The Footie Thread

[GB72]

As I have said many a time, my knowledge of football is pretty minimal but I follow the news. I suppose the only thing that intrigues me is whether this deal is better for the clubs below the top 2 divisions. If there is 25% of the premiership revenue being split between all of the divisions, would the be a benefit and an increase in revenue for those clubs lower down the system. Those clubs, and their supporters I guess, would have little concern about what is going on in the upper echelons of the premiership when compared with just having the income to stay afloat.

 

[Liverbirdie]

Have heard today that part of the proposal would retrospectively give Spurs a refund on some of their stadium costs, and also part fund a new one for Liverpool. If true, this is a disgrace. You should always have to fund your own home.

Totally agree.

 

[Liverbirdie]

This sums up how I feel about it; it isn't the right direction for English football to go in.

Removing parachute payments makes the financial risk required of Championship teams being promoted even greater than it already is. A smaller league will make staying in the league even harder.

The playoff system of having 16th place join the championship sides vying for promotion is just giving an advantage to a premier league side. The playoffs are more than entertaining enough without introducing another team to them which has the benefit of premier league millions for at least a season giving them an unfair advantage. West Ham finished 16th last season, I'm sure we can all agree that West Ham would have demolished Fulham and avoided relegation.

Although the PL would be giving more money to the football league, it would be making the PL more exclusive and less accessible. Also, with two fewer teams, there would be even more money available to the remaining 18 sides, I don't think anything is really being given away to the football league here, to suggest it is, frankly is ridiculous.

I have the benefit of supporting a side that isn't always in the PL, often it's not. And that's fine with me. It's not the be all and end all, that's for sure. The joy of a promotion winning season is better than the reality of being in the top flight, but if you take away the hope that comes with promotion, what's left? Football needs hope, that's what fans thrive on, this proposal takes away hope for a lot of football league clubs as the bridge between the PL and everyone else widens.

Agreed, although I'm not dead against the 16th prem side entering the play offs, as can see both sides on that one. I get your point about them having had the extra money, but they are probably low on confidence for how many beatings they have taken in that season.

I think the league cup should stay, as also a good competition for kids to show their mettle in coming through, maybe just tweak it by having a single semi game instead of 2.

If they are trying to lessen the number of games, get rid of friendly internationals, that should get rid of 4-6 games a season.

 

[Canary_Yellow]

Agreed, although I'm not dead against the 16th prem side entering the play offs, as can see both sides on that one. I get your point about them having had the extra money, but they are probably low on confidence for how many beatings they have taken in that season.

I think the league cup should stay, as also a good competition for kids to show their mettle in coming through, maybe just tweak it by having a single semi game instead of 2.

If they are trying to lessen the number of games, get rid of friendly internationals, that should get rid of 4-6 games a season.

I hear what you're saying, but the playoffs are great entertainment already, what does this add other than giving a PL side another bite of the cherry in terms of avoiding losing the benefit of the PL gravy train?

I see this as a good thing only for the teams that are worried they might finish 16th. It makes the PL less accessible than it currently is for championship sides.

 

[clubchamp98]

I hear what you're saying, but the playoffs are great entertainment already, what does this add other than giving a PL side another bite of the cherry in terms of avoiding losing the benefit of the PL gravy train?

I see this as a good thing only for the teams that are worried they might finish 16th. It makes the PL less accessible than it currently is for championship sides.

Playoffs are a con.
The league position doesn't lie so why playoffs ?
A team could be 20pts ahead of nearest rival yet 2 bad games and they stay where they are.
Just go 3 up 3 down ..

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Less league or cup games allows the big boys to fit in more long haul tours, show games abroad etc. I doubt very few will use the time to rest.

 

[Canary_Yellow]

Playoffs are a con.
The league position doesn't lie so why playoffs ?
A team could be 20pts ahead of nearest rival yet 2 bad games and they stay where they are.
Just go 3 up 3 down ..

Personally, I think the playoffs are great. Teams all the way down to mid table still have something to play for right through to the end of the season, and the matches are great entertainment.

I think the statistics show that teams finishing third have the best record in the playoffs, but yes, they are the ones that lose out under the current system.

 

[Liverbirdie]

I hear what you're saying, but the playoffs are great entertainment already, what does this add other than giving a PL side another bite of the cherry in terms of avoiding losing the benefit of the PL gravy train?

I see this as a good thing only for the teams that are worried they might finish 16th. It makes the PL less accessible than it currently is for championship sides.

As I said, I'm not passionate in my argument for this, but it goes back to the "everyone knows what they have to do at the beginning of the season" - if you finish 3rd you arent definitely going up, same with if you finish 16th.

I would agree that the Championship clubs should get some advantage, if there can be one, but cant see one under the present system.

Maybe if the "final" was played as a one off, the Championship team have home advantage. Either that or if it ends in a draw at Wembley after 90 minutes the Championship side goes up. Its up to the PL team to beat them.That could be fun.

 

[Liverbirdie]

Playoffs are a con.
The league position doesn't lie so why playoffs ?
A team could be 20pts ahead of nearest rival yet 2 bad games and they stay where they are.
Just go 3 up 3 down ..

I agree with them, and as said before, if you dont finish in the top 2, you know the score at the beginning of the season.

I think it makes the league more exciting through to the death more often. With 6 games to go, on average relegation is between 4-6 teams, promotion (if to 3 automatic places" the same, which in a 24 team league can mean that half have sod all to play for for the last 6-10 games. With the play offs you can have more like 3/4 of the teams with something to play for with 6 games still to go - on average.

 

[Canary_Yellow]

As I said, I'm not passionate in my argument for this, but it goes back to the "everyone knows what they have to do at the beginning of the season" - if you finish 3rd you arent definitely going up, same with if you finish 16th.

I would agree that the Championship clubs should get some advantage, if there can be one, but cant see one under the present system.

Maybe if the "final" was played as a one off, the Championship team have home advantage. Either that or if it ends in a draw at Wembley after 90 minutes the Championship side goes up. That could be fun.

I've highlighted the bit that I think should be adhered to, if you finish bottom three in the PL, you're getting relegated and three teams are coming up in your place. Getting out of the championship is hard enough as it is, why make it harder?

It only benefits existing PL sides that already have a big advantage. I agree it could be fun to watch, but the playoffs already are great. They've delivered some magic moments; Man City v Gillingham (not Championship, admittedly), Watford v Leicester, one of the best games I remember watching as a kid was Reading v Bolton! If it aint broke, don't fix it!

 

[clubchamp98]

I agree with them, and as said before, if you dont finish in the top 2, you know the score at the beginning of the season.

I think it makes the league more exciting through to the death more often. With 6 games to go, on average relegation is between 4-6 teams, promotion (if to 3 automatic places" the same, which in a 24 team league can mean that half have sod all to play for for the last 6-10 games. With the play offs you can have more like 3/4 of the teams with something to play for with 6 games still to go - on average.

It’s that true of any league system though?
I just can’t see why a team finishing well above another all season has to play them again in what is basically a cup tie.
Why not use a FedEx cup system ?
So any team four or more points ahead get a goal start.
So if your 8 points ahead you are 2-0 up before the kick off.
At least that gives them some advantage for their league form.

 

[Liverbirdie]

It’s that true of any league system though?
I just can’t see why a team finishing well above another all season has to play them again in what is basically a cup tie.
Why not use a FedEx cup system ?
So any team four or more points ahead get a goal start.
So if your 8 points ahead you are 2-0 up before the kick off.
At least that gives them some advantage for their league form.

Yes, at one extreme, and at the other one may finish above the other on goals scored only.

The prem has the europa to fight for if you dont get top 4, otherwise there are a lot more matches with sod all on them, which to me is the bigger no-no.

 

[Canary_Yellow]

It’s that true of any league system though?
I just can’t see why a team finishing well above another all season has to play them again in what is basically a cup tie.
Why not use a FedEx cup system ?
So any team four or more points ahead get a goal start.
So if your 8 points ahead you are 2-0 up before the kick off.
At least that gives them some advantage for their league form.

At the start of the season, no club knows where they will finish in the league. I haven't checked, but I'd be amazed if clubs finishing third that have missed out haven't benefited from finishing 4th, 5th and 6th and having a crack at going up in other seasons.

I don't think any championship team would want to change the system because it's an opportunity more than it's a risk.

 

[clubchamp98]

At the start of the season, no club knows where they will finish in the league. I haven't checked, but I'd be amazed if clubs finishing third that have missed out haven't benefited from finishing 4th, 5th and 6th and having a crack at going up in other seasons.

I don't think any championship team would want to change the system because it's an opportunity more than it's a risk.

Yes I see your reason.
But I just don’t think a team that finishes well above another in a league should have to play in a cup tie to settle something that you had all year to sort out.
A bit of loss of form late on costs the better team promotion.
Just my opinion ,dosnt affect me but the supporters of those teams can’t be happy.

 

[Canary_Yellow]

Yes I see your reason.
But I just don’t think a team that finishes well above another in a league should have to play in a cup tie to settle something that you had all year to sort out.
A bit of loss of form late on costs the better team promotion.
Just my opinion ,dosnt affect me but the supporters of those teams can’t be happy.

I agree, it's a bitter pill to swallow. I think the team finishing 3rd goes up around 40% of the time though.

 

[clubchamp98]

I agree, it's a bitter pill to swallow. I think the team finishing 3rd goes up around 40% of the time though.

60/40 not great odds
So the team finishing third dosnt go up 60% of the time.
That’s not how a league works imo.

 

[Canary_Yellow]

60/40 not great odds
So the team finishing third dosnt go up 60% of the time.
That’s not how a league works imo.

Which club specifically do you see as being the big loser of the playoff system?

What I'm getting at is, other than a point of principle in relation to how a league works, which is a valid point of principle, which clubs would actually want the system removed?

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Why should PL teams dictate how teams in the Championship are promoted.

If this change was being led by Championship teams then fair enough, it’s not, it’s PL protecting 16th.

 

[clubchamp98]

Which club specifically do you see as being the big loser of the playoff system?

What I'm getting at is, other than a point of principle in relation to how a league works, which is a valid point of principle, which clubs would actually want the system removed?

Any team that finishes with more points but dosnt get promoted I would say.
As I said it dosnt really effect me .
I do remember Leeds fans were not happy last year or maybe the year before. But ok now!
The teams in the top half of the league are probably happy.
But just can’t get my head around how it’s fair to finish miles ahead of a team that gets promoted and you don’t because of a playoff.
My idea of a playoff is when you have tied and need a decider!
They have 40 games approx to sort it out over the season.
Is it a big money maker ,it must be?

 

[clubchamp98]

Why should PL teams dictate how teams in the Championship are promoted.

If this change was being led by Championship teams then fair enough, it’s not, it’s PL protecting 16th.

Might have something to do with the money they are putting in.
It’s being led by lower teams asking for help.
But strings are attached.