Tree fallen in general area . Free drop or not ?

[Redandy888]

Hi
Can anyone help ?
Par 4 316
So a tree had fallen from the boundary to the general area (rough)180 yardsish. The tree (still half rooted, pic is too large to upload ) had fallen the day before & had not been declared GUR. My partner hit to under the branches with his T shot. He said it was impeding his swing & believed it's a free drop. He couldn't go for the green as there is another tree in the way & too near boundary woods. As I usually call the rules I said you must chip out or take a drop. He chipped out. We have gone back & forth on this & then 2 days later the club manager said it's a free drop even though not painted out with Gur. I argued as it's still rooted.
Your thoughts please
Andy

 

[Alan Clifford]

Hi
Can anyone help ?
Par 4 316
So a tree had fallen from the boundary to the general area (rough)180 yardsish. The tree (still half rooted, pic is too large to upload ) had fallen the day before & had not been declared GUR. My partner hit to under the branches with his T shot. He said it was impeding his swing & believed it's a free drop. He couldn't go for the green as there is another tree in the way & too near boundary woods. As I usually call the rules I said you must chip out or take a drop. He chipped out. We have gone back & forth on this & then 2 days later the club manager said it's a free drop even though not painted out with Gur. I argued as it's still rooted.
Your thoughts please
Andy

Ha Ha, it's just the same as a rooted piece of grass. Or is it an unusual course condition?

 

[Redandy888]

Ha Ha, it's just the same as a rooted piece of grass. Or is it an unusual course condition?

Cheers Alan
See I read rule 16 & still don't know

 

[rulefan]

Unless it is marked or published as GUR it isn't.
And it certainly isn't an Immovable Obstruction or Loose Impediment

 

[Redandy888]

Unless it is marked or published as GUR it isn't.
And it certainly isn't an Immovable Obstruction or Loose Impediment

Ah okay, so should have been Gur

 

[doublebogey7]

Hi
Can anyone help ?
Par 4 316
So a tree had fallen from the boundary to the general area (rough)180 yardsish. The tree (still half rooted, pic is too large to upload ) had fallen the day before & had not been declared GUR. My partner hit to under the branches with his T shot. He said it was impeding his swing & believed it's a free drop. He couldn't go for the green as there is another tree in the way & too near boundary woods. As I usually call the rules I said you must chip out or take a drop. He chipped out. We have gone back & forth on this & then 2 days later the club manager said it's a free drop even though not painted out with Gur. I argued as it's still rooted.
Your thoughts please
Andy

Dod you ask him under which rule it would be GUR. As it was brought to his attention I wuld say he shpould be ensuring that a local rule is in place to cover before any competetions take place.

 

[Redandy888]

Dod you ask him under which rule it would be GUR. As it was brought to his attention I wuld say he shpould be ensuring that a local rule is in place to cover before any competetions take place.

There was no local rule.

 

[rulefan]

There was no local rule.

If there was no marking or other signage then it was not GUR.

 

[Redandy888]

If there was no marking or other signage then it was not GUR.

Okay. So no free drop then ?

 

[doublebogey7]

There was no local rule.

Point I was attempting to make was, if the club believe that penalty free relief should be available, then then they need to make it a local rule. Sorry if I didn't make that clear.

 

[Redandy888]

Point I was attempting to make was, if the club believe that penalty free relief should be available, then then they need to make it a local rule. Sorry if I didn't make that clear.

Thanks . So if not a local rule then no free relief

 

[IanMcC]

I was reffing a final at our club and had a similar call to make. (I think I got it right, but may be corrected here.)

The player had hit his ball into the rough. It lay beneath the branches of a fallen tree. It was a very large tree, and had not been moved there by the greenstaff. It was not rooted anymore. Close to the tree, the greenstaff had gathered other pieces of wood. These were almost certainly for collection later, but none of these pieces were hindering the stance or swing of the player. He asked for relief. I refused, on the grounds that the fallen tree was not gathered for later collection. I classed the tree as a loose impediment (although you would have to be one of the Avengers to move it yourself!), and told the player that he could in theory move the tree without moving his ball, but that it was not a relief situation. He wasn't pleased.

 

[Redandy888]

I was reffing a final at our club and had a similar call to make. (I think I got it right, but may be corrected here.)

The player had hit his ball into the rough. It lay beneath the branches of a fallen tree. It was a very large tree, and had not been moved there by the greenstaff. It was not rooted anymore. Close to the tree, the greenstaff had gathered other pieces of wood. These were almost certainly for collection later, but none of these pieces were hindering the stance or swing of the player. He asked for relief. I refused, on the grounds that the fallen tree was not gathered for later collection. I classed the tree as a loose impediment (although you would have to be one of the Avengers to move it yourself!), and told the player that he could in theory move the tree without moving his ball, but that it was not a relief situation. He wasn't pleased.

Wow. Tuff call to make. That's the thing it would have interfered with a full swing but didn't need to add another tree blocking. Thanks for the story

 

[Redandy888]

Pic, a week later with Gur line now

 

[rulefan]

Okay. So no free drop then ?

Correct

 

[Swango1980]

Another one for the Rules of Golf thread.

Always find it interesting the number of club managers / club professionals who will confidently give out rulings, yet actually do not know the rule themselves. I don't even have issue with them not knowing many rules off the top of their head, but would be nice if they actually referenced the rule book to at least back up their call. Or at least caveat what they say by making it clear it is their opinion, but they'll dig deeper when they get the chance.

What the club manager possibly really meant that this specific case ought to be GUR. But, of course, as it had not been marked as such then what it ought to be doesn't really matter when the incident arose.