The Footie Thread

[fundy]

It has been debated at great length that Southgate probably lacks the tactical nous to get the best out of the talent England currently have, but what frustrates me is that he can't seem to sort the defence out either, admittedly there isn't the same quality of player available in defence but England seem to give up so many 'soft' goals!

I don't doubt for one second that he has brought about a complete change in attitude and team spirit within all his squads, he is excellent when addressing the media, he just lacks that extra quality that the truly great managers have.

see if France will let us use Sailba, Deschamps still not a fan of anyone linked to Arsenal lol

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Tonali at Newcastle has been charged by the English FA for betting now, for the period he was at Newcastle and before the Italian charge was made .

Would that get added onto the Italian suspension, if found guilty, or would it deemed to have been served?

What a mess.

 

[4LEX]

Probably looking at another lengthy ban.

I do have a big issue with football whoring itself out to betting companies, encouraging gambling and then punishing people for the problems the've created. On the other hand, players betting on football with the inside knowledge, friends at other clubs etc is so dodgy.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Probably looking at another lengthy ban.

I do have a big issue with football whoring itself out to betting companies, encouraging gambling and then punishing people for the problems the've created. On the other hand, players betting on football with the inside knowledge, friends at other clubs etc is so dodgy.

I think that is the key issue for me, regarding recent bans. I totally agree with your first part and I can see it going the same way as smoking sponsorship shortly. For those players with issues, bet on something else, stay clear of football.

 

[4LEX]

I think that is the key issue for me, regarding recent bans. I totally agree with your first part and I can see it going the same way as smoking sponsorship shortly. For those players with issues, bet on something else, stay clear of football.

They must be crazy to bet on football when they know the punishment is going to be nearly a whole season out of action.

I was listening to a podcast a while back and Matt Le Tissier was openly admitting spread betting was common back in the 90's. He himself got involved in a bet on what minute the first throw in would be and he tried to put the ball of play direct from the kick off, only to underhit it

Newcastle must be gutted about this news after investing so much in Tonali and he was looking like a proper player too.

 

[Tashyboy]

They must be crazy to bet on football when they know the punishment is going to be nearly a whole season out of action.

I was listening to a podcast a while back and Matt Le Tissier was openly admitting spread betting was common back in the 90's. He himself got involved in a bet on what minute the first throw in would be and he tried to put the ball of play direct from the kick off, only to underhit it

Newcastle must be gutted about this news after investing so much in Tonali and he was looking like a proper player too.

There was a story going around about how Peter Shilton owed money to bookies and was in a mess in the cha going room. Cloughie heard about it and gave the money to Shilton. Shilton had a man of the match performance. After the game Shilton thanked Cloughie. Cloughie said “ don’t worry it’s coming out of next weeks wages”.
Now the way it was told it was funny. But is it. Footballer have gambled since Jesus was in nappies and now it a massive problem not helped in any way by football that takes money from gambling companies.
Even now Harry Redknapp gets paid to advertise betting.

 

[nickjdavis]

Probably looking at another lengthy ban.

In which case they might as well take out a billboard ad by the M25 explaining their intention to destroy a footballers career.

Having served an 8 month ban, any further ban imposed will be purely spiteful, unless it is either nominal in length or "suspended".

Yes he's done wrong. But surely if he's been working to rehabilitate himself over the last few months then handing him a further ban can only have a detrimental effect on his mental wellbeing.

 

[Bunkermagnet]

In which case they might as well take out a billboard ad by the M25 explaining their intention to destroy a footballers career.

Having served an 8 month ban, any further ban imposed will be purely spiteful, unless it is either nominal in length or "suspended".

Yes he's done wrong. But surely if he's been working to rehabilitate himself over the last few months then handing him a further ban can only have a detrimental effect on his mental wellbeing.

By your direction of thought, a drink driver who is convicted and then gets caught again after serving a ban should be let off having "served his punishment"?

 

[nickjdavis]

By your direction of thought, a drink driver who is convicted and then gets caught again after serving a ban should be let off having "served his punishment"?

Utter claptrap.

Drink driving is a crime that is socially offensive.

Having a gambling addiction is utterly different. I cant believe you drew a comparison between the two.

 

[Bunkermagnet]

Utter claptrap.

Drink driving is a crime that is socially offensive.

Having a gambling addiction is utterly different. I cant believe you drew a comparison between the two.

Both are again the rules

 

[Pin-seeker]

Probably looking at another lengthy ban.

I do have a big issue with football whoring itself out to betting companies, encouraging gambling and then punishing people for the problems the've created. On the other hand, players betting on football with the inside knowledge, friends at other clubs etc is so dodgy.

Gambling isn’t the problem tho.
He could bet on anything else,but not football

 

[Pin-seeker]

Couldn’t Newcastle sue him & terminate his contract?
Pretty sure Chelsea did that with Mitu after he tested positive for cocaine.

 

[HampshireHog]

In which case they might as well take out a billboard ad by the M25 explaining their intention to destroy a footballers career.

Having served an 8 month ban, any further ban imposed will be purely spiteful, unless it is either nominal in length or "suspended".

Yes he's done wrong. But surely if he's been working to rehabilitate himself over the last few months then handing him a further ban can only have a detrimental effect on his mental wellbeing.

Surely, a longer ban is in order. He is a serial offender, and he knew the risks, if his career is destroyed it is down to him and him alone.

To suggest a further ban should be reduced or suspended creates a precedent for appeal for all subsequent offenders which is not IMO beneficial to the game.

 

[Swango1980]

Just heard that Alonso is looking to stay at Leverkusen next year.

Seems like Man Utd will be getting some stiff competition trying to get Southgate next season, with Liverpool now in the hunt

 

[Tashyboy]

Just heard that Alonso is looking to stay at Leverkusen next year.

Seems like Man Utd will be getting some stiff competition trying to get Southgate next season, with Liverpool now in the hunt

That is what I asked for Xmas. liverpool and Utd going head to head for Southgate.

Shame he don’t have a twin.

 

[Reemul]

Surely, a longer ban is in order. He is a serial offender, and he knew the risks, if his career is destroyed it is down to him and him alone.

To suggest a further ban should be reduced or suspended creates a precedent for appeal for all subsequent offenders which is not IMO beneficial to the game.

I think he is a gambling addict and needs support now we know he has an issue. Now if he gambles again that's a different issue but I think trying to help him now is the best option for all. Currently no one has got hurt.

 

[nickjdavis]

Surely, a longer ban is in order. He is a serial offender, and he knew the risks, if his career is destroyed it is down to him and him alone.

To suggest a further ban should be reduced or suspended creates a precedent for appeal for all subsequent offenders which is not IMO beneficial to the game.

Aren't all compulsive gamblers serial offenders by definition?

The dates being investigated by the FA run up to the 12th October. This is the date that the Italian authorities STARTED their initial questioning of Tonali, so it isn't as though the FA believe (or, at least, they don't have evidence to support the notion) that he continued to gamble after the initial Italian questioning commenced.

So effectively one could view this as one continuous offence that has happened across two footballing jurisdictions. The Italian ban (as it is a worldwide ban) has effectively prevented Tonali playing in the English game. The FA ban would only cover the English game and to further ban him again is almost like punishing him for the same "crime".

Now....if the Italian ban had only extended to the Italian game and National team and he had been playing for his club in England, then yes I'd agree that a ban covering the English game would be appropriate.

If it turns out that he has been betting on matches involving Newcastle though...well...all bets are off (pardon the pun) regarding what his punishment might be and I could see him easily being banned for an additional period.

 

[PaulMdj]

Aren't all compulsive gamblers serial offenders by definition?

The dates being investigated by the FA run up to the 12th October. This is the date that the Italian authorities STARTED their initial questioning of Tonali, so it isn't as though the FA believe (or, at least, they don't have evidence to support the notion) that he continued to gamble after the initial Italian questioning commenced.

So effectively one could view this as one continuous offence that has happened across two footballing jurisdictions. The Italian ban (as it is a worldwide ban) has effectively prevented Tonali playing in the English game. The FA ban would only cover the English game and to further ban him again is almost like punishing him for the same "crime".

Now....if the Italian ban had only extended to the Italian game and National team and he had been playing for his club in England, then yes I'd agree that a ban covering the English game would be appropriate.

If it turns out that he has been betting on matches involving Newcastle though...well...all bets are off (pardon the pun) regarding what his punishment might be and I could see him easily being banned for an additional period.

Re the bit in bold:
He was the highest profile person caught up in a long betting scandal that rocked Italian Football last year, the Italians had evidence he continued to bet after Newcastle signed him, but could only charge him with offences when he was registered with the Italian FA.

It’s likely they have given the evidence for the period he was signed by Newcastle up to 12th Oct to the FA.

Once again it shows the ineptness of the FA taking an easy decision!

If he’s had a bet during his ban, fair enough, but these charges are prior to this and imo is the FA simply trying to look tough.

 

[HampshireHog]

I think he is a gambling addict and needs support now we know he has an issue. Now if he gambles again that's a different issue but I think trying to help him now is the best option for all. Currently no one has got hurt.

Maybe he is an addict, maybe he’s just corrupt. 100% agree he should get all the support he needs to beat an addiction. But he needs to serve a punishment for his crime.

It’s pretty naive to suggest no-one has got hurt, any market manipulation sports or financial creates losers (and winners), and skews integrity of the sport. If the sport has no integrity the market, and sporting interest will drop.

Without going into hypotheticals his actions could have affected more than just the number of cards in a match that is currently doing the rounds.

 

[HampshireHog]

Aren't all compulsive gamblers serial offenders by definition?

The dates being investigated by the FA run up to the 12th October. This is the date that the Italian authorities STARTED their initial questioning of Tonali, so it isn't as though the FA believe (or, at least, they don't have evidence to support the notion) that he continued to gamble after the initial Italian questioning commenced.

So effectively one could view this as one continuous offence that has happened across two footballing jurisdictions. The Italian ban (as it is a worldwide ban) has effectively prevented Tonali playing in the English game. The FA ban would only cover the English game and to further ban him again is almost like punishing him for the same "crime".

Now....if the Italian ban had only extended to the Italian game and National team and he had been playing for his club in England, then yes I'd agree that a ban covering the English game would be appropriate.

If it turns out that he has been betting on matches involving Newcastle though...well...all bets are off (pardon the pun) regarding what his punishment might be and I could see him easily being banned for an additional period.

I’m not sure I follow one offence. If he had repeatedly shoplifted in Italy that would be considered multiple offences, if this came to light that he had then committed the same crime latterly in the UK, would you expect one punishment to cover both regions?

So to turn it around if Ivan Toney, had served his UK ban playing in Serie A, you’d have felt it just?

I am sympathetic to Newcastle that they have endured his punishment, but it was their choice to do so. If there faith in him was misplaced that’s on them.