The Footie Thread

[Swango1980]

Seriously! Just stop, Mainoo is a fantastic talent, everbody agrees, fans of all Clubs!

The questioning is whether the timing is right to be called up to the squad!

It is, in my opinion.

But, I've no doubt that if he gets a chance to play, and has a dodgy game, there will be plenty of England fans delighted, and want to tell everyone else "I told you so". Probably why playing for England can be such a poisoned chalice for many young players. Club bias tends to bring out the negativity from England fans, rather than positivity

What! 2 different opinions on the Mainoo situation from Utd Fans

Indeed. Which proves the point that all Man Utd fans don't have exactly the same thoughts, as some would like to believe

 

[PaulMdj]

To be fair, that was balanced with a list including several names who are perhaps not at the same level as Mainoo. I think it may have been that one post which fuelled the disagreement, but we’ve moved on.

Anyway, if the course has dried out I’m off for a few holes now. By the time I return I’m hoping Mainoo will have been named the new England captain

Never before Hendo!

 

[Bdill93]

It is, in my opinion.

But, I've no doubt that if he gets a chance to play, and has a dodgy game, there will be plenty of England fans delighted, and want to tell everyone else "I told you so". Probably why playing for England can be such a poisoned chalice for many young players. Club bias tends to bring out the negativity from England fans, rather than positivity

Indeed. Which proves the point that all Man Utd fans don't have exactly the same thoughts, as some would like to believe

Id never take delight in an England player playing poorly, I want to win every game bar none.

 

[Billysboots]

I'd disagree with that. If that was the case, they'd have picked him in the first place.

And, if Mainoo had any desire to play for Ghana, I'm not sure he'd be stupid enough to say Yes to England in a friendly match without thinking of the implications of not being able to play for Ghana. And, if he wants to play for England, even if he wasn't selected in this squad, I seriously don't believe he'd go in a sulk and immediately request to get a call up for Ghana. He has played for England at U17, U18 and U19 level, so I suspect he sees himself as English. If he wasn;t called up for England at the age of 24/25, then maybe Ghana would become a more interesting option for him.

Something must have happened to trigger GS adding Mainoo to the squad after it had been announced.

I do wonder if Ghana have made an approach to call him up and that has been communicated to the FA.

I love a good conspiracy theory, me.

 

[Swango1980]

Manchester United co-owner Sir Jim Ratcliffe has made England manager Gareth Southgate his top choice to replace Erik ten Hag in the summer, and would like a decision from the 53-year-old sooner rather than later. (Star)



And that has just made my day.

I think this is simply a great example of "journalists" being less bothered by truth, and more interested in sensational click bait.

Ratcliffe had just said in an interview "It’d be good for Arteta, actually, I think it would be good for him because he’s done really well there and Arsenal have been patient with him, which is nice as well"

So, it would be a bit ironic if Ratcliffe praises Arteta and the patience Arsenal have shown in him, and then give ETH the boot to bring in Southgate, who doesn't exactly have fans on board, even many England fans.

 

[Billysboots]

I think this is simply a great example of "journalists" being less bothered by truth, and more interested in sensational click bait.

Ratcliffe had just said in an interview "It’d be good for Arteta, actually, I think it would be good for him because he’s done really well there and Arsenal have been patient with him, which is nice as well"

So, it would be a bit ironic if Ratcliffe praises Arteta and the patience Arsenal have shown in him, and then give ETH the boot to bring in Southgate, who doesn't exactly have fans on board, even many England fans.

I’m quite sure it’s press and media mischief making. If Ratcliffe is the life long United fan we are told he is, and understands the club, he won’t go anywhere near a manager with zero club management pedigree, and who approaches the game as Southgate does.

Anyway, golf now.

 

[Bdill93]

Just watched the ref breakdown of the disallowed Bowen goal at the weekend - good to see it was the right decision and actually the 5 and a half minute review was needed to check it, very complex situation.

 

[Orikoru]

Any 3 of:

Henderson
Rice
Bellingham
Maddison
Ward-Prowse
Barkley
Gallagher
Palmer
Jones
Gibbs White
Elliot

Shall I continue or??

Every player named above has proved their place far more than Mainoo whos doing alright for a 6th place team.

Players he can start over:

Phillips

And I've not even named a Villa player just for fun, I'm not biased, I want the best options available and as of yet, he is not one.

I'm not sure that list is particularly relevant for the most part. Aren't we talking about a proper holding or box-to-box midfielder to play in a two with Rice here? So that's not going to be Maddison, or Barkley, or Palmer, or Gibbs-White, or Elliott who are all attacking midfielders. I think the reason Henderson and Phillips have been getting a look-in for so long is the lack of other defensive options. Ward-Prowse is probably the next best option - Gallagher might be able to although I think he has more attacking tendencies, and I saw recently he has committed by far the most fouls in the league so it doesn't say much for his tackling ability.

I can't advocate for or against Mainoo because I've never seen him play, but I think there are fewer options in this position than you make out. Against poorer teams we'd love to see Bellingham back alongside Rice with license to push forward, and someone like Maddison ahead of them, but we know that Southgate is allergic to that level of forward-thinking.

 

[Bdill93]

I'm not sure that list is particularly relevant for the most part. Aren't we talking about a proper holding or box-to-box midfielder to play in a two with Rice here? So that's not going to be Maddison, or Barkley, or Palmer, or Gibbs-White, or Elliott who are all attacking midfielders. I think the reason Henderson and Phillips have been getting a look-in for so long is the lack of other defensive options. Ward-Prowse is probably the next best option - Gallagher might be able to although I think he has more attacking tendencies, and I saw recently he has committed by far the most fouls in the league so it doesn't say much for his tackling ability.

I can't advocate for or against Mainoo because I've never seen him play, but I think there are fewer options in this position than you make out. Against poorer teams we'd love to see Bellingham back alongside Rice with license to push forward, and someone like Maddison ahead of them, but we know that Southgate is allergic to that level of forward-thinking.

Yes like for like there arent many options, but the whole nation bar one man - the manager - doesn't want England to play 2 holders, we do not need to. Therefore his selection is over that of any of my named players - we would be removing those talented options for a second holding midfield player when we already have a top 5 in the world holding player.

 

[Orikoru]

Yes like for like there arent many options, but the whole nation bar one man - the manager - doesn't want England to play 2 holders, we do not need to. Therefore his selection is over that of any of my named players - we would be removing those talented options for a second holding midfield player when we already have a top 5 in the world holding player.

We can say this until we're blue in the face, Southgate ain't changing for no one.

Personally I'm more in agreement with those saying he'll get minimal minutes and it's largely to stop him declaring for Ghana. Euro 2024 will be too soon for him, but if he has a little experience of the England camp he can be an important player come World Cup 26. (Probably subbing on for a 36 year old Henderson in the 75th minute.)

 

[Swango1980]

Yes like for like there arent many options, but the whole nation bar one man - the manager - doesn't want England to play 2 holders, we do not need to. Therefore his selection is over that of any of my named players - we would be removing those talented options for a second holding midfield player when we already have a top 5 in the world holding player.

Is it not a bit arrogant to say England don't need to play 2 holders at all. Would it not be a reasonable idea if up against a very good, attacking side. If England played France in final, would fans just want England to play all out attack?

Not saying the 2 holders need to play within a very negative system. If one or 2 of those holders also had attacking qualities, then it surely would give England a better balance, where thet can attack and defend in equal measure as the game progresses.

 

[AmandaJR]

Boo. I've rather enjoyed not having 3 pages of "debate" to catch up on after being off the forum for a few hours...

 

[Bdill93]

Is it not a bit arrogant to say England don't need to play 2 holders at all. Would it not be a reasonable idea if up against a very good, attacking side. If England played France in final, would fans just want England to play all out attack?

Not saying the 2 holders need to play within a very negative system. If one or 2 of those holders also had attacking qualities, then it surely would give England a better balance, where thet can attack and defend in equal measure as the game progresses.

Not at all. We have one of the best teams in the world and we should play like it. Going defensive hasn't won us anything.

We all agree we lack depth at CDM and CB so why on earth would we play more defensively when we have about 10 top class CAMS and Wingers and the second best striker on the planet?

 

[Swango1980]

Not at all. We have one of the best teams in the world and we should play like it. Going defensive hasn't won us anything.

We all agree we lack depth at CDM and CB so why on earth would we play more defensively when we have about 10 top class CAMS and Wingers and the second best striker on the planet?

The best teams in the world can adapt depending on who they play. I know that when Utd were the best side in the 90's and 00's, we didn't just play out and out attack in every game. There were many games, against tougher opponents, that they played more defensive. Not to say negative, just looked to absorb more pressure and then look to hurt the opposition on transition.

Rice isn't just a defensive midfielder. He is probably a better attacking midfielder than many top players that only play that role to be fair. So, England could still play Rice and another so called DM player, be defensively sound against a side like France and still be excellent in attack with Rice pushing up, Bellingham, Kane, Saka and Foden.

P.S. I personally think Kane is the best striker in the world. I think he is pretty much top class in every attribute you'd want from a forward.

 

[Deleted member 29109]

who was the last team to win a major international tournament playing all out attack football?

I seem to remember most winning teams did so playing solid defence football and conserving energy where possible.

 

[Bdill93]

who was the last team to win a major international tournament playing all out attack football?

I seem to remember most winning teams did so playing solid defence football and conserving energy where possible.

All out attacked would be no holders though. Rice holding is enough. Just like Busquets holding was enough for Spain or Kante for France. Not many of those sides played 2.

In totally unrelated news I just read Isak linked to Arsenal for the first time... now that could be very interesting!

 

[Swango1980]

who was the last team to win a major international tournament playing all out attack football?

I seem to remember most winning teams did so playing solid defence football and conserving energy where possible.

Perhaps one of the Brazil sides? I agree though, most of the winning teams seem to be excellent all rounders. Win some games easily, are resolute in some tough and tight games.

If England decided to just go heavy attack in all games, I'd be concerned they'd get a bloody nose as soon as they come across a tough opponent.

Conversely, if they are too negative and defensive, they not be able to take a tough game by the scruff of the neck, and lose to a single goal at they've no attacking momentum themselves.

It's why it is interesting to see how Rice is playing at Arsenal. As he seems to be capable of both roles, and it wouldn't require subs to change the midfield. Just Rice moving backwards or forwards depending on how game is going. Not that I've watched Rice that closely every game, but by all accounts it seems that is how he is playing

 

[fundy]

All out attacked would be no holders though. Rice holding is enough. Just like Busquets holding was enough for Spain or Kante for France. Not many of those sides played 2.

In totally unrelated news I just read Isak linked to Arsenal for the first time... now that could be very interesting!

Been linked on and off since before he signed for Newcastle and rumour hasnt gone away the last couple of seasons. Add it to rumours of Toney, Sesko, Osimhen, Gyokeres, Boniface, Ferguson and plenty of others...........

 

[Swango1980]

All out attacked would be no holders though. Rice holding is enough. Just like Busquets holding was enough for Spain or Kante for France. Not many of those sides played 2.

In totally unrelated news I just read Isak linked to Arsenal for the first time... now that could be very interesting!

I assumed Toney would be their No. 1 target

 

[Lord Tyrion]

They really want to be buying Calvert-Lewin for a bargain £45m. You heard it here first

(rumours all have to start somewhere)