The Footie Thread

[Orikoru]

Let them crack on. It's not like it was a surprise this summer.

Fill the big CB shaped hole in the squad, make some room in the squad for potential further signings and then look to fill those holes. As it stands we have no room in the squad for non-homegrown players, so the likes of Origi and Shaqiri were always going to be in the shop window. If those 2 leave, we might get a forward in. If they don't, we won't. it's super simple.

Apparently renewing contracts for Trent, Fabinho and Alisson doesn't count as "money the club spends" either... Even though there's probably another £200k pw+ the club wasn't spending last year!

To be honest there isn't much wrong with the squad, obviously last year the problem was having to play your midfield in defence. But with Van Dijk back and Konate coming in, that problem should be more-or-less solved. Wijnaldum is gone, but who knows, maybe Oxlade can stay fit for once and plug that gap. I guess the only worry is that Lukaku joining Chelsea improves them a huge amount.

 

[ger147]

To be honest there isn't much wrong with the squad, obviously last year the problem was having to play your midfield in defence. But with Van Dijk back and Konate coming in, that problem should be more-or-less solved. Wijnaldum is back, but who knows, maybe Oxlade can stay fit for once and plug that gap. I guess the only worry is that Lukaku joining Chelsea improves them a huge amount.

Wijnaldum has gone, he has joined PSG.

 

[Kellfire]

Wijnaldum has gone, he has joined PSG.

I think he knows judging by what he said next.

 

[Orikoru]

Wijnaldum has gone, he has joined PSG.

Yeah that's what I meant, hence the rest of that sentence. I had a few things arse-about-face in that post actually, but I knew what I meant.

 

[Deleted member 18588]

That is a bit young to be playing with seasoned pros.
Good luck to him though.
Hope he gets on and scores the winner ,that is really something to remember.

The older Bellingham was only 16 yrs 1 month when he made his debut.

Trevor Francis was getting on and was 16 yrs 4m when he first appeared. Mind you he was nearly 17 before he scored 4 goals in a game against Bolton.

If they are good enough then they are old enough.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Let them crack on. It's not like it was a surprise this summer.

Fill the big CB shaped hole in the squad, make some room in the squad for potential further signings and then look to fill those holes. As it stands we have no room in the squad for non-homegrown players, so the likes of Origi and Shaqiri were always going to be in the shop window. If those 2 leave, we might get a forward in. If they don't, we won't. it's super simple.

Apparently renewing contracts for Trent, Fabinho and Alisson doesn't count as "money the club spends" either... Even though there's probably another £200k pw+ the club wasn't spending last year!

I’m happy to see us being written off by many - will make winning all the more sweeter ?

Having a full fit squad is huge and even more so when they have all had a good rest and a proper pre season , a lot of players look very sharp at the moment

I think one more signing would be good but it’s not essential

 

[4LEX]

Liverpool need a new dimension upfront, the attack has become very predictable. We saw how much Jota improved it early on last season before getting injured. Kane up top with the service from the full backs and wingers would make them very tough to stop. It does strike you that they've got complacent and recent transfers have been budget ones and more miss than hit.

Season depends on Jota/Firmino getting 40 goals between them and Thiago to be vastly better.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Liverpool need a new dimension upfront, the attack has become very predictable. We saw how much Jota improved it early on last season before getting injured. Kane up top with the service from the full backs and wingers would make them very tough to stop. It does strike you that they've got complacent and recent transfers have been budget ones and more miss than hit.

Season depends on Jota/Firmino getting 40 goals between them and Thiago to be vastly better.

Which transfers are you talking about ?‍

 

[Orikoru]

Liverpool need a new dimension upfront, the attack has become very predictable. We saw how much Jota improved it early on last season before getting injured. Kane up top with the service from the full backs and wingers would make them very tough to stop. It does strike you that they've got complacent and recent transfers have been budget ones and more miss than hit.

Season depends on Jota/Firmino getting 40 goals between them and Thiago to be vastly better.

Does it? Firmino only got 9 when they won the league? Probably more dependant on a return to form for Mané.

 

[4LEX]

Which transfers are you talking about ?‍

Thiago
Minamino
Tsimikas
Davies

Budget signings and haven't added anything. You won the CL and the title then the spending has dried up. Would you be a better team with Kane or Lukaku upfront?

 

[4LEX]

Does it? Firmino only got 9 when they won the league? Probably more dependant on a return to form for Mané.

You could also argue both of those players are on a downward trend, along with Firmino. Grealish on the left for Liverpool would be far more effective there at at City. Shake things up, add a new dimension. Ditto Sancho on the right.

Liverpool are a great team with a great manager, however the facts are the big spending has stopped and they should be investing more if they don't want to be left behind. Man Utd have a better first eleven and squad now, it's just the manager that is the difference. Theres a lot of pressure on VVD to fix everything, however as we've seen from the injury to Robertson, injuries can't be accounted for and the depth isn't really there.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Thiago
Minamino
Tsimikas
Davies

Budget signings and haven't added anything. You won the CL and the title then the spending has dried up. Would you be a better team with Kane or Lukaku upfront?

Tsimikas was bought as back up to Robbo who plays every week - he will now start with Robbo out injured

Thiago was out injured for significant period last season but came back in towards the end and show his class

Davies hasn’t played yet

Minamino is prob the one who is still unknown but clearly needed to take time to get used to the Prem -

Just a touch early to be writing them off especially with last seasons issues

As for Lukaku and Kane - Lukaku is not the sort of player the manager would look at , and potentially not Kane as well.

We don’t work with a “goalscoring 9” - the reason Salah and Mane both so well is because of the way Firmino plays - bring in a “no 9” would impact their affect within the team

You could also argue both of those players are on a downward trend, along with Firmino. Grealish on the left for Liverpool would be far more effective there at at City. Shake things up, add a new dimension. Ditto Sancho on the right.

Liverpool are a great team with a great manager, however the facts are the big spending has stopped and they should be investing more if they don't want to be left behind. Man Utd have a better first eleven and squad now, it's just the manager that is the difference. Theres a lot of pressure on VVD to fix everything, however as we've seen from the injury to Robertson, injuries can't be accounted for and the depth isn't really there.

Downward trend ?‍ Based on what ? One injury hit season?

Liverpool aren’t a “big spending club” unless players leave for big money - and sorry but Man Utd first 11 is not better than Liverpool’s - even without a significant amount of first choice players UTD get a bit of a thumping towards the end of last a season

The back 5 and prob midfield is far better than Utd’s and even the front 3 - fully fit and in form there isn’t many if any utd players who imo would get into Liverpool’s first 11

 

[Orikoru]

You could also argue both of those players are on a downward trend, along with Firmino. Grealish on the left for Liverpool would be far more effective there at at City. Shake things up, add a new dimension. Ditto Sancho on the right.

Liverpool are a great team with a great manager, however the facts are the big spending has stopped and they should be investing more if they don't want to be left behind. Man Utd have a better first eleven and squad now, it's just the manager that is the difference. Theres a lot of pressure on VVD to fix everything, however as we've seen from the injury to Robertson, injuries can't be accounted for and the depth isn't really there.

I found this an interesting comment in bold so I want to analyse it.

De Gea < Alisson
Wan-Bissaka < Trent
Shaw = Robertson
Varane < Van Dijk
Maguire > Konate/Gomez
McTominay < Fabinho
Pogba > Henderson
Bruno F > Thiago
Rashford < Mane
Cavani > Firmino
Sancho < Salah

Ok they're not like for like and the line-up is changeable, but I certainly wouldn't say United's first 11 was better. I have it 6-4 in favour of Liverpool with one tie. You could say Varane - Van Dijk should be a tie though, maybe.

 

[AmandaJR]

 

[Deleted member 15344]

I found this an interesting comment in bold so I want to analyse it.

De Gea < Alisson
Wan-Bissaka < Trent
Shaw = Robertson
Varane < Van Dijk
Maguire > Konate/Gomez
McTominay < Fabinho
Pogba > Henderson
Bruno F > Thiago
Rashford < Mane
Cavani > Firmino
Sancho < Salah

Ok they're not like for like and the line-up is changeable, but I certainly wouldn't say United's first 11 was better. I have it 6-4 in favour of Liverpool with one tie. You could say Varane - Van Dijk should be a tie though, maybe.

I certainly wouldn’t take Maguire over Gomez - Gomez has the one thing that Maguire gets exposed against - Pace.

And Shaw equal to Robertson - no chance for me

If going by ability Pogba is better than Henderson but he hasn’t applied it in the Prem

Cavani and Firmino just aren’t like for like and in the set up we have then it’s Firmino- but Cavani 6 years ago would be superb
Fernandes is one player but he is another that I don’t think suits the set up

 

[harpo_72]

I found this an interesting comment in bold so I want to analyse it.

De Gea < Alisson
Wan-Bissaka < Trent
Shaw = Robertson
Varane < Van Dijk
Maguire > Konate/Gomez
McTominay < Fabinho
Pogba > Henderson
Bruno F > Thiago
Rashford < Mane
Cavani > Firmino
Sancho < Salah

Ok they're not like for like and the line-up is changeable, but I certainly wouldn't say United's first 11 was better. I have it 6-4 in favour of Liverpool with one tie. You could say Varane - Van Dijk should be a tie though, maybe.

Interesting do you think shaw and Robertson are equal? They are both good though.
But it does show what weaknesses both teams have .. would be interesting to go further and look at how many different team shapes those 11 could comfortably play. I would argue that Pogba is pretty much mono dimensional and would sacrifice him on selection for midfielder that can play defensively and offensively… I know that’s a controversial statement but I see him as an occasional performer who lacks motivation

 

[clubchamp98]

The older Bellingham was only 16 yrs 1 month when he made his debut.

Trevor Francis was getting on and was 16 yrs 4m when he first appeared. Mind you he was nearly 17 before he scored 4 goals in a game against Bolton.

If they are good enough then they are old enough.

Yes totally agree.
I was just thinking about when I was 15/16 I played against Grown men
I was like a child against a grown man .
But young men are more prepared these days.
Did he get on , how did he do. ?

 

[4LEX]

Tsimikas was bought as back up to Robbo who plays every week - he will now start with Robbo out injured

Thiago was out injured for significant period last season but came back in towards the end and show his class

Davies hasn’t played yet

Minamino is prob the one who is still unknown but clearly needed to take time to get used to the Prem -

Just a touch early to be writing them off especially with last seasons issues

As for Lukaku and Kane - Lukaku is not the sort of player the manager would look at , and potentially not Kane as well.

We don’t work with a “goalscoring 9” - the reason Salah and Mane both so well is because of the way Firmino plays - bring in a “no 9” would impact their affect within the team


Downward trend ?‍ Based on what ? One injury hit season?

Liverpool aren’t a “big spending club” unless players leave for big money - and sorry but Man Utd first 11 is not better than Liverpool’s - even without a significant amount of first choice players UTD get a bit of a thumping towards the end of last a season

The back 5 and prob midfield is far better than Utd’s and even the front 3 - fully fit and in form there isn’t many if any utd players who imo would get into Liverpool’s first 11

I get that but the fact is since 2018 you've not bought a really big name player. You say Klopp isn't about big names but Allison and VVD made the difference. Both big names and huge transfer fees.

I think both strikers would fit and be a huge improvement. Lukaku isn't a targetman and plays better with balls infront, ideal with your full backs and inverted wingers cutting in playing balls into the channel. Kane isn't a number 9 either, he's basically a cross between Firmino and Lukaku. Better at linking play, faster, stronger, better finisher and can head. The owners have tied Klopps hands and stopped the money coming in.

With no injuries and everything going well you can definitelty win the title or the CL. My argument is with more investment you'd be a better bet.

I think Utd have a better defence, midfield again too. Although slightly unbalanced given Pogba and Bruno with no DM. I think a lot of people will be shocked at how good Sancho is. Rashford has been injured for 2 years and still delivering better stats than Sane on the left (last season). Back fit after the op and it's a game changer. Utd's main weakness is upfront - relying on a near 35 year old to lead the line and back up who isn't good enough. I'd put Liverpool above Utd due to the manager quality though.

 

[clubchamp98]

View attachment 37964

Not many of them would get in Liverpool’s team either
I would have KDB though.

 

[Orikoru]

I certainly wouldn’t take Maguire over Gomez - Gomez has the one thing that Maguire gets exposed against - Pace.

And Shaw equal to Robertson - no chance for me

If going by ability Pogba is better than Henderson but he hasn’t applied it in the Prem

Cavani and Firmino just aren’t like for like and in the set up we have then it’s Firmino- but Cavani 6 years ago would be superb
Fernandes is one player but he is another that I don’t think suits the set up

So I ruled in favour of Liverpool but that wasn't good enough for you, you literally picked apart all my Man Utd picks. Classic.

Before the Euros I'd have said Robertson, but Shaw was so good there he went up in my estimation. I still think Cavani is world class because of his movement and a better player than Firmino.