The Future of Golf

[jpjeffery]

Oh the only website fault I could really find is they really let themselves down when you click on 'dress code' Had a bit of a laugh at that


edit: I should add that there's a couple of different links to dress code , its the one that's on a pdf with the don't in bright red with ticks and crosses all over it that tickled me and I can see why it would put off many a visitor/potential member. Not so much what they want (although it's not for me) more the way they thought they should present it to the public

I can't find that PDF. Whereabouts did you find it?

 

[Hacker Khan]

I really don't agree with that. Yes, the older members tend to play multiple times a week but the 3 clubs I've been a member at in the last 10 years all have a very large number of younger guys playing on a Saturday or Sunday pretty much every week, weather permitting. To have an AVERAGE age of 63 you would need some very old members playing every week based on the number of younger guys I've seen (I'm talking guys in their 20's to 50's).

And no offence taken

I don't know what the weighting is between weekend golfers and weekday golfers. Logically the majority of people that play in the week are going to be retired (yes I know shift workers can skew that, and when we get long summer evenings that will probably bring down the average age as well, but I am talking on average).

So if the average age of say a weekday golfer is well into the 60s, I'm pretty sure the average age of female golf club members no matter when they play is in the 60s as well. So you will need quite a few under 60 that play every weekend to bring that average age down.

Again this is purely speculation, but I imagine the game is losing more 'younger' members/regular golfers through pressures of time/resources/family etc etc than elderly ones through pressures of being dead. Hence the average age rising.

 

[Tongo]

I've had a good think about this and come up with the following observations:

1.) Golf has not helped itself over the years and there are still clubs that seem unwelcoming, living in the past.
2.) However, surely some of the sport's demise is not helped by the attitude of the beeb, who, despite being a supposedly unbiased broadcaster, seem to publish an article on an almost weekly basis declaring the end is nigh for the sport whilst bigging up its new toy cycling.
3.) A round of golf normally takes somewhere between 3-5 hours. A day of cycling in the TDF normally takes anywhere between 4-7 hours. Over a million people turned out in Yorkshire to watch people whizz past at 60mph or, at best, see a few moment's worth of action whilst waiting for hours. But cycling is portrayed as super cool and funky despite its history being dogged with doping scandals. Everyone assumes that the recent tour winners are clean, but we dont really know. We all assumed Armstrong was clean and look where that ended up.
4.) Bradley Wiggins is portrayed as this super cool portrait star of British cycling despite doing very little since London 2012. In contrast, golf now has Rickie and Rory but the beeb would rather show piccies of a bunch of old men goofily jumping around in plus fours.
5.) Formula 1, the beeb's other favourite along with Football highlights, is almost a closed shop where only 3/4 people have a chance of winning each race. 20 odd cars zoom around mainly dull tracks (most of the interesting ones have been ditched in favour of money making ones) for almost 2 hours with little or no overtaking.
6.) Yet cycling and F1 are deemed as exciting and sexy whilst golf is portrayed as boring and dull. Golf isnt being helped by the poor write-up it continually gets by the beeb, a broadcaster which has all but surrendered its coverage to Sky.
7.) If you keep telling people that a sport is dull and boring, guess what? They believe it! Big up a sport and tell everyone its great and guess what? They believe it! Particularly people that are curious or getting interested in a new sport.

Now these arent the only reasons why golf participation is declining but i firmly believe that the image in the media is not helping.

 

[NimbleNeil]

I'm 17, I was really eager to get into golf last summer but over winter I have realised I'll never really be able to play properly until I am over 25 and in full time employment to afford a membership and regular trips to the range.

The cost is definitely something that keeps most of my friends away; even £20 a round which I think most of you will will agree seems fairly cheap, would have them shaking their heads.

 

[Tongo]

I'm 17, I was really eager to get into golf last summer but over winter I have realised I'll never really be able to play properly until I am over 25 and in full time employment to afford a membership and regular trips to the range.

The cost is definitely something that keeps most of my friends away; even £20 a round which I think most of you will will agree seems fairly cheap, would have them shaking their heads.

With the best will in the world that isnt going to change. Think about the vast acreage used for a golf course and the treatment it requires. The only way you could play for less would be to play 9 hole courses. I cant see how golf can change the fact that an 18 hole course covers a huge area and needs a lot of work, upkeep and maintenance.

 

[Tommo21]

I'm 17, I was really eager to get into golf last summer but over winter I have realised I'll never really be able to play properly until I am over 25 and in full time employment to afford a membership and regular trips to the range.

The cost is definitely something that keeps most of my friends away; even £20 a round which I think most of you will will agree seems fairly cheap, would have them shaking their heads.

Do you mind if I ask...........do you have an I phone, x box, go to football. I'm of the belief that young guys these days have different priorities and golf is not top of the list.

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

I'm 17, I was really eager to get into golf last summer but over winter I have realised I'll never really be able to play properly until I am over 25 and in full time employment to afford a membership and regular trips to the range.

The cost is definitely something that keeps most of my friends away; even £20 a round which I think most of you will will agree seems fairly cheap, would have them shaking their heads.

As a 17 year old, you qualify for junior membership at the majority of clubs. Obviously this varies a lot from club to club but will typically be in the region of £100-200 a year. If you can play most weeks it works out as a VERY cheap pasttime :thup:

 

[NimbleNeil]

I don't actually have an I phone haha but I see your point.
As to Junior memberships, I think it Works out about the same as a gym membership and In accordance to what Tommo said, younger people do have different priorities and things like consoles, gyms memberships, the appeal is a more instant gratification. At the moment my priority is a car, insurance and lessons, all money sinks.
That being said I'm saving up for one this year to make the most of the lowered rates before I turn 25

Another thing that's been pointed out is TV coverage, I've never seen golf on TV in England and had to use some dodgy website to stream the Ryder cup last year, not nice.

 

[Hacker Khan]

I've had a good think about this and come up with the following observations:

1.) Golf has not helped itself over the years and there are still clubs that seem unwelcoming, living in the past.
2.) However, surely some of the sport's demise is not helped by the attitude of the beeb, who, despite being a supposedly unbiased broadcaster, seem to publish an article on an almost weekly basis declaring the end is nigh for the sport whilst bigging up its new toy cycling.
3.) A round of golf normally takes somewhere between 3-5 hours. A day of cycling in the TDF normally takes anywhere between 4-7 hours. Over a million people turned out in Yorkshire to watch people whizz past at 60mph or, at best, see a few moment's worth of action whilst waiting for hours. But cycling is portrayed as super cool and funky despite its history being dogged with doping scandals. Everyone assumes that the recent tour winners are clean, but we dont really know. We all assumed Armstrong was clean and look where that ended up.
4.) Bradley Wiggins is portrayed as this super cool portrait star of British cycling despite doing very little since London 2012. In contrast, golf now has Rickie and Rory but the beeb would rather show piccies of a bunch of old men goofily jumping around in plus fours.
5.) Formula 1, the beeb's other favourite along with Football highlights, is almost a closed shop where only 3/4 people have a chance of winning each race. 20 odd cars zoom around mainly dull tracks (most of the interesting ones have been ditched in favour of money making ones) for almost 2 hours with little or no overtaking.
6.) Yet cycling and F1 are deemed as exciting and sexy whilst golf is portrayed as boring and dull. Golf isnt being helped by the poor write-up it continually gets by the beeb, a broadcaster which has all but surrendered its coverage to Sky.
7.) If you keep telling people that a sport is dull and boring, guess what? They believe it! Big up a sport and tell everyone its great and guess what? They believe it! Particularly people that are curious or getting interested in a new sport.

Now these arent the only reasons why golf participation is declining but i firmly believe that the image in the media is not helping.

I think you are slightly over exaggerating the influence of the BBC web site in this matter. They do cover a lot of golf on their web site other than the offending articles you refer to. And their golf correspondent Ian Carter is very knowledgeable and is not afraid to ask the tricky question when needed. And these articles are just reporting on surveys that companies like the one Bill Elliot quoted from in his article in GM produce. And if such respected voices such as Bill and Mike H, who have a very vested interest in the future of the game being bright, are saying much the same thing as the articles on the Beeb do, do you think they are also to blame for doing the game down?

The BBC did not surrender it's golf coverage but it is unable to compete with Sky. The game, like other sports, decided to take short term financial reward when selling the TV rights at the expense of wider exposure of the game on terrestrial TV. And it looks like the Open is going that way. There is no way the BBC can compete with Sky if it comes down to money. I agree that the BBC coverage of the open is a bit dated at times, especially when Alliss starts wittering on. But then again even with all the bells and whistles Sky bring, 4 day strokeplay championships are a dull TV spectacle. And there is an argument to say that golf on the radio is sometimes better, and Radio 5 do a fine job of that.

As for cycling then it is a sport on the rise. We have excelled at the last 2 Olympics, we have had British success at the TDF, barriers to entry are virtually none and so the sport is now seen as being cool. Plus the BBC do not have the TDF coverage anyway, they mostly cover track championships. And when it comes to drug taking then I'm not sure golf can have the moral high ground. How extensive is golf's drug taking regime? What do they do when someone is caught? Hello Mr Brush, meet Mr Carpet and please sweep away...

And as for the comparison with F1 then for all Bernie's fault's, and he has got many, he stipulated that some races have to be on terrestrial TV as he knows that brings exposure. The races are seen as glamorous, there are famous people there, supermodels, champagne is sprayed around, you get the pit walks just before the race, it has an air of glamour and excitement. Where as at the The Open, the one major tournament on terrestrial TV what do we get? The self inflicted bad publicity over some host clubs not allowing women members which overshadows everything else and like it or not, is not going away. Then along comes Sir Blazered Plumy Tones and his anonymous blazered munchkins giving a deathly boring rambling speech. Ever year.

Again golf needs to look at itself and what kind of image it is portraying, not blaming the BBC.

 

[Tongo]

I think you are slightly over exaggerating the influence of the BBC web site in this matter. They do cover a lot of golf on their web site other than the offending articles you refer to. And their golf correspondent Ian Carter is very knowledgeable and is not afraid to ask the tricky question when needed. And these articles are just reporting on surveys that companies like the one Bill Elliot quoted from in his article in GM produce. And if such respected voices such as Bill and Mike H, who have a very vested interest in the future of the game being bright, are saying much the same thing as the articles on the Beeb do, do you think they are also to blame for doing the game down?

The BBC did not surrender it's golf coverage but it is unable to compete with Sky. The game, like other sports, decided to take short term financial reward when selling the TV rights at the expense of wider exposure of the game on terrestrial TV. And it looks like the Open is going that way. There is no way the BBC can compete with Sky if it comes down to money. I agree that the BBC coverage of the open is a bit dated at times, especially when Alliss starts wittering on. But then again even with all the bells and whistles Sky bring, 4 day strokeplay championships are a dull TV spectacle. And there is an argument to say that golf on the radio is sometimes better, and Radio 5 do a fine job of that.

As for cycling then it is a sport on the rise. We have excelled at the last 2 Olympics, we have had British success at the TDF, barriers to entry are virtually none and so the sport is now seen as being cool. Plus the BBC do not have the TDF coverage anyway, they mostly cover track championships. And when it comes to drug taking then I'm not sure golf can have the moral high ground. How extensive is golf's drug taking regime? What do they do when someone is caught? Hello Mr Brush, meet Mr Carpet and please sweep away...

And as for the comparison with F1 then for all Bernie's fault's, and he has got many, he stipulated that some races have to be on terrestrial TV as he knows that brings exposure. The races are seen as glamorous, there are famous people there, supermodels, champagne is sprayed around, you get the pit walks just before the race, it has an air of glamour and excitement. Where as at the The Open, the one major tournament on terrestrial TV what do we get? The self inflicted bad publicity over some host clubs not allowing women members which overshadows everything else and like it or not, is not going away. Then along comes Sir Blazered Plumy Tones and his anonymous blazered munchkins giving a deathly boring rambling speech. Ever year.

Again golf needs to look at itself and what kind of image it is portraying, not blaming the BBC.

I didnt say golf was perfect and that it didnt need to change. What i was trying to say, in a nutshell, is that if people who are potentially interested in the sport keep on reading that its dull and boring then they are probably not likely to have a go are they?

 

[Hacker Khan]

I didnt say golf was perfect and that it didnt need to change. What i was trying to say, in a nutshell, is that if people who are potentially interested in the sport keep on reading that its dull and boring then they are probably not likely to have a go are they?

Well unfortunately in the eyes of most young people it is dull and boring, the game has mostly done that to itself and it's not the fault of the messenger really.

 

[Slab]

Well unfortunately in the eyes of most young people it is dull and boring, the game has mostly done that to itself and it's not the fault of the messenger really.

I'm sure it must seem dull etc to many but not sure they'd be the ones take it up anyway, probably those on the fringe of interest or indifferent are more suitable 'targets'

If its about the message than I see TV coverage as a +/- contributor to golfs image as well as onsite atmosphere/welcome at the clubhouse and obviously websites are often amateur nonsense that'll alienate the younger generation (maybe the R&A should mandate this area or issue a website charter for clubs to follow)

But I guess if the wont follow guidance on LR's there's no chance of getting them to have a credible online presence

 

[MendieGK]

As a 17 year old, you qualify for junior membership at the majority of clubs. Obviously this varies a lot from club to club but will typically be in the region of £100-200 a year. If you can play most weeks it works out as a VERY cheap pasttime :thup:

This!

 

[Hacker Khan]

I'm sure it must seem dull etc to many but not sure they'd be the ones take it up anyway, probably those on the fringe of interest or indifferent are more suitable 'targets'

If its about the message than I see TV coverage as a +/- contributor to golfs image as well as onsite atmosphere/welcome at the clubhouse and obviously websites are often amateur nonsense that'll alienate the younger generation (maybe the R&A should mandate this area or issue a website charter for clubs to follow)

But I guess if the wont follow guidance on LR's there's no chance of getting them to have a credible online presence

I think there should be a concerted top to bottom planned approach to increase participation and awareness of the game by the R&A and USGA. So they look at everything from the pro tours down to the getting primary school children interested in the game. And have a coordinated approach. There are a lot of very good initiatives going on (things like Topgolf, cheap youth coaching lessons etc etc) and golf does have people that the younger generation will latch onto (look at Bubba's Facebook account for example, he's making golf fun, Rory and Rickie are people that will attract new people into the game). Hell, the R&A could even have a template/advice on how to word dress codes so they don't all look like they have been written by some octogenarian whose main objective seems to weed out as many people as they can, reward the clubs that are increasing participation at all ages, give them grants that focus on this etc etc.

There are many clever people within the game that have the knowledge to do this, but unfortunately it often seems that these are not the people that are making the big decisions (or not making decision as the case may be), and I am increasingly thinking they are not fit for purpose to ensure the healthy future of the game. But I feel unless these are all part of a coordinated 'master plan' that all of the many golfing associations buy into, then the piece meal approach will only have limited, if any success.

 

[Slab]

I think there should be a concerted top to bottom planned approach to increase participation and awareness of the game by the R&A and USGA. So they look at everything from the pro tours down to the getting primary school children interested in the game. And have a coordinated approach. There are a lot of very good initiatives going on (things like Topgolf, cheap youth coaching lessons etc etc) and golf does have people that the younger generation will latch onto (look at Bubba's Facebook account for example, he's making golf fun, Rory and Rickie are people that will attract new people into the game). Hell, the R&A could even have a template/advice on how to word dress codes so they don't all look like they have been written by some octogenarian whose main objective seems to weed out as many people as they can, reward the clubs that are increasing participation at all ages, give them grants that focus on this etc etc.

There are many clever people within the game that have the knowledge to do this, but unfortunately it often seems that these are not the people that are making the big decisions (or not making decision as the case may be), and I am increasingly thinking they are not fit for purpose to ensure the healthy future of the game. But I feel unless these are all part of a coordinated 'master plan' that all of the many golfing associations buy into, then the piece meal approach will only have limited, if any success.

Good post, cant really disagree with any of that

I guess a lot of clubs look at themselves and see that they've had a centenary etc etc and maybe believe that if its lasted a hundred years it should last a hundred more, but as we know that simply isn't true

I suppose natural selection will sort out which do but its not really natural if 'man' is the one preventing/promoting development and change

 

[evahakool]

Thats awesome! And great to see a big company backing it! I would go one stage further though and take it to the people, the parents still probably have pre-defined opinions on taking their kids to a golf club (maybe less so in Scotland, where in my Southern Softie opinion, golf has less of a snobbery reputation in Scotland say than surrey). Get it at the local village hall, secondary school sports hall etc..

Clubgolf is a brilliant initiative in Scotland ,I along with ten other members are trained junior coaches, we have just started coaching at our local leisure centre,we have nets in the sqaush courts with classes for primary and secondary classes,all at a minimum cost, when the weather improves we will take them to our club where we have a 6 hole short course for them.
This must be the forward for youngsters to get a interested in golf, not all will go on to play golf but at least it gives them a chance, I think clubs will always struggle to get youngsters playing from the age range of say 16 to 30, there are just to many more exiting things for them to do than play golf.

But if they get a interest in golf from a early age hopefully many will return to golf when they are older.

 

[louise_a]

We have very few juniors at our club, what I cannot understand why existing members do not seem to try and get their own kids into golf. Probably because we do not seem to offer incentives to get them involved.
Something needs to change.

 

[Rooter]

But if they get a interest in golf from a early age hopefully many will return to golf when they are older.

THIS!! And not just return when older. keep playing through their teens etc etc

I think the focus is finding the next Rory, when in reality, the next Rory will happen regardless, What is needed is kids enjoying the game. it is that simple

 

[Tongo]

Well unfortunately in the eyes of most young people it is dull and boring, the game has mostly done that to itself and it's not the fault of the messenger really.

Cycling was also seen as dull and boring and a continental sport a few years ago and it also wasnt helping itself with plenty of drug scandals. Then Britain became successful and everyone banged on about how great it is and now look.

Now if only Britain / the UK could find some major champions.......(and some positive influence from the media)

 

[GB72]

Golf was always in my mind as something to play partly because when I was a kid I was allowed to walk the course with my dad and grandad when they played. This is going back to the 1970's when my dad and grandad would play a 2 ball round Beaconsfield and my brother and I would walk around with them. Not quite so sure that many clubs or, indeed, golfers would be willing to accept well behaved kids walking around the course but it was this sort of access to the sport which gave me an initial interest in playing in later life. It also solved the problem of parents not having time to play due to children.