]

I reckon it's 5 off the tee.

Agreed. Silly me - forgot the stroke and distance!



Chris

 

[upsidedown]

I reckon it's 5 off the tee.

Tee shot (1), 2 shot penalty for playing a wrong ball (3) and stroke and distance for lost ball (4). So I think when he goes back to the tee he's playing 5.

Also by the way the penalty if you move your ball when moving a loose impediment is only 1 stroke not 2 and the ball must be replaced. Rules 23-1 and 18-2a. However the penalty for breach of rule (i.e. not replacing the ball) is 2 strokes.

Of course as Bob says in this case, as it was a wrong ball, any strokes played with the wrong ball, including any penalty strokes wouldn't count.

He had indeed not replaced the ball

Thinking 5 too now

 

[Pull]

Surely the penalty for playing the wrong ball only comes into play once he has holed out? Surely if it doesnt find his ball it's back to the tee and playing 3?

As the other ball was not his nor his provisional these shots won't count?

 

[chrisd]

Surely the penalty for playing the wrong ball only comes into play once he has holed out? Surely if it doesnt find his ball it's back to the tee and playing 3?

As the other ball was not his nor his provisional these shots won't count?

Sorry not imo - he found a ball, thought it was his and as soon as he plays a wrong ball the penalty applies, your not adding any penalties for the wrong ball, as said, the penalties apply but the shots with the wrong ball don't.

Had he found his ball afterwards he would have been able to play it with the same penalty applying.
Chris

 

[sev112]

hmmm

so if tehre is no penalty for playing a wrong ball, i can walk up tp my ball, drop a "wrong" ball next to it, hit it to teh green to work out wind/distance and keep doing that until i've worked out eth right club and then hit the right ball

Or do teh same on the green as many times as i need to so that i work out the right line and pace

Has to be a penalty or stroke at least for each stroke played whether at a wrong ball or not ?

 

[chrisd]

hmmm

so if tehre is no penalty for playing a wrong ball,

Not too sure that your reading this correctly - it's a 2 shot penalty for playing a wrong ball but the shots that you played don't get added as well - just the penalty. So, if you only hit the wrong ball once, the penalty is 2 shotsin strokeplay and not 3 shots ie 2 penalties and one for the shot played. In matchplay it's straightaway loss of the hole!


I wonder if 2 players in a singles matchplay both hit the wrong ball in match play what would be the ruling?


Chris

Chris

 

[viscount17]

15-3 seems pretty straightforward ( )

matchplay - loss of hole

strokeplay - two shots, and dq if it is not rectified before playing off the next tee

 

[doublebogey7]

hmmm

so if tehre is no penalty for playing a wrong ball,

Not too sure that your reading this correctly - it's a 2 shot penalty for playing a wrong ball but the shots that you played don't get added as well - just the penalty. So, if you only hit the wrong ball once, the penalty is 2 shotsin strokeplay and not 3 shots ie 2 penalties and one for the shot played. In matchplay it's straightaway loss of the hole!


I wonder if 2 players in a singles matchplay both hit the wrong ball in match play what would be the ruling?


Chris

Chris

The player who first played the wrong ball would lose the hole, as when the second player played the wrong ball the hole had already been won.

 

[palindromicbob]

I'd just like to say it sounds like this beginner is a good guy. To be honest enough to own up to moving the ball (even it was the wrong one) when clearing loose impediments is the type of character needed to be a good sportsman. Although I doubt the rulings are going to ultimately effect the outcome of his card (if the max strokes allowed was 8 anyway) they are worth pointing out to him in a friendly manner of course.

As others have said though it would have been shot 5 off the tee. 1 initial stroke, 2 for playing wrong ball, 1 for lost ball then the 5th would be the second attempt from the tee box.