The Footie Thread

[Bunkermagnet]

OMG, shouldnt the direction of dislike be directed at the UTD players who missed the pens, sitters in open play and were just plain rubbish?
Stop trying to find an excuse for their loss, it was down to the players and them only. Everything else is just marginal. The players didn't want it and proved it.

 

[Canary_Yellow]

Were you premier League at the time?

Yes. That is a pre-requisite of the statistic ?

 

[Slime]

Stop trying to find an excuse for their loss, it was down to the players and them only. Everything else is just marginal. The players didn't want it and proved it.

 

[PJ87]

Yes. That is a pre-requisite of the statistic ?

Doesn't count then ?
Football began in 1992 lol

 

[Canary_Yellow]

Doesn't count then ?
Football began in 1992 lol

It was 2013, really awful performance, playing grim football under Hughton

Luton deserved to win, at Carrow road too ?‍

 

[PJ87]

It was 2013, really awful performance, playing grim football under Hughton

Luton deserved to win, at Carrow road too ?‍

Wonder what the BBC were on about then as apparently happened in 1989 aswell

Maybe the highest ranked club?

 

[Canary_Yellow]

Wonder what the BBC were on about then as apparently happened in 1989 aswell

Maybe the highest ranked club?

Was it 6th tier rather than non-league? Kidderminster are one below conference

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Harvey Elliott - ???? what a player he is going to be

 

[Billysboots]

Many probably won’t like this, because it hands decision making back to referees (remember those days?), but for me we can’t simply rely on a black and white list of rules because football, much like life, isn’t black and white.

The solution to the ridiculous handball conundrum is not that difficult, but will upset those who like everything to be written down and with a formal framework. Quite simply, if it is more likely than not that a ball striking hand, deliberate or otherwise, made a material difference to the immediate outcome, then it is handball.

My point since Friday evening has been that the current ruling is too rigid, does not allow for any common sense to be applied, and leads to the farcical situation at Old Trafford. Try to set to one side the team(s) involved, the fact that United missed half a dozen gilt edged chances and so on, and think about the rule. The rule is a joke, and should not allow for a player to immediately pass to a team mate for that team mate to score a legitimate goal, if a handball would have been given had the offending player actually scored the goal himself. That sort of rule is so embarrassingly laughable it has no place in any sport.

 

[Swango1980]

That's what they currently do!!
As it happens, I too believe such incidents should be made a breach, But that would require a rule amendment! Referees must make rulings according to facts and the current rules, not through some sort of invented justification. It's up to a different area of the game to consider whether rule changes are required. Don't blame Refs for applying currently!

That's your opinion. Lobby the appropriate authorities for a rule change, but don't complain about the correct application of existing ones!

See my comment immediately above!
I'm pretty certain, with no actual evidence, that that clause was added because of a previous incident. I've suggested another (any time it strikes a hand in the opponent's Penalty Area is handball) that would cover the one under discussion.

Just don't lambast Refs for applying existing rules correctly!

I wasn't lambasting refs. You misinterpreted my post, or I worded it poorly? I understand why the ref on pitch didn't give it (he maybe didn't even see it or wasn't sure). I understand VAR can't intervene. Because VAR becomes impotent in such a situation due to way law is written.

My annoyance is with the law itself.

Up to and including the point at which ball hit his hand, had that player scored it is a handball. If he passes to his mate, it is not a handball.

That is crazy. How can the rules decide on whether a handball is a handball based on what happens afterwards?

 

[Swango1980]

OMG, shouldnt the direction of dislike be directed at the UTD players who missed the pens, sitters in open play and were just plain rubbish?
Stop trying to find an excuse for their loss, it was down to the players and them only. Everything else is just marginal. The players didn't want it and proved it.

Not sure anyone is making excuses for the United players. They should have won easily, and they didn't. That's on them. The manager said it, the pundits said it and most of the United fans I have heard have said it.

That doesn't mean you can't criticise a farcical incident if they occur.

 

[PJ87]

Was it 6th tier rather than non-league? Kidderminster are one below conference

Maybe it was! Either way what a record to hold lol always next year lol

 

[davemc1]

Fa Cup 5th round, what’s this? ?
Is there even a tie of the round? ?

Thought Kelleher got lucky, and hope Diaz is ok, but other than that a near perfect day for us

 

[chrisd]

Many probably won’t like this, because it hands decision making back to referees (remember those days?), but for me we can’t simply rely on a black and white list of rules because football, much like life, isn’t black and white.

The solution to the ridiculous handball conundrum is not that difficult, but will upset those who like everything to be written down and with a formal framework. Quite simply, if it is more likely than not that a ball striking hand, deliberate or otherwise, made a material difference to the immediate outcome, then it is handball.

My point since Friday evening has been that the current ruling is too rigid, does not allow for any common sense to be applied, and leads to the farcical situation at Old Trafford. Try to set to one side the team(s) involved, the fact that United missed half a dozen gilt edged chances and so on, and think about the rule. The rule is a joke, and should not allow for a player to immediately pass to a team mate for that team mate to score a legitimate goal, if a handball would have been given had the offending player actually scored the goal himself. That sort of rule is so embarrassingly laughable it has no place in any sport.

Spot on.

 

[fundy]

Fa Cup 5th round, what’s this? ?
Is there even a tie of the round? ?

Thought Kelleher got lucky, and hope Diaz is ok, but other than that a near perfect day for us

all 6 non prem sides kept apart in 8 games, no local derbies, nothing

almost like you could name the quarter finalists now

 

[davemc1]

Also, why did we ko at 12 when there isn’t another game till 4?

 

[Foxholer]

I wasn't lambasting refs. You misinterpreted my post, or I worded it poorly? I understand why the ref on pitch didn't give it (he maybe didn't even see it or wasn't sure). I understand VAR can't intervene. Because VAR becomes impotent in such a situation due to way law is written.
...

1. I didn't suggest you did lambast refs! I would have used 'stop lambasting...' if I thought you had. Just don't do it when they are following the rules!
2. I believe you worded it fine and I interpreted it fine too. It does seem a it daft, but 'them's the rules' and Refs must apply them.
3. VAR can 'intervene' (though that may not be the correct word) - that's part of its role! It's NOT impotent, but like the Ref, it has to follow the rules!
[/QUOTE]

...
My annoyance is with the law itself.

No problem with that

...
Up to and including the point at which ball hit his hand, had that player scored it is a handball. If he passes to his mate, it is not a handball.

That is crazy. How can the rules decide on whether a handball is a handball based on what happens afterwards?

Ignoring the timing gobbldygook, I suspect the rulemakers deemed passing to a mate to be a different phase of play, so incident over. That's as opposed to 'eliminating' the possibility of deliberate handball before scoring.
I do wonder what the ruling would have been had the 'mate' passed the ball back to the player, who scored!

 

[babylonsinger]

Maybe it was! Either way what a record to hold lol always next year lol

I thought the commentary made the point that West Ham had never lost to a non league side?

 

[babylonsinger]

Right result at Anfield but can't help but think had our keeper tackled Jota etc like that he'd have been sent off. Pen appeal far less clear cut but I suspect it would be given as a foul elsewhere on the field. Just glad there were no injuries ahead of a big game for us midweek

 

[Hobbit]

Many probably won’t like this, because it hands decision making back to referees (remember those days?), but for me we can’t simply rely on a black and white list of rules because football, much like life, isn’t black and white.

The solution to the ridiculous handball conundrum is not that difficult, but will upset those who like everything to be written down and with a formal framework. Quite simply, if it is more likely than not that a ball striking hand, deliberate or otherwise, made a material difference to the immediate outcome, then it is handball.

My point since Friday evening has been that the current ruling is too rigid, does not allow for any common sense to be applied, and leads to the farcical situation at Old Trafford. Try to set to one side the team(s) involved, the fact that United missed half a dozen gilt edged chances and so on, and think about the rule. The rule is a joke, and should not allow for a player to immediately pass to a team mate for that team mate to score a legitimate goal, if a handball would have been given had the offending player actually scored the goal himself. That sort of rule is so embarrassingly laughable it has no place in any sport.

Its your opinion it was a farcical situation on Friday night, and that’s the point I’ve been trying to get across. The ref, VAR etc believe they got it right. The ball didn’t rebound up at speed into his forearm. In my opinion it made little difference in terms of control. I do think the rule is farcical but it’s application on Friday night was correct. It was a ‘good’ goal under the current rule, as stupid as the rule is.

Handball can be definitive, and if it isn’t you get situations like Friday night. If you make it a subjective decision you get bleating every time it becomes a contentious, subjective decision. How many times do we get a couple of days of bleating on here after a weekend? Almost every week.

Anyway, the Boro have got Spurs in the next round. UTB.