The next PM.

[Hobbit]

Labour is a complete mess and I’d rather have the Easter Bunny as PM than Corbyn.
I just find it funny that anyone can blame anybody else than TM and the Tory party for us not leaving on 31st March.
And yes I know it’s a very simplistic view, but that’s were I believe all problems stem from.

I think the electorate, via the recent EU elections, pointed their collective finger at both the Conservatives and Labour. I read a lot of politician biographies, and look forward to reading what some current and recently left Cabinet Ministers have to say about what May has done behind the scenes.

Even with a BRINO deal she couldn't win Parliament over.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

I think the electorate, via the recent EU elections, pointed their collective finger at both the Conservatives and Labour. I read a lot of politician biographies, and look forward to reading what some current and recently left Cabinet Ministers have to say about what May has done behind the scenes.

Even with a BRINO deal she couldn't win Parliament over.

Tbf, the issues started prior to TM, some of the blame goes to DC.

 

[SocketRocket]

Labour is a complete mess and I’d rather have the Easter Bunny as PM than Corbyn.
I just find it funny that anyone can blame anybody else than TM and the Tory party for us not leaving on 31st March.
And yes I know it’s a very simplistic view, but that’s were I believe all problems stem from.

Please read what I posted. I reiterate that I blame Conservatives as well, the blame lies in all parties that have frustrated the Brexit process.

 

[SocketRocket]

I didn't vote Lib Dem in the last EU elections for a start, but I am broadly favourable to their policies ans approach in many areas.

But weirdly enough you can have supported one party in the past but not agree with every policy they have or everything they say. Said many times there are much more pressing concerns this nation has than Brexit, and once we are out they are not going away. So I will vote for a party that I feel will best address them.

If people want to be defined by the party you vote for Brexit policy then go ahead. At least I suppose it will give people something to continue to be angry about when they can no longer get angry about the EU apparently interfering in everything when we are out, and they realise the Brexit party does not have the answers to regional disparities, funding for public services, the environment, loss of need for traditional skills and realignment of the skills needed in work in the 21st century, affordability of property for young people, etc etc. Still, we'll be out of the EU so all will be fine....

You previously proclaimed yourself a LibDem so I simply took you at your word and your preference to frustrate Brexit.

If those frustrating the process would have backed/accepted the referendum result we would now be out of the EU and getting on with other important policies.

 

[SocketRocket]

This thread is becoming another Brexit bun fight. Maybe we should keep it to the Tory Leadership issue.

 

[Old Skier]

This thread is becoming another Brexit bun fight. Maybe we should keep it to the Tory Leadership issue.

Ridiculous amount of candidates and it is going to take to much time. Day after she confirms she's off those standing should prove they have a min of 40 MPs supporting them, the whole thing should take 1 week in parliament and a further final week for party members to come up with the leader.
Politics is turning in to a circus and unfortunately attracting a lot of clowns.

 

[ColchesterFC]

You previously proclaimed yourself a LibDem so I simply took you at your word and your preference to frustrate Brexit.

If those frustrating the process would have backed/accepted the referendum result we would now be out of the EU and getting on with other important policies.

Not sure that blaming the Lib Dems for frustrating Brexit is very fair. We hear from a lot of people that the politicians should be doing what their constituents want. We've had a general election since the referendum and the Lib Dems manifesto (along with the Greens and SNP) was very clear that they were against Brexit and wanted it stopped. MPs from those parties got voted in by people knowing what their policies were and as a result they are sticking to their manifesto promises, or at least that one.

For me the blame has to lay squarely with Conservative and Labour MPs, all of whom stood on manifestos of delivering Brexit, and now are going back on that either by wanting a second referendum or by stopping Brexit totally if at all possible. If they didn't agree with their manifesto promises to deliver Brexit they shouldn't have stood as a Tory or Labour candidate and should have either joined one of the parties wanting to stop it or stood as an independent candidate. But as seems so often the case with our current crop of politicians self interest took over and they were more interested in making sure they got elected/re-elected than about anything else.

 

[ColchesterFC]

Ridiculous amount of candidates and it is going to take to much time. Day after she confirms she's off those standing should prove they have a min of 40 MPs supporting them, the whole thing should take 1 week in parliament and a further final week for party members to come up with the leader.
Politics is turning in to a circus and unfortunately attracting a lot of clowns.

I've no idea why it should take as much time as it is going to take. I know it's a slightly different case, but in Germany the leader of the SPD (coalition partner of Merkel's CDU party) has announced that she will quit as leader on Monday and stand down as head of its parliamentary group on Tuesday. The leadership contest for the new leader to be elected will happen on Tuesday.

They should do the same here, get on with it and just get it done. Why not put all the Tory MPs in a room and anyone that wants to be leader has to stand at the front. The other MPs then go and stand with their choice of leader. The one with the lowest support drops out and any MPs supporting that person then moves to their second preference. The lowest drops out and again the MPs move on to their next choice and this continues until you're left with the two most popular who get put forward to the vote by members.

 

[Old Skier]

I've no idea why it should take as much time as it is going to take. I know it's a slightly different case, but in Germany the leader of the SPD (coalition partner of Merkel's CDU party) has announced that she will quit as leader on Monday and stand down as head of its parliamentary group on Tuesday. The leadership contest for the new leader to be elected will happen on Tuesday.

They should do the same here, get on with it and just get it done. Why not put all the Tory MPs in a room and anyone that wants to be leader has to stand at the front. The other MPs then go and stand with their choice of leader. The one with the lowest support drops out and any MPs supporting that person then moves to their second preference. The lowest drops out and again the MPs move on to their next choice and this continues until you're left with the two most popular who get put forward to the vote by members.

Great idea, then MPs can see who people are siding with.

 

[SocketRocket]

Not sure that blaming the Lib Dems for frustrating Brexit is very fair. We hear from a lot of people that the politicians should be doing what their constituents want. We've had a general election since the referendum and the Lib Dems manifesto (along with the Greens and SNP) was very clear that they were against Brexit and wanted it stopped. MPs from those parties got voted in by people knowing what their policies were and as a result they are sticking to their manifesto promises, or at least that one.

For me the blame has to lay squarely with Conservative and Labour MPs, all of whom stood on manifestos of delivering Brexit, and now are going back on that either by wanting a second referendum or by stopping Brexit totally if at all possible. If they didn't agree with their manifesto promises to deliver Brexit they shouldn't have stood as a Tory or Labour candidate and should have either joined one of the parties wanting to stop it or stood as an independent candidate. But as seems so often the case with our current crop of politicians self interest took over and they were more interested in making sure they got elected/re-elected than about anything else.

I disagree. They may proclaim they are against Brexit but it doesn't negate the referendum result and the democratic responsibility to support the outcome. Why does their name include the word 'Democrats' if they want to pick and choose where that is applied.

 

[Hacker Khan]

I disagree. They may proclaim they are against Brexit but it doesn't negate the referendum result and the democratic responsibility to support the outcome. Why does their name include the word 'Democrats' if they want to pick and choose where that is applied.

They have chuff all influence in parliament as they have chuff all MPs. When the Tories get voted in in a GE you would not expect Labour to 'support the outcome' and suddenly want to privatise the NHS or if Labour get in expecting the Tories to want to nationalise the rail system. So not sure why you are looking to put any blame on a party that ran on a clear manifesto about Brexit and has sod all MPs. Always someones elses fault...

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Ridiculous amount of candidates and it is going to take to much time. Day after she confirms she's off those standing should prove they have a min of 40 MPs supporting them, the whole thing should take 1 week in parliament and a further final week for party members to come up with the leader.
Politics is turning in to a circus and unfortunately attracting a lot of clowns.

IDS said last week that instead of 2 MPs nominating someone for leader it should be 10-12. That would stop most of this nonsense and speed up the process. Sensible suggestion.

 

[Hobbit]

With such a slim majority, aided occasionally by the DUP, and a decent percentage of Tories not in favour of Brexit its difficult to lay blame on any one party. That's the outcome of party politics on the issue.

However, there's 2 sides to that part of the argument. 1) we want them to make the right decision, and maybe that doesn't always mean they do what the electorate voted for. That's representative politics. 2) Over 60% of Tory voters voted for Brexit, 32% of Labour voters voted for Brexit and 20%+ LibDems voted for Brexit. Are the respective MP's/% acting on their constituents wishes?

It all started so well for Leavers. There was a majority of MP's right across Parliament who voted to trigger the referendum. The majority of MP's voted to trigger Article 50. Where did it go wrong? Theresa May. A decision to hold a GE, and she just didn't show up for that election. A deal that just about everyone and their dog said no to, a deal that 3 Brexit ministers didn't agree with.

She even makes Neville Chamberlin look good (to be fair, Chamberlin's domestic policies and time served as a minister was actually very good).

Whoever gets to replace her is inheriting an even worse x-fest than she started with. For me, the only way for any PM to get a working govt out of this is a GE. The alternative is just more of what we've seen for the last 3 years.

 

[Hacker Khan]

With such a slim majority, aided occasionally by the DUP, and a decent percentage of Tories not in favour of Brexit its difficult to lay blame on any one party. That's the outcome of party politics on the issue.

However, there's 2 sides to that part of the argument. 1) we want them to make the right decision, and maybe that doesn't always mean they do what the electorate voted for. That's representative politics. 2) Over 60% of Tory voters voted for Brexit, 32% of Labour voters voted for Brexit and 20%+ LibDems voted for Brexit. Are the respective MP's/% acting on their constituents wishes?

It all started so well for Leavers. There was a majority of MP's right across Parliament who voted to trigger the referendum. The majority of MP's voted to trigger Article 50. Where did it go wrong? Theresa May. A decision to hold a GE, and she just didn't show up for that election. A deal that just about everyone and their dog said no to, a deal that 3 Brexit ministers didn't agree with.

She even makes Neville Chamberlin look good (to be fair, Chamberlin's domestic policies and time served as a minister was actually very good).

Whoever gets to replace her is inheriting an even worse x-fest than she started with. For me, the only way for any PM to get a working govt out of this is a GE. The alternative is just more of what we've seen for the last 3 years.

In which they know they will lose a lot of seats to other parties. So expect the same old same old.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Please read what I posted. I reiterate that I blame Conservatives as well, the blame lies in all parties that have frustrated the Brexit process.

Please read what I replied, I only blame the tories.

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

Please read what I replied, I only blame the tories.

I blame every MP, they should be acting in the best interests of the country not toeing the party line. The country voted to leave, they should ALL be working together to deliver that.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

I blame every MP, they should be acting in the best interests of the country not toeing the party line. The country voted to leave, they should ALL be working together to deliver that.

So we’re back to the old accepting a bad deal.

 

[Hobbit]

So we’re back to the old accepting a bad deal.

Where does he say accept a bad deal?

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Where does he say accept a bad deal?

Because TM didn’t ask for any help until it was too late and then it wasn’t from all parties.
Therefore the only way they could of carried out what he posted was to accept the bad deal.

 

[ColchesterFC]

I blame every MP, they should be acting in the best interests of the country not toeing the party line. The country voted to leave, they should ALL be working together to deliver that.

What if the best interests of the country are to remain in the EU?