Damaged and fallen tree

[Colin L]

It really is up to the Rules of Authorities to decide what is a dangerous situation and do not always agree with common sense
e.g. we have a lot of giant hogweed on a couple of holes. I asked the R&A for permission for a LR grant relief for a player who might touch the plant in taking stance or during swing and they said no. (giant hog weed can cause log term skin problems which can last for many years if you get the sap on your skin).

With the likes of plants, no matter how nasty they might be if you touch them, hack at them, get sap on your skin or ingest them, they do not present any danger if you keep clear of them. Animals like crocodiles, fire ants, cobras etc can, on the other hand, actively have a go at you. You can avoid a plant; you don't have to defend yourself against it or run away from it; you just avoid it. The same can't be said of a dangerous animal. That, I'd suggest is the essential difference that the Rule recognises.

 

[Colin L]

Further to the above, it would be wholly impractical to give free relief from a plant just because it was nasty. One of the nearest courses to me in Edinburgh has a huge number of whin bushes. They offer a magnificent display of yellow flowers in the springtime but are very thick, very spikey and, as a result generally impenetrable. You could damage yourself quite badly if you attempted to penetrate them, worse if you fell in them. You can see from this photo just how widespread they are. Imagine hitting a straight ball down the fairway and then watching your opponent blast one deep in to the bushes, knowing that he is going to get free relief.

 

[rulefan]

Further to the above, it would be wholly impractical to give free relief from a plant just because it was nasty. One of the nearest courses to me in Edinburgh has a huge number of whin bushes. They offer a magnificent display of yellow flowers in the springtime but are very thick, very spikey and, as a result generally impenetrable. You could damage yourself quite badly if you attempted to penetrate them, worse if you fell in them. You can see from this photo just how widespread they are. Imagine hitting a straight ball down the fairway and then watching your opponent blast one deep in to the bushes, knowing that he is going to get free relief.

View attachment 57077

For a moment I thought that was a picture taken at Bull Bay in Anglesey

 

[Colin L]

For a moment I thought that was a picture taken at Bull Bay in Anglesey

Whin (or gorse to southerners) is widespread, I expect. The course in the photo is Braid Hills. I don't know if it is still the case but certainly in the past some folk in St Andrews trained their dogs to go in under the whin bushes and retrieve golf balls.

 

[salfordlad]

Whin (or gorse to southerners) is widespread, I expect. The course in the photo is Braid Hills. I don't know if it is still the case but certainly in the past some folk in St Andrews trained their dogs to go in under the whin bushes and retrieve golf balls.

Retrievers?

 

[salfordlad]

Further to the above, it would be wholly impractical to give free relief from a plant just because it was nasty. One of the nearest courses to me in Edinburgh has a huge number of whin bushes. They offer a magnificent display of yellow flowers in the springtime but are very thick, very spikey and, as a result generally impenetrable. You could damage yourself quite badly if you attempted to penetrate them, worse if you fell in them. You can see from this photo just how widespread they are. Imagine hitting a straight ball down the fairway and then watching your opponent blast one deep in to the bushes, knowing that he is going to get free relief.

View attachment 57077

Nature 12, golfers nil.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Whin (or gorse to southerners) is widespread, I expect. The course in the photo is Braid Hills. I don't know if it is still the case but certainly in the past some folk in St Andrews trained their dogs to go in under the whin bushes and retrieve golf balls.

Some wee Scottish boys were very good at crawling under the whin to gather golf balls...

I am personally acquainted with one of them...and he was still doing it well into his 60s - and getting a sherracking off his Mrs for coming home with legs and arms all scratched

 

[jim8flog]

With the likes of plants, no matter how nasty they might be if you touch them, hack at them, get sap on your skin or ingest them, they do not present any danger if you keep clear of them. Animals like crocodiles, fire ants, cobras etc can, on the other hand, actively have a go at you. You can avoid a plant; you don't have to defend yourself against it or run away from it; you just avoid it. The same can't be said of a dangerous animal. That, I'd suggest is the essential difference that the Rule recognises.

The major reason for the request is that a great many players are not botanists. At the time of making the request even the club manager did not know what I was going on about.

One of the real problems is getting people to really understand the problems of the rash from Giant Hog weed - it is not a temporary rash that goes away in a few days it something than can be life changing for many years.

They are on our 9 hole course which gets played by a lot of younger players. Where most of the plants are is in a weir pool (penalty area) where a lot of players tend to overshoot the fairway and will go looking for their ball amongst the plants.

 

[rulefan]

The major reason for the request is that a great many players are not botanists. At the time of making the request even the club manager did not know what I was going on about.

One of the real problems is getting people to really understand the problems of the rash from Giant Hog weed - it is not a temporary rash that goes away in a few days it something than can be life changing for many years.

They are on our 9 hole course which gets played by a lot of younger players. Where most of the plants are is in a weir pool (penalty area) where a lot of players tend to overshoot the fairway and will go looking for their ball amongst the plants.

Could the club not put up 'DANGER NO ENTRY' signs?

 

[jim8flog]

Could the club not put up 'DANGER NO ENTRY' signs?

We have and have posted warnings in our club newsletter. However my experience is that a great many do not read notices.

 

[rulie]

Could the club not put up 'DANGER NO ENTRY' signs?

And further, make it a NO PLAY ZONE.

 

[Colin L]

And further, make it a NO PLAY ZONE.

And get the giant hogweed dealt with. Doesn't the club have a duty of care to its members, visitors and any member of the public walking over the course?
That being said, there's a limit to what can be done to prevent people being wilfully stupid.

 

[rulie]

And get the giant hogweed dealt with. Doesn't the club have a duty of care to its members, visitors and any member of the public walking over the course?
That being said, there's a limit to what can be done to prevent people being wilfully stupid.

I've posted this saying from a famous ice hockey coach previously, "You can't teach fast, and you can't fix stupid."

 

[jim8flog]

And further, make it a NO PLAY ZONE.

That would not stop players going in to the area to look for their ball. It is already a penalty area.

 

[jim8flog]

And get the giant hogweed dealt with. Doesn't the club have a duty of care to its members, visitors and any member of the public walking over the course?
That being said, there's a limit to what can be done to prevent people being wilfully stupid.

I think we have long gone past that.

My biggest annoyance was reporting we have one plant but they let it go to seed before dealing with it. If you have ever seen a plant 'explode' it's seed pods you will understand the problem and it is now all along the river banks and in other 'waste areas'.